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Still don't feel I know enough about ocd to overcome it


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Everyone says that you need to have a basic understanding of ocd to overcome it, but because my mind twists and confuses anything I see or hear about ocd I just don't feel I'm ever at a point where I understand it. I don't get whether off obsessions can be real or not, I don't get what defines an ocd obsession. Some ppl say it's irrelevant whether the obsession is true or false and I don't get why it's irrelevant, some ppl say u should tackle the ocd by telling yourself that u have done what u fear you've done, but that 'you can't just say it. You have to really mean it'. Why?! Isn't that dangerous? 

I'm sometimes told the the obsessions are not real but as example, for the person who worries about touching a toilet seat because of germs, surely there are germs on there (it's just that it's not likely to cause harm). But them having the obsession 'there's germs on that toilet seat' isn't exactly wrong. 

I'm not trying to be like 'see, ocd is something to worry about'. I believe it's nowhere near as bad as we sufferers think it is but I need to help myself to get better and I just can't when I can't seem to understand ocd and question what everything means etc. I know that to get better I need to understand ocd better :-( 

 

 

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I completely understand that it's become an obsession in itself. But how do I take things at face value? 

Why do ppl say it's irrelevant whether the thoughts are real? And that u have to tell yourself you've done bad and really mean it? 

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At the risk of completely indulging your compulsive overthinking about this, I'm just going to recommend the Mark Freeman YouTube clips. In particular he does one on the futility of trying to work out what are 'real' thoughts and what are 'OCD' thoughts. 

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Is it right that ocd thoughts are not real and when they say 'take a risk. Maybe the thoughts are real. Maybe they're not', they mean 'maybe it's ocd, maybe it's not'. They don't mean 'maybe the ocd thought is real, maybe it's not' do they?? 

I've even had someone say 'Maybe the ocd thought is real, maybe it isn't'. This would suggest that ocd thoughts can be real. Help 

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That's because thoughts are thoughts - there are no 'OCD' thoughts versus 'real' thoughts. But there are disordered responses to thoughts. You need to figure out how to respond to your thoughts in a non-OCD way. If you think 'what if someone misinterpreted what I just said?' - that is a real thought. It doesn't mean that the person did or didn't misinterpret what you said. The non-OCD response would be 'maybe they did, maybe they didnt', followed by getting on with your day, and dealing with any fallout when it actually happens and becomes a reality. The OCD response would be hours spent ruminating about whether they did or they didn't, what the implications would be if they did think that, leading to prolonged feelings of guilt, more what ifs and catastrophising.

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Ok, I think I understand that. But how important is it that I fully understand ocd to get better? Obviously understanding ocd has become a big obsession in itself for me and I'll never feel like I fully understand. How much do I need to understand to get myself better? Do I have to completely understand it? 

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Do you understand that:

1) Doing compulsions makes us feel better in the short term. 

2) Compulsions come in all shapes and sizes.

3) Ruminating is a compulsion.

4) Compulsions may make us feel better for a few seconds, or a minute, or maybe a bit longer. But in the end, they keep the thought stuck and end up making us feel worse.

5) Recovery will involve, amongst other things, stopping your compulsions.

6) Stopping your compulsions will make you feel worse in the short term. You will get triggered, your anxiety will rise, and you will be stopping yourself from feeling better.

7) Stopping your compulsions will eventually make you feel better - much better than you ever did before. 

8) Stopping your compulsions is hard, but it really does work.

 

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I do understand that, yes.

do u think that me worrying whether ocd thoughts can be real or not is an obsession in itself?

was your point earlier that thoughts are just thoughts. They can be real or false. They are barely ever/never real in ocd but of course they can be, u just have to accept the uncertainty and take the risk. But the thought itself does not suggest they are real. That's why saying 'maybe the ocd thought is real, maybe it's not' is a valid point. Because it's just a thought. Of course they can and cannot be real. They are not 'ocd thoughts'.everyone has these thoughts. It becomes ocd when u obsess and attach false meanings (meaning being that they are true and bad). 

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43 minutes ago, Franklin12 said:

1) Doing compulsions makes us feel better in the short term. 

2) Compulsions come in all shapes and sizes.

3) Ruminating is a compulsion.

4) Compulsions may make us feel better for a few seconds, or a minute, or maybe a bit longer. But in the end, they keep the thought stuck and end up making us feel worse.

5) Recovery will involve, amongst other things, stopping your compulsions.

6) Stopping your compulsions will make you feel worse in the short term. You will get triggered, your anxiety will rise, and you will be stopping yourself from feeling better.

7) Stopping your compulsions will eventually make you feel better - much better than you ever did before. 

8) Stopping your compulsions is hard, but it really does work.

This is a great list. I need it up where I can see it every day!

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I don't think it matters much whether you label things obsessions or otherwise. The real question is, is thinking about whether or not you fully understand OCD stopping you from actually rolling your sleeves up and getting on with the hard work of recovery? It seems as though you have a good grasp now of the basics. In my experience, I got kind of hung up on the causes of OCD, the physiology, the genetics, etc etc, but as interesting as all that was, it never did me any good. The single most important thing that I ever learned was that ruminating is a very damaging compulsion and that I needed to stop. That's 2 things, but you get the point. It's really very simple. Not easy, as Polar Bear says, but simple.

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Ok so I guess you only need to understand the fundamental basics and my acting in an unhelpful way by trying to make sense of every little thing the books and videos are saying? I should accept uncertainty and move on rather than seeking reassurance in books and things ?

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Thank you so much. Also, one last thing. What would by ERP be? I don't think just because I have a thought it means it's true. It's just the thoughts tend to feel like memories and I want to check them out in case they are true. My biggest fear is whether I'll say bad about my dad.

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Just now, megz150 said:

What would by ERP be?  My biggest fear is whether I'll say bad about my dad.

To say something bad about your dad, write something down about your dad that is bad and look at it hourly for a few days.  I think that may be two examples of an OCD exposure exercise for that fear.  But like I always say, ERP on its own is pointless if we don't look at our underlying fear and worries and thought processes.

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I get the impression that it's a case of you not wanting to accidentally get your dad in trouble/falsely accused of something by people interpreting something you have said in the wrong way. So you are responsible for essentially 'harming' your dad (i.e. his reputation). That is your fear. Not just thinking bad things about him. You would then feel horribly guilty, it would all be your fault etc. So if you were to do a written exposure it would be about the consequences of people misinterpreting what you have said, in all its horror. And also agree re. working on the cognitive side too. Learning to cope with your own negative emotions e.g. guilt is easier than trying to control everyone else around you so that you need not experience those emotions.

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Ok thank you.

i also just have ONE more question, I'm sorry. Do the thoughts refer to the 'obsession' AND the false meaning? It's always said that the thoughts are false and irrational. But an example of one thought I was given was someone thinking 'it's Friday 13th tomorrow'. That's not a false or irrational thought is it? But the meaning a sufferer attaches is: 'something bad is going to happen'. 

Sane with an image of your child dying. The image is not false itself- it's an image u do have. But the meaning u attach is false: 'this image is a premonition'.

So..??

 

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But having the intrusive thought 'it's Friday 13th tomorrow' is intrusive and obsessional because the sufferer has attached the meaning that something bad will happen. So in this case it's the meaning that's false, not the thought (that's it's Friday 13th).

the person that gets a thought that there are germs around. That's not false. There's are germs around its just they're very unlikely to cause any harm. Again, it seems that the meaning is false, not the thought. Unless it is that there aren't necessarily germs at all. I don't really know what the deal is with germs to be honest. 

im so, so confused :-( I just can't make head nor tail of anything. Everything seems to be contradictory and I'm scared because while it feels that way I know I can't get better!!! :-( 

when they say the thoughts are false and irrational- please tell me, does it refer to the meaning attached to the thought or the thought themselves? Or both?

Maybe it's as simple as 'together the thoughts and meanings attached are ******** with little or no basis in reality'.

im not obsessing about germs now, I'm just trying to understand. Is it that there are/ may well be germs but they don't cause harm majority of the time (therefore the meaning attached is false) or is it that very likely there are no germs (therefore the thought- and the meaning attached are false). Or/and when talking about the thoughts being false does that generally include the idea of the meaning u attach as well as just the initial thought? 

Please, please, please help with this. I'm struggling so much trying to understand. I feel so low. 

 

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