Still don't feel I know enough about ocd to overcome it

[PolarBear]

I highly doubt that any explanation we give you is going to satisfy you. You'll just come up with a different way of looking at it and you'll be back to square one again. I'll try though.

There are germs everywhere. The risk from those germs is low.

In your case, amd what you should be concentrating on, is that you have intrusive thoughts that what you say implies something bad. The probability of that being true is low but OCD tells you the probability is very high. In fact it comes right out and tells you that you did something bad. You have to ignore those thoughts. They are junk. They are irrelevant. And you must work on not doing compulsions. That includes ruminating.

All that said, your initial obsessions are being combined with obsessions about recovery from OCD. You must not listen to those thoughts.

[megz150]

Ok so it seems then that the 'intrusive thought' refers to both the initial thought AND the meaning we attach. And so when it is said that the thoughts are false and meaningless, it not only refers to the initial thought but the meaning we attach as well? there is little or no basis in any of it so for germs, the thought is the combined thought and meaning- that they will catch germs and get really ill, make their kids really ill. But the thought is just junk because we all know there's germs everywhere, but it absolutely doesn't mean harm will come of it, right? I'm sat in the car right now. I'm sure there's plenty of germs around but it's just irrelevant because they don't tend to cause harm. They're just all around us and that's that. The reason the thoughts become distressing is because of the meanings we attach. The thoughts themselves are just random thoughts that pose no threat. There might be slight truth to it- ie there are germs, it is Friday 13th BUT they pose no threat. They are irrelevant thoughts, random junk. Is that correct? 

Do u believe you can get better without proper therapy?

as far as I understand it, ERP is about doing the thing you fear. I assume that doesn't mean I should say bad about my dad. Could you advise specific tasks I can do that will expose me to the thoughts and then I'll practice letting them go? 

Maybe I understand more than I think I do about ocd. If anyone picked apart words and phrases they'd get all confused wouldn't they? Maybe when reading on ocd I should have simply read. Without THINKING as such. And said to myself 'maybe u understand. Maybe u don't. Maybe you'll do it all wrong. Maybe u won't. Maybe you the book is telling you things are bad, maybe it's not. And then the more I have that attitude, the more likely it is that I will understand it better. Is that right? 

I really, really appreciate you responding to me. I need to work at helping myself. I can't just drown in ocd. 

[Franklin12]

I think you are stuck on trying to distinguish between true and false thoughts. Just because you worry about something doesn't mean that your fear will never come true. A book can not tell you that your fear will never come true. I think you should be thinking less in terms of true versus false, and more in terms of exaggeration. The response has become hugely exaggerated. In your example, the person fears germs. They think 'what if there are germs around, I may get contaminated and die'. This is a hugely exaggerated response to a tiny risk. Most people are taking this risk day in day out without thinking about it. But there is no book that can say that you, Megz, will never ever say anything that gets misinterpreted by anyone, so don't worry about it. The book can only say that the risk of that happening is being massively overblown, and that you are making yourself far more miserable worrying 24/7 about this than is worth the risk. 

[megz150]

Ok thank you. So what I'm getting from this is that combined, the initial thought and the meaning u attach is all one big exaggeration together. 

I'm a bit confused as to what my thought is and what the meaning attached is. I guess the thought is the doubt 'did I just say or imply bad about my dad?' But I'm not too sure what meaning I attach. Because I don't see having the thought as an indicator that iv done bad. Like I never think 'I had that thought so it must be real'. It's more that I get the thought and it feel real/like a memory. So maybe the meaning I attach is that it's a truthful memory?

 

[Franklin12]

I'm confused - I thought your fear was that you would say something about your dad that someone misinterprets as meaning something bad about him? Why are you looking to label things truths? Or meanings? You don't have to label everything you know. Just stop ruminating about whether or not someone has or hasn't misinterpreted what you have said.

[PolarBear]

You're way over thinking this Megz. You're thinking about this too much. 

OCD is simple. You get intrusive thoughts that cause distress and lead to compulsions. That's it.

Your intrusive thoughts are that you may have said something bad about your dad. That upsets you. In response you do compulsions, notably ruminating.

It's that simple.

[paradoxer]

If it helps at all (you refer to feelings), the way to beat OCD is to behave in a counter-intuitive way. Don't try to look for certainty when you're in the throes of an obsession. 

[megz150]

Ok thank you. I know- looking for truth, false, certainty is all ocd. 

Have I got this right... Often I think it's important to know WHY iv let go because I think 'what if it's something that can be let go of now, but if I say something like it again, I may need to clear it up because it might seem like an implication'. But I have to think 'let it go because it's most likely ocd if I'm feeling this anxious and needing certainty. Think about the present. Not the past or future. Deal with things as and when they occur. Don't preempt things. Also, trying to know why I'm letting go just takes me down the route of rumination and will do no good'. 

Also I get anxious about which part is the intrusive thought. Like is it that I've said nothing wrong or that I've said a little bit wrong etc. I assume I have to let it go because in some way or another it's clearly ocd and that generally means nothing is that bad and I'm exaggerating? 

[PolarBear]

As soon as you start ruminating, what came before was the intrusive thought.

You get intrusive thoughts that you've said something bad about your dad

 Full stop. As soon as you get a thought like that you need to leave it alone and not ruminate over it.

[megz150]

I'm going on holiday tomorrow and my ocd has gone mad.

i keep panicking, like 'can something be bad and real and still be ocd?' And I feel I should say 'maybe it can, maybe it can't' but then I feel like it's ok to be uncertain about the thoughts but not about understanding ocd.

also, getting so worked up as per usual about deciding when to let go. Part of me is like 'u have to just let go. As soon as it's about a fear and brings stupid amounts of anxiety then it's distorted, not bad like u think and can be let go. But then another part of me is like 'u don't even know what's bad and what isn't so you're not a good judge. You can't work out whether it doesn't matter what u say to your parents because they 'understand you have ocd', u can't work out whether it's bad if u say bad to test yourself, say something accidentally cos wasn't really listening etc'

Today iv been agonising over  a scenario. I wasn't sure whether I said something about dad and I couldn't decide whether even if I had, whether it would actually be bad or not. And I felt confused about whether I had actually said something or not. Then I panicked 'what if it's something that is fine to let go but if I said it again or said something like to again it might make it seem sinister? So it's important I know now what ive said so that I will recall it if I say something in future. Otherwise I might just forget and end up saying the same bad thing a few times so that it comes across as sinister; thinking I'd only said it once and it can be let go cos no one will think anything of it'. I think 'maybe when it's important to remember something I will simply remember exactly what I said or didn't say'. I just feel like things are out of control. I'm absolutely aware that my rumination Is bad for me and no one else does it but iv lost what it is like to be and think normally. 

I also keep Getting tearful and angry and this makes my ocd worse because I feel like I'm saying and implying bad. Dad squeezed past me earlier cos I was in his way by the kitchen table and it was so innocent and yet I frowned and looked at my mum as tho I was angry and upset and it's just because I don't want my ocd to kick off but part of me worries whether I do it cos I'm angry with him for touching me to squeeze past. But I have no reason to be cos he's so lovely and never done a thing wrong. I feel so horrible and out of control 

 

 

[PolarBear]

Keep working on controlling your ruminating. You don't need to know exactly what you've just said. Trying to figure it out is a compulsion.

[daveuk]

Ocd trying to do what it can to force u into thinking of things whitch can't hurt you and is not real. You are strong and you can face ocd dont let it control you.

[megz150]

 is it that You shouldn't be doing compulsions because it's all exaggerated and out of perspective so no amount of rumination etc is going to make me feel secure that things are ok? 

I just can't get the thought out of my head 'BUT letting go is taking the easy way out. U know you're saying things that are ok now but not if said again in future and therefore u need to be AWARE of what's been said etc'. I feel like I'm taking the easy way out to just think 'let go'. Isn't it important that I am aware of what's been said? And if not, why not? 

[megz150]

Can u remind me why compulsions are so bad and need to be stopped altogether? 

[PolarBear]

As usual you are way overthinking this. Compulsions keep you stuck.  It's that simple. No amount of thinking will bring you the clarity you seek. 

[megz150]

I know, but it's seems irresponsible to just simply let go of it all when it feels so strongly that things are bad?

[PolarBear]

It's OCD telling you things are bad. Don't listen to OCD.

Edited November 14, 2016 by PolarBear

[megz150]

I know compulsions keep u stuck but how so? 

[megz150]

More importantly, how do I 'deal' with my fears about whether I'm understanding things about ocd correctly, from books and Internet etc. What should my mindset be about this? 

[PolarBear]

Truth is, you are spending far too much time trying to figure out how you should handle your OCD than is necessary. You are fairly constantly coming back, asking one question after another, about what you should be doing when it comes to recovering from OCD. I think you are now stuck on the topic and I think it's safe to say your questions are compulsions that are not doing you any good. It's along the same lines as your previous theme. You had intrusive thoughts that you weren't understanding what you said or implied when you said something and now you are intrusive thoughts that you don't understand how to recover from OCD.

I suggest you take a break for a while and try to get your mind off the subject of recovering. Then after that break, get a good book on OCD, like Break Free from OCD, read it, try to understand it and ignore any intrusive thoughts that pop up.

[megz150]

Ok, I know. Maybe this holiday I need to totally ignore all and maybe I'll come home feeling a bit well rested and I can focus on getting better. 

I keep thinking 'to know whether to let go I have to ascertain whether I've done something or not and If so whether it's bad or not' but that is absolutely not what I should be doing is it? Is it a good enough rule to go by to think 'maybe it's all bad, maybe it's not. Thinking about what's true, false, good or bad keeps u tuned in to the ocd. Let go. Accept it might all be bad. But what if it's something I can let go now but for said again in future it might be really bad? Accept its a possibility. Move on'

is that right? How do you, personally, determine when to let go?

[PolarBear]

What's the sense of not letting go under any circumstances? What would be the point of fixating on anything to the detriment of healthy living?

[megz150]

PolarBear, can I please write on here later on? I had such a bad worry this morning and threw up. I have to try and calm down because I'm on holiday with parents and I need to show that I'm ok so I don't ruin things for them. I'm telling myself its ocd and nothing's that bad but please, please can I write something later and you respond? I promise to listen to what you tell me. I understand that no amount of rumination will make me feel better. Please 

[PolarBear]

I'm not going to stop you from posting, Megz. You're free to do so.

[changemynametosomething]

Can i just tell you something? i dont think this would help you at all, but maybe, just maybe a little.

you asked why you should stop doing compulsions, and here are some facts, laid right out for you:

your brain is a mechanism. it wants you to survive and that you are safe. therfore, you have a little part of your brain, called amygdala. when you have a thought, it will first uccure in the large part of the brain, and if the thought is imortant enough, it will be sent to amygdala. (the alarm system) the thought will go on in a circle and it will case you distress and it will be uncomferteble. even feel like hell.

everybodys brain works this way. people with ocd, our brain is kind of "damaged", a lot of information that shouldent be in amygdala, goes there anyways, the filter is broken. when you do compultions, you then stop these thougts and their circle, and you feel "good" again. safe. maybe not even good, when ocd is on its "worst", you just dont feel like hell anymore when doing compulsions.

the problem is that if you continue to do compulsions, you train your brain to get more information to amygdala. i know that when you feel like doing a compulsion, you may think: only this one. this last one. or: this compulsion is so important, its much more important than any other. 

its a lie, and its just your thoughs going in and out of amygdala.