Stressed

[PolarBear]

You have to be hard on yourself. When you get the thoughts, you have to stop yourself from going down the path of ruminating. Then you refocus your mind onto something else. I'll tell you, the first 29 or 30 times you do it, it won't work. You'll get frustrated. You'll slip back into ruminating. But you keep going and you keep stopping yourself and refocusing. Slowly but surely, it will start to work. You'll get better at it.

But first you have to give yourself permission to let it go. You have to give yourself permission to not punish yourself anymore.

[Gemzi3]

7 minutes ago, PolarBear said:

You have to be hard on yourself. When you get the thoughts, you have to stop yourself from going down the path of ruminating. Then you refocus your mind onto something else. I'll tell you, the first 29 or 30 times you do it, it won't work. You'll get frustrated. You'll slip back into ruminating. But you keep going and you keep stopping yourself and refocusing. Slowly but surely, it will start to work. You'll get better at it.

But first you have to give yourself permission to let it go. You have to give yourself permission to not punish yourself anymore.

Does therapy help or hinder this?

Because obviously when I go to appointments I need to talk about my thoughts.

I still have this urge to go through all the details, it's like I think I'll finally figure something out and feel better when I know I won't.

The other issue is accepting the thoughts, which makes me feel depressed about my life, how can I be a mum in the future knowing I did that etc.

My therapist recommended compassion therapy, not sure if this is something my GP would provide or again, if this would help or hinder. 

[PolarBear]

I think the right kind of therapy could help you. Ultimately, this is OCD at work. You are getting intrusive thoughts that you did something bad and you have identifiable compulsions. Treat it as OCD.

[Gemzi3]

Can you get OCD from real life events?

[PolarBear]

Yes. In this case OCD has latched onto what you did and made it into a huge deal when its not. Very common.

[Gemzi3]

I need to learn to forgive. I know now I have a misconception of what being a good person means. My illness made me hit my stomach, I could technically be called the victim in all of this. Take control of the time this illness has robbed and get help and get better,

I just wish I could believe it.

[PolarBear]

Say it often enough and you will start to believe it. Walk the walk.

[Gemzi3]

It scares me the fact that with that knowledge you could say or do anything over and eventually it would be true. But that's not the case - does that make sense? 

[PolarBear]

Sounds like you're trying to figure out ways to not forgive yourself. Where's that going to get you?

[Gemzi3]

It won't get me anywhere. Just stuck in this same cycle.

 

Why can I see all the logic and reasoning but when it comes to myself everything just goes completely out the window?!

[PolarBear]

Because you're stuck in the same old trap. You have to slowly start to change the way you think and behave. It can get better. Have a little faith and keep on trying.

[Gemzi3]

So what do I say at my CBT appointment on Wednesday?

I have mentioned these thoughts before but she usually says to focus on the small things first and look at compassion therapy. 

What approach should I take? 

[PolarBear]

Well, it is true that you should start with the small things and work your way up but there is no reason why you can't start implementing the strategy we've talked about here today right away. You can raise it with your therapist again and see what she says. Whatever she says, you can start working on this on your own.

[Gemzi3]

I will.

 

She's going on MAT leave in April which is a bit difficult when I feel like I'm realizing more things

I'm paying for all this private so it does add up - I could go through my GP and see if there is something there. 

I just want to know the correct techniques to be able to get a hold of this. When I feel low it just seems so horrible.  

I feel like I can't be totally happy. When the thoughts go, well you rubbed with clothes on and he ejaculated and you had a damp patch soaked through your jeans and underwear, and oh you think you saw a faint line on a test, and oh you DID hit yourself in the stomach (worse one) how, when I'm lying in bed worrying, do I get that to go away?

I feel like it doesnt because there is an element of truth, You know every other thought I've had and engaged with has eventually faded only this one hasn't . Why.

[PolarBear]

Because you keep ruminating over it, Gemzi. That's the reason it won't go away. What you wrote about what happened just now is you ruminating. You keep going over it in your head, again and again. That has to stop. It can stop but it takes a lot of hard work.

[Gemzi3]

But how? What techniques can CBT do?

Are the tables etc labelling anxiety etc not helpful?

[PolarBear]

A big part of CBT is learning to let go of compulsions. The reason this incident has stuck in your head is because you keep doing compulsions around it, notably ruminating. You can learn to cut that down and stop doing it. It takes a lot of work. Along with that is you have to let it go. You have to make a decision that you're no longer going to dwell on what happened and what could have happened, that you're going to let it go and let it be part of the past.

[Gemzi3]

I don't understand.

What if you didnt have ocd, did something terrible but just told yourself everyday to not think about it, would it eventually be forgotton?

[PolarBear]

Probably. The point is you do have OCD, your disorder has latched onto that incident, blown it's importance all out of proportion and you make things worse by doing compulsions.

[Gemzi3]

But how on earth can we differentiate?

Things like that make me feel like its a lie or that by that logic anyone could lose guilt?

Thats prob holding me back but its how i feel.

Its too easy to just blame ocd and move on like killing a baby doesnt matter?

[snowbear]

Gemzi, at the moment these thoughts are troubling you because you keep telling yourself things like:

'It's a big deal!'

'It was a bad thing/ it makes me a bad person'

'I can't forgive myself'

'I can't stop thinking about it and just let it go.'  (I should be punished/ I need to fix this or make amends)

 

All these responses are you giving meaning to what happened, interpreting it as a bad thing, as something that needs to be forgiven.  You believe you've done something terrible, something unforgivable, so you punish yourself by thinking things that make you feel guilty or feel bad/worse about yourself. You go over and over it, ruminating, trying to find ways to fix it or make amends. 

 

The truth is what you did (including the stomach punch) isn't that big a deal at all.  But you've convinced yourself it is to such an extent that you can't imagine anybody else sees things differently. You struggle to believe there is another way to see things.

Cognitive therapy will teach you that you're choosing to believe you did something terrible. You made a judgement (people shouldn't hit their stomach if they might be pregnant) and concluded that because you 'broke the rules' you did something unforgivable. So you're not forgiving yourself. 

There is always more than one way to interpret everything. Life isn't black and white with everything separated into clear cut should and shouldn'ts. If you try to live by those kind of rigid, inflexible rules then forgiveness IS impossible, happiness is impossible, and every day life becomes very difficult.

Which is where you're at now. 

And where you'll remain unless you learn to relax the rules around the should and shouldn'ts. You'll stay unhappy and troubled by unwanted thoughts until you learn to forgive.

23 minutes ago, Gemzi3 said:

What if you didnt have ocd, did something terrible but just told yourself everyday to not think about it, would it eventually be forgotton?

People without OCD don't apply the should and shouldn't rules as rigidly as you are doing. Even when they do happen to 'break the rules' they're willing to forgive themselves. They don't punish themselves by thinking endlessly about what they did. They take note not to do it again and then they let it go. And that's an end to it. No recriminations, nothing more to forgive or make amends for so no intrusive thoughts going round their heads as self-punishment. Nothing to fix.

So you have a choice.

You can choose to stand by the judgement you made (people should NEVER hit their stomach, it's an unforgivable thing to do) 

OR

you can choose to change the way you interpret the world, allow that people make mistakes and sometimes do things they shouldn't, but that's ok, it can be forgiven.

Which one you choose determines whether these thoughts will continue to trouble you as they do now, or whether you can forgive yourself, let it go and get on with living the rest of your life normally. 

[Gemzi3]

Thanks guys.

 

I had my CBT appointment today and explained to my therapist how I can understand why I have to expose myself to my worries but I sturggle to use this in my worst hitting myself killing a baby thoughts.

So I've now been booked in for a EMDR assessment next week to see if that will help me. Never tried it before so very unsure  Just want to feel better and be able to handle the thoughts.

I also wish the thoughts aren't true which I dont know if I can move past? 

[PolarBear]

I don't know what this current fascination is with EMDR. It's not a recognized therapy for OCD and I have yet to meet someone who says it worked for them.

You will never know if it's true or not, Gemzi. But you can get past it, accepting you won't know and moving past it.

[Gemzi3]

Do you feel like it wont work then?

I just can't continue with the never knowing and feeling so bad about it

I don't see how CBT or ERP helps this thought? 

[PolarBear]

CBT will teach you to stop giving the thoughts meaning and you'll work to stop your compulsions.

You have to continue with never knowing. You WILL NOT, not ever, find out if you killed a baby. It's over and done with. You can't go back and check. Nothing can be done by you to bring you the clarity and closure you so desperately seek. You have to get that through your head. It's just not going to happen. But you can move on, without knowing. You can make peace with what happened, forgive yourself and move on, leaving that event in the past.