Bleach

[Justine]

I've recently started to clean with bleach and its damaging my skin and affecting my breathing.

I need to stop but is it safe to clean without bleach to clean (would anti bacterial wipes be enough) anything that may have been in contact with dog or fox poo? Likely to be imaginary but need 100% certainty. Thanks. Or anything else better to clean with.

If you use something other than bleach how often do you get ill?

 

 

[OceanDweller]

3 minutes ago, Justine said:

I've recently started to clean with bleach and its damaging my skin and affecting my breathing.

I need to stop but is it safe to clean without bleach to clean (would anti bacterial wipes be enough) anything that may have been in contact with dog or fox poo? Likely to be imaginary but need 100% certainty. Thanks. Or anything else better to clean with.

If you use something other than bleach how often do you get ill?

 

 

Hi Justine. I watched a documentary a while ago that reported good old soap and water is as effective as antibacterial wipes. Most folk don't overuse bleach, and then don't get sick. So there's your answer I guess.

[PolarBear]

You can't have 100% certainty. You never will. OCD craves it, but you can't have it. 

Do you think the rest of the world cleans with bleach? Of course not. And most don't use antibacterial wipes either. Now why do you think that is?

[PhilM]

Do you mean "cleaning" yourself or parts of yourself with bleach?

As the Ava Gardner character says in The Aviator to OCD sufferer Howard Hughes: "Nothing's totally clean but we do our best".

I went through a period where I used bleach and a pumice stone or nail brush to "clean" my hands and then had to use loads of soap to get rid of the smell. Eventually I started hurting my fingers and I managed to stop thankfully and it is no longer one of my OCD manifestations. Best wishes, Phil

[Justine]

Thanks for the replies that's really helpful. Yes I do clean myself with bleach and its really damaging my skin / breathing so need to stop. Antibacterial wipes / soap don't seem to do my skin any harm so I want to go back to those even though its not the ideal, the bleach seems dangerous. But those wipes only get 99.9% and of course my head imagines all sorts of things that could have happened though nothing really has.

[PhilM]

Justine - I know where you are coming from but the damage to your skin is only going to get worse if you continue as I found out. My posts about bleach can be found elsewhere on the forum.

When I started making my fingers bleed (not trying to gross anyone out) and it was really painful that was a real wake-up call. You can stop honestly. Bleach was/is designed for a purpose and that purpose had/has nothing to do with physical human hygiene.

99.9 per cent is a pretty good statistic! I use the no towels required little bottles of soap when I'm out. This isn't a major OCD thing but because I am a light smoker (Yuk I know but never at home) and hate my hands smelling of cigarettes.

I don't know how long you have been doing this but you can stop in my opinion. Best wishes, Phil.

Edited May 16, 2017 by PhilM

[Justine]

Thanks Phil. Its only been a few weeks and I need to stop this one. It possibly does 100% rather than the 99.9% but the side effects are crazy plus never realised before it can combine with other things with up to fatal consequences. Think it may react with hand gel.

It's just things like seeing other people touch bins then not wash their hands and you don't know what's been in that bin though guess at work its just paper and food. But then people also touch the floor picking objects up, don't clean them even food ones and touch these things and pavements contain all sorts of things. Having said that these people still turn up at work most days.

[Gemma7]

12 minutes ago, Justine said:

Having said that these people still turn up at work most days.

Hi Justine, this is the most important point. Everyday people touch bins and pick up things off the floor, they take the tiny risk associated with these actions and are fine. They are healthy both mentally and physically because they aren't focused on obtaining the certainty that those with OCD require.

Are you seeing a therapist about your OCD? Have you had any CBT? I also recommend buying Break free from OCD, it's a great self-help book that will help in addition to therapy. 

[Justine]

Thanks Gemma. I know you are right really as I'm worried about so many things at work but everyone else does nothing and is fine, well one is long term ill but can't see it can be related. I'm not getting any CBT but have had it in the past with Professor Salvokosis who was amazing. I had to stop much better but part way through due to pregnancy but it helped me so much. Now have no fear of urine. 

Just have to get over fear of poo. Number of thoughts I'm getting is driving me nuts. I would actually be better off getting the extra sick bugs as I'm ill every day like this with anxiety and even the people I know who are really not careful only get about 3 sick bugs a year. 

 

[Justine]

Your dog photo is very cute by the way! 

[Gemma7]

That's brilliant that you have had success with CBT already. Remember that your fear of urine was OCD and so too is your fear of poo, so what therapy techniques you applied with one can be applied to the other. 

Are you planning on seeing a CBT therapist again to help you tackle your OCD? Also, Break free from OCD was part written by Prof. Paul Salkovskis so would be a good refresher. 

11 minutes ago, Justine said:

Your dog photo is very cute by the way! 

Thanks

[Justine]

I am on a list for cbt but its really difficult as they only provide it miles away, I don't drive and I'm either working or looking after the kids. 

I have done it before so could probably do it alone if I put my mind to it. Before I just thought I can work around it and carry on but now it's starting to bug me and taking over my life so I need to start tackling it. I can't remember exactly what did before but know the basic theory and know I added one thing each week to tackle and it worked. I now I think of urine as harmless so that may well be the key to it thinking its not dangerous. My daughter said to think of it as old food and actually that might work. Thanks for the help. 

 

[PolarBear]

You need CBT and ERP. You'll have to do some things that your OCD will tell you are disgusting and dangerous but other people think are no big deal.

[Justine]

Thanks. I was wondering if it was normal to feel dirty when you start challenging contamination ocd before you feel better, the way you've described it that would be normal and I must have gone through that before. Just did cbt last time but that alone made a huge difference. 

[BelAnna]

Hi Justine,

I have had a huge problem with contamination OCD too so I know how horrible it feels. It's great that your CBT has helped in the past.

Dog and fox faeces actually pose very little risk to health provided that if you ever actually get any visible poo on your hands you wash them carefully. Smaller amounts of bacteria from invisible quantities of dog faeces rarely cause ill-health in otherwise healthy people. If you think that people who kiss their dogs and cats (myself included these days!) regularly come into contact with their pet's faecal bacteria (for example where the dog licks their bottom and then licks their fur and the pet owner kisses the fur!) and very very rarely become unwell. 

The vast majority (90%) of stomach bugs are caused by Noroviruses (there are multiple strains) and the best way to prevent catching viruses is just simple handwashing for 20-30 seconds with warm soapy water and possible anti-viral hand foam or hand wipes use in high risk situations (i.e. GP/hospital appointments). Of course if someone in the house is unwell with a virus then diluted bleach can be used on surfaces to denature the virus (you cannot kill viruses, you denature them) but using bleach on your skin can cause broken and bleeding skin and chronic exposure to bleach can have more serious health consequences. 

I hope you're ok today!

[Justine]

Thanks BelAnna that's really useful, just got to put it to the test really. Have you still got contamination ocd or have you cured it? Though I know there are different types and I have no fear of blood etc. 

Hope you are fine too. It's lovely you have the dogs and cats. I've got a cat but don't cuddle her as much as she would like due to the ocd.