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Worst Intrusion Yet


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It absolutely pains me to say this but I have my last CBT session tomorrow and although I have learnt alot, I feel like I am absolutely at the bottom of the barrel right now.  A few weeks ago, out of nowhere I got an anxious thought going back to when I was 14,this anxious thought morphed throughout the course of the day to the point where I was having full-blown fear images of myself doing something completely immoral and reprehensible.  The thoughts were so disturbing they reduced me to a panic attack and crying. I told my therapist about this and asked her advice about what exactly I should do about this thought  and she told me to be rational with it and challenge it head on. When I told her that this method instils a lot of anxiety in me she told me and that I tend to end up ruminating on the reasons why the thought my be true as opposed to untrue she said then that I should just accept the thought as just a silly thought and move on. When I asked her what method she recommended in my case she just said 'whatever you think is best'. I was slightly baffled at the lack of clear in instruction so left feeling a bit confused as to what exactly I should do.

Because I've been feeling so broken and horrified as a result of this latest intrusion,I have spent most of last week  trying my best to refuse to get into mind debates with it. However,tonight when I'm feeling a little more recovered from the horror of the thought  I figured I would try to 'tackle it rationally head on'. Instead of finding rationale why the thought isn't true I seem to be able to come up with more reasons why it may be true and right back to square 1 devastation wise. I'm supposed to be getting married next year but how can I live a life worth living if my mind is telling me that I may have done this awful thing. I've been suffering with this for 18 months now and have been trying my best to get better but I can honestly say I've never felt so ill or afraid. Please can anyone who has experience of going through something similar help me, I am literally at my wits end with this horrible disorder. I feel like I don't deserve to live if this thought is true.                  

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Trying to come up with reasons why a thought isn't true is not going to work. It's a compulsion and will only serve to keep you stuck. Absolutely stop doing that right now. As you've seen, no matter how much proof against you think up, your mind will create supposed evidence for. It's a no win situation so stop doing it.

Facing a fear head on means more that you say your fear and agree with it. Something like, "Yup I guess I did that awful thing. Oh well. I think I'll go bake some cookies." Then leave it alone. That means no ruminating, no mind debates, no analyzing, nothing.

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i certainly know what your referring too ocean blue. haven't experienced same problem tho. my advice would be the same as PolarBear if im honest try and own up to thought if thats the correct word lol. then hopefully you will find the thought to fade away and no longer have this impact its having on your life. hope ive helped a tad if not all. if you want to send me a direct message. please dont hesitate, and i would happily listen and give some more personal advice if you wish. hope things get better for you and work out.

all the best Ben 

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Thank you all so much for your replies, they definitely help to make me feel a little less alone. 

I understand what your getting at Polar Bear ie. not really caring if thought is true. Problem is though that the thought is so perverse and against any good person's moral code that I really struggle to see myself getting to  a place of acceptance and indifference that thought maybe true without not wanting to put a gun to my temple.  Surely though if the thought was true it would have bothered me long before now or at least entered my mental conscience in some way? I wouldn't take 15 years to suddenly occur to me as a what if scenario during a period of rumination? 

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6 hours ago, Oceanblue said:

Thank you all so much for your replies, they definitely help to make me feel a little less alone. 

I understand what your getting at Polar Bear ie. not really caring if thought is true. Problem is though that the thought is so perverse and against any good person's moral code that I really struggle to see myself getting to  a place of acceptance and indifference that thought maybe true without not wanting to put a gun to my temple.  Surely though if the thought was true it would have bothered me long before now or at least entered my mental conscience in some way? I wouldn't take 15 years to suddenly occur to me as a what if scenario during a period of rumination? 

Nothing we do at 14 is meant to end with a gun to the head. It was, as you say, 15 years ago. Let it stay there.

Agreeing that you did It, over time, removes the sting from the thought. It's an exposure, to be followed by no compulsions. 

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Thank you Lisa and Polar Bear.

I just can't get comfortable with agreeing to that though Polar Bear without getting massively panicked and triggered. I wouldn't expect a normal person to accept these thoughts about themselves  as true  and just go on about their day calm and care-free so I can't see myself getting to that place either. Shouldn't the aim be to distance myself from the thoughts and see their likelihood as nil to minimal? I'm just so confused.   

 

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Hi OB. The truth is that 'normal people' experience the same intrusive thoughts as OCD sufferers. The difference (and this is crucial to recovery) is that non-sufferers dismiss them automatically, because they know they are meaningless byproducts of a healthy mind. OCD is powered by the meaning that we attach to these meaningless thoughts. Learn to dismiss them as wholly unimportant and you will rob OCD of its power. Make sense?

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3 hours ago, Oceanblue said:

Thank you Lisa and Polar Bear.

I just can't get comfortable with agreeing to that though Polar Bear without getting massively panicked and triggered. I wouldn't expect a normal person to accept these thoughts about themselves  as true  and just go on about their day calm and care-free so I can't see myself getting to that place either. Shouldn't the aim be to distance myself from the thoughts and see their likelihood as nil to minimal? I'm just so confused.   

 

You needn't challenge your OCD the way I suggested but it would help in the long run. I'm not asking you to decide you did anything. But if you agree with the thoughts, shrug them off and get on with your day without performing compulsions, it really gives your OCD nowhere else to go.

Trying to prove to yourself that you didn't do something bad won't work. You'll end up arguing with yourself, OCD coming up with new reasons why it must be true. You'll get nowhere.

Part of my recovery involved me, after getting an intrusive thought, saying, "Yeah I guess I'm a pedophile. Oh well." I did that Many, many times. Today I'm recovered.

Edited by PolarBear
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Agree with all said here about accepting the thoughts. And on a cognitive note Oceanblue - why should you be so pure (trying to be a 'good' person will just get you into trouble) , every one is 'terrible' - and that's not so terrible. It's just being human. 

Edited by paradoxer
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Thank you, you have all made some very valid points which I am trying my best to take on board in order to fight this! At the moment I am working hard in trying to stop the compulsions which for me is constant ruminating, memory-checking and reassurance. Today was still not great compulsion wise but it was better than yesterday and I seemed to be able to control my need to do them quite so often which  was progress.

However,soon after I had mentally noted this small progress, later in the day my mind inserted a random fleeting thought of an incident I'm almost sure I read in a book years ago, it was basically about someone acting highly immorally in a deliberate attempt to hurt another person.  The thought was in the third person and  I was not in any way involved but now I'm questioning why the thought so randomly popped into my head and of course the more I'm thinking about it,the more I'm getting worried that maybe it means something. Does it make my earlier intrusive thought more true in that the 2 may be connected,was it really just something I read in a book or is it just OCD's attempt to up the ante now that I've resumed my action plan on the route to recovery? I'm sorry for all the questions but once again I'm just getting myself tied up in knots with all these layers of thoughts and struggling to make sense of them.       

 

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Stop trying to make sense of the thoughts. They're just thoughts. Book or No, it doesn't matter. You are under no obligation to figure out all your thoughts. It is perfectly okay to just leave them alone and get on with your day.

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I completely understand you Oceanblue. My latest obsession/intrusive thought triggered me just a day before I got married. This was by far the worst intrusion ever! I was thinking the same "how can I live a life thinking I've done this awful thing?" I don't know why I got triggered at this time when it was supposed to be the happiest time of my life. I don't know why at this time OCD got ever so strong and tricked me into believing I had acted on my intrusive thought. Was it because I was going through different emotions at the time? Can somebody tell me? I will explain the situation. 1 month before I got married I had just lost my dad and I was in shock and the next month I was supposed to be getting married. My emotions were everywhere. I was so confused as to what was happening to me. 

Edited by Lavendar
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Yes I think it was probably just a mad mix of emotions Lavender as you say.

I know you're absolutely right Polar Bear,I've been trying to make sense of them all day and of course got no further forward but the temptation to keep ruminating and figuring out the answer is compellingly strong.

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I still up to now don't know if I had acted on my thought of inappropriately touching a mans privates as he walked past me? It scares me whenever I think about it as I can't make sense of it in my head? How can I possibly of acted on the thought whilst the man was fully clothed? How can I have acted on the thought so quickly within seconds as he was walking past me? It just doesn't make sense. The room was full of people but what doubts me is the fact that because I was sitting right at the end of the room (when the intrusive thought took place) and everybody else was sat on the other side of the room it is making me think what if I did touch his privates and nobody else noticed as they were sat on the other side?

 

 

 

 

Edited by Lavendar
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You're not going to like this Lavender but to move forward you have to stop trying to answer the question, did I touch the man's genitals. 

Right now, and for some time Now, you have been trying to answer that question. You have been analyzing your thoughts, scouring your memory, ruminating like crazy and trying to work it all out. Those are compulsions. And what good have they done? You're no closer to an answer today than when you started. So stop trying.

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On ‎11‎/‎11‎/‎2017 at 01:12, Oceanblue said:

However,soon after I had mentally noted this small progress, later in the day my mind inserted a random fleeting thought of an incident I'm almost sure I read in a book years ago, it was basically about someone acting highly immorally in a deliberate attempt to hurt another person.  The thought was in the third person and  I was not in any way involved but now I'm questioning why the thought so randomly popped into my head and of course the more I'm thinking about it,the more I'm getting worried that maybe it means something. Does it make my earlier intrusive thought more true in that the 2 may be connected,was it really just something I read in a book or is it just OCD's attempt to up the ante now that I've resumed my action plan on the route to recovery? I'm sorry for all the questions but once again I'm just getting myself tied up in knots with all these layers of thoughts and struggling to make sense of them. 

Sorry to be incredibly annoying folks but I'm still struggling massively with above and similar. Would it be a fair analysis to say that the random thoughts I'm getting from stuff I've read/seen on tv etc. could well be linked to original intrusive thought but this does not make the  intrusive thought more true? It just means that my brain is highly sensitised because of intrusive thought and as a result my brain is sending me other material of similar disturbing content to get my brain to react? Or could it be that there is no link at all and I am just placing every single fleeting thought that enters my consciousness under the microscope and causing myself unnecessary hours of mental investigation to prove to myself that I am worrying unnecessarily? Problem is everything just becomes so jumbled and it's so unnerving to cope with on a daily basis. I feel like I don't know my own  mind anymore. 

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I have pure OCD and so spend a lot of time ruminating and arguing with myself. For me the MOST effective thing to do is what PB suggested and to agree with the intrusive thoughts.

Since the intrusive thoughts were about me sexually abusing my baby, of course it didn't feel 'morally right' to agree with the thought. You can imagine how distressing it was to do. But I did it anyway.

I would say that this method is not about coming to terms with what it means to agree with such a thought. It's not about analysing what sort of person would agree with such a thought or your moral code. It is a method to deal with OCD, which you have.

Amazingly when I did do it, the feeling of relief was so immense. The tension and energy I was using to try and manage my obsessions was so great, that to just agree and move on felt like the whole world had been removed from my shoulders. And I didn't feel guilty about that because it worked as a technique and the thoughts massively lessened. So my OCD didn't feel so strong and I didn't feel so involved in the storyline my OCD was telling me.

another thing you could try is labelling your distressing thoughts feelings as OCD thoughts and feelings. So you could say " right now I am having a OCD flare up, so of course I don't know my own mind at the moment and that's ok."

And then when a confused thought comes up label it an OCD confused thought; when you search for certainty say "I am searching for certainty because of my OCD"; when you question the past say "right now I can't stop this behaviour but I know it's because I have OCD." You could even say "of course I'm having a flare up, I'm finishing my therapy which is my safety net. And I felt like my therapist let me down by not giving me the direction I needed" Does this make any sense? My examples might be wrong in content, but it's about reframing what is happening to you in your head. 

Finally, my OCD always ups the ante. Now I expect it. But it can be frightening.

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Although this obviously an OCD thing, could you also do something positive about your current anxiety levels? Is your body involved in flight or fight responses, such as incorrect breathing, hunched stiff posture, not moving enough, or agitation? Doing something to correct the physical effects of high anxiety may help you deal better with your situation. If these are useless suggestions please ignore me.

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Thank you so much for this amazing advice Jennie, it means so much. I understand what you are saying about accepting the thoughts as a coping technique rather than it being a reflection of moral code. This must have been so hard for you to do but I am so glad it helped you,I am going to try my very best to just let my thoughts be there no matter how intrusive or messed up they become without getting caught up in needing to neutralise them and convince myself of how incorrect and untrue  they are .  When I get such thoughts,my breathing can become really rapid and shallow but I am working hard to try and control this and practice mindfulness etc.

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well I hope you are also giving yourself a break in the sense that, really, you were probably always going to have a flare up after finishing therapy and the connotations of that. I am having a anxiety flare up just knowing Christmas is coming!

As someone new to this forum, it's immediately obvious what a hard time people with OCD give themselves. and I do include myself in this. Ive read a lot of posts from people saying what terrible people they are. A) because they have terrible thoughts or/and b) because they are not progressing enough in their recovery and can't improve. OCD sufferers also seem to say 'sorry' a lot. I mean if you have to apologise for posting your problems with OCD on an OCD forum then wtf?

personally I would never be annoyed or frustrated talking to anyone about their OCD. It is a terrible illness. And I'm just so grateful to have found a place where I can finally say "yes that's me, I do that too". 

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  • 2 weeks later...

This random thought I had about scene from book is still continuing to trouble me. I can’t work out why it suddenly came to me. I mean I think I can and I had put it down to my brain just being highly sensitised and automatically sending me thoughts of similar theme to intrusive thought but then i worry if it meant my thought was more true somehow or maybe heaven forbid somehow it wasn’t entirely just a fictional scene from book  and had some place in reality? I mean i had decided last week that I was happy that this was definitely not the case and that I was going to leave this issue alone but then something somebody said about people making connections in their brain triggered me and I got into thinking about this all over again. 

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