Advice, willing to listen.

[ocdsufferer85]

I want to know some basic things about our minds, and if I am feeling guilt for something that shouldn't produce any guilt.

A thought comes in. And unwanted thought. Eventually learning there is no guilt, it can't be controlled, it's not my fault. We cannot control our minds. Nobody can. Its impossible. This makes sense. This is logical.

Now, when this thought sets off more thoughts, this is also unavoidable yes? Logical yes? No need for guilt as the above still applies? The answer is yes. That's me being logical once again.

Now if the thought is of something I fear and don't believe in, if it's about an action, but I don't have any wanting inside of me to perform the action, if this idea comes from something I have read, someone else's 'worry' is it my fault for questioning it further?

Is it a bad thing for me to think of the thing i fear the most and think how it would be done? Do I need to feel guilty of letting myself listen to THIS thought? Am I a bad person for allowing myself to take someone else's worry and imagine it as my own? Am I allowed to be less vigilant, or does this make me wreckless and deserving of punishment? I am trying to see if what the ocd says I've done is even a bad thing. 

Now, all these things are coming in..

"what would it be like"  "is it so easy" "so if I, or anyone said that line would be immediately doomed?" "worse than any crime?" "is it that fragile?" 

Are these thoughts bad, OR is it normal rationalising?

Is it normal when fixated on a particular thing to feel myself in a state where I feel like I can just see how it would be done, so mine is speaking under a breath as we all know. Is it a natural thing to feel your mouth move? Or is this something to feel guilty for? Is this a slight action due to OCD thoughts or is this a real thing to be immensely guilty for?

If you have no intentions of acting then is feeling calm and allowing it something be ashamed of?  Or deserving of punishment for being less careful, if I truly believe that if it's done it's the worst thing in the world. 

Is it bad of me to believe this yet still feel like I'm close or allowing myself to physically see how it would work? 

Is all of this unavoidable or is is it something I should be left to feel ashamed over?

Finally when I feel like I 'slipped up' was this caused by me being bad, or was it caused by OCD?

I am trying to grasp what people are saying is 'nothing' how? How is it nothing when to me it's so devastating and shameful.

I want to know if these things are seen by none sufferers as nothing and why is it nothing to be ashamed of?

[themanwhowillstop]

I think you made a really good point at the start which you should listen to. We are not in control of our minds. There is the bit of our brain that is us and another part works to do things without us having to tell it to do so. It is totally normal that this part of the brain works independently as it has kept us safe for thousands of years by allowing us to carry out our daily task while it looks for threats or produces spontaneous ideas. 

What we can control is how we respond to this part of our mind. People without OCD don't have problems squashing thoughts that seem bizarre, hurtful or random - to them it just passes by. For us we focus on it and where the brain's focus goes, attention grows. What I would say that none of these thoughts you are having are inherently bad and rationalising your thoughts is a natural part of being a human being. You are obviously very very stressed from your thoughts because you feel guilty about internalising what you perceive as shameful or immoral thoughts. (Please correct me if I'm wrong). Our mind is very good at running down tangents, OCD or not - it is a matter of redirecting the focus to something normal and positive. Are you in CBT yet ocdsufferer?

[JennieWren]

In response to your question I think, yes, normal people do work out how to do horrible things without any intention of doing them. Think of horror films or thrillers. They are not written by murderers but they do act out incredible terror and horrors. The plot line came from someones thoughts. The writers don't question this in the way you are. And then people watch this for entertainment without ever thinking it will make them do such terrible things. 

I would say I had a bit of trouble following your train of thought. It felt very complicated and confusing. The book I'm reading says the more you think about an obsession and all it's variations and different trains of thought, the more uncertain you will become. This type of rumination will only end in more uncertainty- you aren't going to work it out.

and yes I get physical urges like I'm on the cusp of acting out my harmful thoughts. This seems normal for this illness. Not worth taking as 'proof'.

[OceanDweller]

2 minutes ago, JennieWren said:

 

In response to your question I think, yes, normal people do work out how to do horrible things without any intention of doing them. Think of horror films or thrillers. They are not written by murderers but they do act out incredible terror and horrors. The plot line came from someones thoughts. The writers don't question this in the way you are. And then people watch this for entertainment without ever thinking it will make them do such terrible things. 

 

Interesting point Jennie. Having a vivid imagination is no indicator of intent or capacity.

[JennieWren]

YES! That's what I meant to say you summed it up much better!

[OceanDweller]

Just now, JennieWren said:

YES! That's what I meant to say you summed it up much better!

Nah. The horror film analogy was what made it memorable.