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Dilemma


Guest Bushbaby

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Guest Bushbaby

Hello

I just wonder if anyone can give me some advice, please?

My daughter has developed quite extreme BDD and it is destroying her. She needs reassurance, but I know from past experience that this will not help her as she will just demand more and more. CAMHS have washed their hands of her. She can't come up with the logical statements to help her deal with the questions that she could when her OCD was bad, because it isn't something she can reason through. She has stopped her meds as she feels it doesn't work.

Any ideas how I can help without getting into giving reassurance? She thinks people are laughing at her because she is ugly and her views of her hair and teeth just exacerbate her negative feelings. She is so angry that I won't give her reassurance. It makes me evil.

I can't access any support for her because our CAMHS service have said they have gone as far as they can to help her and have withdrawn. She is feeling suicidal and I am lost for ideas.

Any suggestions?

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  • 2 weeks later...
Guest eve.bisrat

ask her what would be so bad if she were ugly with bad teeth?

does she want a superficial guy who only likes outer body and superficial looks or a deep thinker who wants a good, mature, interesting person in a woman?

ask her if she thinks only beautiful women find happiness and love?

does she know any average or ugly looking women happily in love?

has she had a crush on a guy that was not the best looking guy in school?

ha she ever turned down a really handsome guy coz he wasn't her type, or she didn't like his personality?

would it be really so bad if she was as hideous looking as she think she is and some people laughed at her coz of that?

would these people be good and mature, deep thinkers or superficial, ignorant sadistic cruel people?

what is so bad if some sick and sadistic ignorant superficial people laugh at her?should she care what these sort of people think of her?

you can make your own question, the point of this excersise is not for your to tell your daughter how she isn't ugly, that is a highly arbitrary idea anyway, and if she think she is ugly, for her, she is ugly...it is a matter of opinion...coz it is a matter of opinion..

beauty is in the eye of the beholder and your daughter sees an ugly girl in the mirror...don't try to tell her what she does or does not see with her own yes...

instead shift the focus on, ok so what is exactly so bad about being plain looking,even ugly, everyone gets old and loses their looks...

if we don't sleep for few nights looks suffer and are gone...

so anyone who has only good looks has something highly superficial and fragile...and so are relationships based on looks...

being ugly is not that big of a deal, coz relationships she should seek anyway are with people who look at stuff beneath the surface...

what she doesn't need in her life at all are people who mock someone's ugly looks...these are not nice or deep people---you can suggest she reads the little prince, and there is a love relationship in there described as time invested and love, not as lust for casual sex and perfectly white teeth, which is all peoiple who would potentially mock your daughter know...the little prince also learns that the important things are not visible by eyes but only by heart and inner being...

your daughter is growing up in culture where all the ideals she sees are surgically enhanced, teeth whitened, Photoshopped mirages...nobody looks as perfect as your daughter's brain thinks she should look, in order not to be ugly...instead of telling a young girl what she will conclude on her own, when she is older, that she has a very harsh standard of beauty for herself, way harsher than for other people, that nobody looks the way she thinks she should, no models or actresses or stars...that she is a very pretty girl....

instead of all this, validate her opinion, dismantle the fear..ok you're plain looking, so what...

are there very beautiful women with no self esteem, how did they get that if beauty is cure all?

do you want a bf who will love you for your personality and values and body, or only body?

etc etc

im sleepy and tired, but im sure you can see where im going with this and you can devise your on questions...

you can also tell her that most people are average, very few people are exceptionally beautiful or exceptionally ugly...so statistically she is probably average looking and that's ok...it's the norm..

so shift the focus from telling her she's wrong and harsh on herself, she knows that, she just cannot help herself, she expected to look better than she does...or different that she does...shift the focus to realizing that being plain looking or rather average it's ok, anyone can potentially like her and she doesn't intimidate or repulse anyone, within the normal spectrum of people...some sadistic people will always laugh, but she doesn't want them in her life anyway...

i have to warn you, this will work wonders for her to make peace with herself and stop worrying and obsessing about her 'hideous looks', but she will be sad coz she will realize you too think she is ugly and she will wish you weren't such a good psychologists and simply did the kind thing and lied and told her she was very beautiful, it doesn't matter that it's not psychologically the best thing for her BDD...

or she will be sad wishing that you were much more like the little prince after he learned that the important beauty is not visible by eyes, that you saw with your heart, not your eyes and though she was amazingly beautiful...

this cannot be helped, as women we are conditioned by evolution to want to be amazingly beautiful...we were property until recently, in evolution and our worth to men was how useful and pretty we are...so this is atavism, we still want to be beautiful, even thought many men evolved to want people and personality out of their partner rather than pretty objects of desire...

all women want to be beautiful, even the ones that have very strong personalities...most women just have defense mechanism that defended them against begin average...your daughter doesn't...your daughter can think her partner is sentenced to her hideous body and that is not fair to him...

men also get BDD, coz since we have evolved standards are shifting towards equality and there is more and more pressure on men to be beautiful...(instead of less pressure on women to do so, yah we did get this one completely backwards), but i think men handle BDD better than women do...precisely coz if a man is a good provider and generous lover he knows he can get most women out there..but men with alpha traits do not want my opinionated brain and politics, they want a sexy enchanted woman...and since i was a little girl i was told that sexy enchanted women look like naome cambel not like me or your daughter...

like i said...im tired...

but try, you have nothing to lose, you can help your daughter be less tortured or be right back thre you started..

Edited by eve.bisrat
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So far as advice for OCD goes that has to be one of the most unhelpful replies I've seen in a long time. It seems that you are misunderstanding OCD/BDD completely and utterly. To a young sufferer of this tormenting condition there is none of the above that will help one iota, fortunately I'm sure Bushbaby will be fully aware of that. This isn't about dabbling in High School Psychology

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Guest penny0305

I hate to be harsh but I agree.my ocd and bdd centres around my teeth and hair too and people telling me its what's on the inside that counts doesn't help.I just see it as validation that the outside is hideous ! I wish I had more helpful advice to give you. Camhs should not be washing their hands of her when she needs help.from my own experience it took a long time and a lot of persistence to get mental health services to take me seriously.I have tried various meds but have only really had success with risperidone, which unfortunately I've had to stop due to side effects.is your gp sympathetic, it was a locums gp who pushed for me to get access to a psychiatrist.it might be worth seeing another gp in your practice.I am so sorry I cannot offer anymore.practical advice.I know that reassurance doesn't help me, no matter how much I want it! One day I can be satisfied my hair looks ok and then the next I've found another problem with it. I hope you can get the help she needs.luv penny

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Guest eve.bisrat

So far as advice for OCD goes that has to be one of the most unhelpful replies I've seen in a long time. It seems that you are misunderstanding OCD/BDD completely and utterly. To a young sufferer of this tormenting condition there is none of the above that will help one iota, fortunately I'm sure Bushbaby will be fully aware of that. This isn't about dabbling in High School Psychology

hmm, maybe im wrong, but again it seems more important to you to attack me rather than to help OP. please offer your expertise then, i offered mine, now let's here you?

i'd also appreciate a point by point rebuttal of my technique, educate me, i am here to learn, please explain point by point why exactly it was unhelpful advice, i am listening

off topic: i do get a sense that you ladies think im 20, lol, just coz i have a 25 year old husband, this amuses me greatly, :lol:

Edited by eve.bisrat
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i'd also appreciate a point by point rebuttal of my technique, educate me, i am here to learn, please explain point by point why exactly it was unhelpful advice

I have neither the time or inclination to indulge you Eve.

Suffice to say, none of the above would help either the OP or her Daughter.

As a charity we spend a great deal of time ensuring that sufferers and their families or friends receive accurate support and advice and where we find advice that is unhelpful, it will be drawn to someones attention and possibly removed.

I'm not sure if you enjoy being contentious or honestly believe that you're offering good advice but it seems that your involvement on many threads has resulted in similar problems or disquiet.

If you really want to learn about OCD as a condition, perhaps it would be helpful to spend a quiet hour or two reading many of the threads on the forum or some of the articles on the OCD-UK main website.

Caramoole

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Guest eve.bisrat

I have neither the time or inclination to indulge you Eve.

Suffice to say, none of the above would help either the OP or her Daughter.

As a charity we spend a great deal of time ensuring that sufferers and their families or friends receive accurate support and advice and where we find advice that is unhelpful, it will be drawn to someones attention and possibly removed.

I'm not sure if you enjoy being contentious or honestly believe that you're offering good advice but it seems that your involvement on many threads has resulted in similar problems or disquiet.

If you really want to learn about OCD as a condition, perhaps it would be helpful to spend a quiet hour or two reading many of the threads on the forum or some of the articles on the OCD-UK main website.

Caramoole

so basically you offer no arguments against my post, not even a single one? you expect me to just accept your un-argumeted remarks at face value? that wouldn't be sensible, logical or smart, on my part.

you want to be the pope of OCD, and your charity is its catholic church?

dogma over discussion based on arguments, huh?

hm, how very unfortunate for anyone naive enough to believe you have any idea how to help with OCD

again, i wish you at least offer one or two arguments as to why my post was counter productive, this way, i have nothing left but to think you might have no arguments, what so ever, you might be just bitter and dogmatic.

Edited by eve.bisrat
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Eve, with all due respect, research has been carried out into OCD and its treatments for many years now and the methods recommended by OCD UK are well-grounded in evidence... as Caramoole said, it would probably be helpful to you to read about these and you will probably be enlightened as to why some of your suggestions above are not helpful for someone suffering from OCD/BDD.

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Guest eve.bisrat

Eve, with all due respect, research has been carried out into OCD and its treatments for many years now and the methods recommended by OCD UK are well-grounded in evidence... as Caramoole said, it would probably be helpful to you to read about these and you will probably be enlightened as to why some of your suggestions above are not helpful for someone suffering from OCD/BDD.

again, please go over a chunk of my post, point by point and tell us why it's counter productive and which psychological data says so.

you are not really saying anything here, except that im wrong, but you can't explain why...

do explain why, at least try? im listening...

Edited by eve.bisrat
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Eve...as I have already mentioned, I am not here to indulge or amuse you. If I felt that you truly misunderstood or had a desire to learn more, that may be different.

Apart from concerns I have about advice offered, I do find that you're being very confrontational and dare I say it, a tad disruptive.

You are welcome to use the forums and take from them what you will but if it begins to cause disruption and the smooth running of the forum then we may have to reconsider. I hope that won't be necessary.

Caramoole

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Guest eve.bisrat

I have to say I am not an expert on BDD. But from my point of view your post seems like a long ode to reassurance-seeking.

To be honest, I think you are quite confrontational for somebody who is new to the forum and who has expressed a desire to learn.

i do wish you'd point out which part is reassurance, rather than commenting vaguely like that, coz there might be some reassurance in there but i cannot find it, please you point it out.

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Guest eve.bisrat

Eve...as I have already mentioned, I am not here to indulge or amuse you. If I felt that you truly misunderstood or had a desire to learn more, that may be different.

Apart from concerns I have about advice offered, I do find that you're being very confrontational and dare I say it, a tad disruptive.

You are welcome to use the forums and take from them what you will but if it begins to cause disruption and the smooth running of the forum then we may have to reconsider. I hope that won't be necessary.

Caramoole

i see a threat to remove me, yet no arguments as to why im disruptive and not simply more knowledgeable about psychology than you are?

Edited by eve.bisrat
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i see a threat to remove me, yet no arguments as to why im disruptive and not simply more knowledgeable about psychology than you are?

You said you want to learn. If that is the case, I fail to see how you could be more knowledgeable than the administrators of a leading national OCD charity. Maybe you are - in which case you clearly have no need to learn?

I am not going to engage in conversation with you anymore - I'm not exactly sure what your purpose is here, hopefully if it is to learn then you will gain some value from it. Good luck.

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Guest eve.bisrat

You said you want to learn. If that is the case, I fail to see how you could be more knowledgeable than the administrators of a leading national OCD charity. Maybe you are - in which case you clearly have no need to learn?

I am not going to engage in conversation with you anymore - I'm not exactly sure what your purpose is here, hopefully if it is to learn then you will gain some value from it. Good luck.

so basically you don't know which part of my post is reassurance?

this is not about what i want, we were talking about my post. if you do not wish to offer any explanation on your 'it's reassurance' claim, you probably shouldn't engage with me, you are wasting my time...

Edited by eve.bisrat
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That's because your entire post is reassurance. All the advice I have seen you offer has been of this type- it is not helpful to OCD sufferers. A quick look round the OCD UK website, or any place including mental health information, will explain this to you. I do apologise for "wasting your time" - I won't do so again.

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Guest eve.bisrat

That's because your entire post is reassurance. All the advice I have seen you offer has been of this type- it is not helpful to OCD sufferers. A quick look round the OCD UK website, or any place including mental health information, will explain this to you. I do apologise for "wasting your time" - I won't do so again.

so you fail to understand what reassurance is, coz my whole post is the very opposite of reassurance, it even gives insight into sufferers need for reassurance and blues over not getting it.

its a masterpiece of insight into BDD :lol:

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Guest Bushbaby

Hello All

I'm kind of sorry I started this! I didn't mean to cause problems.

My daughter is suffering really badly with her OCD and BDD. I am refusing reassurance because it doesn't help. The same as telling her she is beautiful, and she is, but in her head she is ugly and no amount of telling her what she can't see is going to help. She is in the middle of A Levels and thinks she is ugly and evil, as she is being tortured by her thoughts. She can't concentrate on enjoying her life and that is heart-breaking. No CAMHS support and the GP will only refer to CAMHS so I'm left to sort this myself and it's a nightmare when I'm told life isn't worth living and I'm on constant suicide watch.

I hate this illness with every fibre of my being!

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  • 3 weeks later...

I have resisted the urge to comment on this up to now, but I can't any longer.

"...a masterpiece of insight into BDD"...... So tell us, where did learn everything there is to know about BDD in order to give us your masterpiece of insight? (Despite claiming that you are here to learn).

The only people qualified to give a masterpiece of insight are those suffering with BDD. I am truly disgusted and insulted that your advice to someone with BDD is to (basically) accept that they are ugly and move on!

I think it best for everyone if you were to never post on this forum again, your opinions are dangerous and damaging.

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Many people agreed with you about this person's posts and you will see she is now only showing as a 'guest', so hopefully it is at an end, having been on the receiving end myself too!

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  • 3 weeks later...
Guest BlueBird007

Bushbaby, am really upset to see that your post was taken over by that awful person and no one appeared to reply to your original post. Come on moderators, this surely should have been picked up on!!!!

Sending you a pm, sending love and hugs to you and your beautiful girl xx

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Guest Bushbaby

Thank you so much, BlueBird! I really appreciate your care and concern.

I just assumed that I didn't get a reply because there is just no help and support out there for young people with BDD or their parents. The consequence is that my daughter took an overdose (as predicted) and is currently very poorly. There is clearly no help and support for young people with this condition. Our CAMHS service do not take it seriously and have offered no treatment for my daughter.

As a parent, I am heartbroken and frustrated. It is a pretty hopeless situation. :(

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Guest BlueBird007

Sending you both love and hugs, how can something so predictable be allowed to happen, how in the 21st century can there be no treatment for our kids with CAMHS, it is a total outrage. I am just so grateful that my daughter is past CAMHS and in adult services where she is being taken very seriously. Have you thought about seeking a medical solicitors advice, one we were involved with regarding a totally different matter was keen to take a look when my daughter was discharged from hospital, just a thought! xx

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Guest itsnotmeitsmyocd

Dear Bushbaby,

I am so very sad to read of your and your daughters suffering. As a mum i know there is nothing worse than our kids being unwell. There is help out there, and your daughter has the right this help- it's the law, so please don't give up hope. I would advise calling OCD UK and asking their advice, sadly it looks like you might need to fight to access the correct treatment. And OCD UK are aware of how the system works and what you need to do when it's not working for you.

Have you heard of DR David Veale? He has written a book about BDD, that some people on here have said they found helpful. He also runs specialist clinics for BDD via the NHS, here is a link to all the information (scroll down the page) http://www.veale.co.uk/resources-support/public-information/body-dysmorphic-disorder/

There is a support group in London that others have found helpful too.

I hope that helps a little. Sending you both the best and strongest wishes. xx Paris

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