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Daughter in toilet for nearly 9 hours now...


Guest DrZ

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Guest Annabel

Poor thing :(

Perhaps ask her if she thinks you should call an ambulance? unless she's very young, in which case maybe do. What is keeping her in there?

Edited by Annabel
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Hi

She's nearly 13 and has and an assessment at CAMHS 2 weeks ago, we are waiting for her first therapy session this friday but I seriously doubt we'll be able to get here there, she hasn't left the house except to see the GP and even that took a lot of negotiation and planning.

Here is the posting I sent on "Introduce Yourself" yesterday:

Thanks for all the replies

Ross

Hi

My 12 year old daughter has OCD, and just over 2 weeks ago it suddenly got a whole lot worse. We were originally referred to CAMHS about 4 1/2 years ago and she was diagnosed then, but due to a mix up it was never followed up by any therapy and since most of her rituals were performed out of sight and didn't impinge on her life much we let it slide, with people saying things like 'oh she'll grow out of it' etc :-(

Suddenly 2 weeks ago she simply broke down one morning, the rituals weren't enough, her anxiety went through the roof, she became distraught and it's got worse day by day ever since. She started harming herself; biting, scratching, pulling her hair out in handfuls and banging her head against the wall before becoming violent towards us. We eventually resorted to calling an ambulance because we didn't know what else to do. We eventually managed to calm her down, and saw a clinician and CAMHS for an initial assessment, and have a therapy session booked.

However, in the mean time her symptoms get worse, indeed new obsessions and compulsions crop up every day, and sometimes she seems locked in stasis before beginning her rituals, saying she needs to get calm before she can start them. She tends to spend about 5 hours in the bathroom now, or tries to avoid going if she can, which leads to accidents. She has stopped going out, and I'm worried that we won't be able to persuade her to go to the therapy session. We've begun the worksheets but she is very pessimistic about the outcome and we see so little of her we haven't got very far.

Her life is at a stand still, she hasn't been to school and is getting more and more upset as the days go by.

We are at our wits end and are starting to get sucked into at least one of her rituals, namely the hand washing to try and cut down the time she takes but the toilet aspect still take hours. We don't know who to turn to about the day to day aspects when the professionals tell us to try to have a time limit for bathroom visit but trying to impose any sort of boundaries produces truculence at best and anger at worst. I know from the NICE guidance notes that SSRIs are not prescribed till therapy has been exhausted but I'm left to wonder whether they are needed just to stabilise her now to get back to some sort of basic routine and thus let the therapy work. However I know there is no magic bullet for OCD.

Ross

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Hi Ross

Yes, just found and read that. Is she locked in the bathroom?

Not sure what the best course of action is as a parent. I think I would explain that if she isn't going to come out soonish you will have to take some action to resolve matters.

Have you managed to get any idea why the sudden flare up, anything going on at school or anything? Then of course there are the dreaded hormones which won't be helping.

We are at our wits end and are starting to get sucked into at least one of her rituals

I know this seems the easier option sometimes but I'd strongly advise not getting drawn into rituals under any circumstances....it only makes it harder as well when you have to stop.

Caramoole

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Not locked, I removed the lock a while back :-(

She's been calm most of the day but started getting upset this evening. At this time of the night we've been told she will be dealt with by adult mental health people and it will incredibly traumatic.

Ross

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Guest Sally44

Don't complete the rituals it will make it worse. It won't help at all.

9 hours in the bathroom is a long time. Did you phone the ambulance or anyone else?

Medication maybe suggested and it is worth considering as it may reduce her anxiety.

The Maudsley hospital is the specialist hospital for OCD. Ask for a referral to them.

I am assuming she does not have any other diagnosis or difficulty.

Do tell her that she is not the only person with anxiety like she has. Does she know she has OCD? Thereis a forum for teenagers on this website. Do tell her she isn't going mad, but that her brain has become hypersensitive and is giving her danger warnings when it isn't needed.

Would anything like music distract her from the constant thoughts? And try not to talk about OCD all the time if she confirms that talking about it makes her more anxious or reminds her of the thoughts she has.

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It must be a dreadful predicament :(

I think you need to be quite firm and directive with her (horrid I know) but explain that this can't go on and you will have to get some outside support if she won't work with you. This is very distressing for her but it's not good to let rituals continue for such extreme lengths of time, especially as they've only occurred as little as a few weeks ago. Try and ask her to explain what's going on with her thoughts, what's scaring her today.

Some of our parents of young sufferers might have different ideas but I feel she needs you to be supportive but know you're in charge and are going ensure she gets the help she needs. It must be awful when she gets so angry but despite that, she has to learn that anger isn't going to stop you doing what you feel is the right thing to do.

Caramoole

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Guest lizinlondon

Maybe it is a cry for help. She really needs attention. Have they not suggested some medication that she could take when required. I really hope she gets the help she needs. Good luck xxxx

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Hi

Sorry for not replying sooner, but I was with her in the bathroom for some time and took exactly the stance pretty much at the same time as you suggested it Caramoole, i.e. this can't go on and I'll have to ring for help. I really hate the idea of using the ambulance as a threat though, because it may make it that much more scary if and when we do have to call one again (we did have to call one last week but eventually "talked her down" and got her to go to CAMHS instead). She is still there right now 10:55pm but has supposedly started her rituals.

I did talk to someone from CAMHS earlier today before this latest turn and she said that perhaps medication may indeed be required now because or her state of mind and it will be that much harder to engage her in CBT. I will contact her again with the latest news.

Thanks

Ross

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Guest Annabel

Hi,

I'm really sorry to hear what is going on, I just read your first post. Is your daughter out of the bathroom yet? You must all be feeling so desperate. I hope she has finished her compulsions and is able to go to sleep soon.

CAMHS might be able to arrange for a community psychiatric nurse or even her CBT therapist to help her at home rather than at the CAMHS centre- it's worth asking. Your daughter could also possibly be referred for specialist in-patient treatment on the NHS- she would need to be referred by a CAMHS consultant psychiatrist.

Re. anti-depressant meds, they can actually make sufferers feel much worse for up to 12 weeks and have side effects so aren't always the solution that they seem but it's worth discussing with CAMHS again.

Thinking of you!

Edited by Annabel
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Hi Polar Bear,

No her rituals have been around for quite a long time but have been out of sight so we didn't realise they were getting totally out of hand, but even then she was still leading a normal life until 2 weeks ago. As you can guess she hasn't been to school in all this time. We have been in to discuss it with them and for the moment that is all sorted but again one of my worries is that the longer this goes on, the more daunting it will be to go back and face a barrage of questions. However, that's for another day, at the moment we simply need to get her to 'function' i.e. eat and sleep at something approaching a normal pattern.

Thanks

Ross

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Hi Annabel

Yes the person I spoke to today did mention there are other ways in which we can access the help, I just need to summarise her more recent behaviour and hopefully a psychiatrist will recommend either home visits and/or medication.

Ross

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Guest lizinlondon

Yes side.effects can be bad but when you get it right it can give a new lease of life. Plus some anti-anxiety meds are used temporarily to stabilise someone, that is what they did for me. Helped bring me down to earth so I could do CBT.

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Yes I have read the NICE guidelines and they do say the side effects can make them worse, and as for shame, no I have no qualms, we are willing to try what ever CAMHS recommend, what else can we do? :-(

At the moment it does seem that she is so stressed she can't even begin her rituals so we need to stabilise her initially then work on the therapy for the long term solution.

Ross

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Hi Sally

Yes we guessed that long term helping with rituals is the wrong way to go, but at times, for instance if and when she gets to that stage we need to get her out of there and into bed, the sooner the better. Plus with two younger siblings we need to treat her with kids gloves

At the moment she hasn't been diagnosed with anything else, although she is not getting pretty down, so yet another worry is the thought of depression creeping in. We've started on various work books provided by CAMHS and have shown her the Children's Guide to OCD from this website, and she was present when the GP said it's the most likely cause.

She won't listen to music whilst in the loo, but has started reading as she says it calms her down. However today she hasn't even really read very much.

Thanks

Ross

Don't complete the rituals it will make it worse. It won't help at all.

9 hours in the bathroom is a long time. Did you phone the ambulance or anyone else?

Medication maybe suggested and it is worth considering as it may reduce her anxiety.

The Maudsley hospital is the specialist hospital for OCD. Ask for a referral to them.

I am assuming she does not have any other diagnosis or difficulty.

Do tell her that she is not the only person with anxiety like she has. Does she know she has OCD? Thereis a forum for teenagers on this website. Do tell her she isn't going mad, but that her brain has become hypersensitive and is giving her danger warnings when it isn't needed.

Would anything like music distract her from the constant thoughts? And try not to talk about OCD all the time if she confirms that talking about it makes her more anxious or reminds her of the thoughts she has.

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Guest sophie13

Hi, Dr. Z, I am so sorry you go through this, but at least you know it's OCD and you can help her. In my case, nobody knew what it was... but I have different thoughts.

Well, I strongly advise some kind of anti-anxiety medicine. It will calm her down immediately. You must have read posts about anti-depressants like Prozac, etc, which if not administered properly can give side effects. In fact, with these medicine, the dose have to be increased little by little. I take them I feel better. I was symptom free for years and I relapsed. Yes, she can get better and relapse but you already know what it is and she will know as well and relapses are easier to handle when you know what it is about.

I think she needs meds and CBT. Good luck!

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