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Nothing else left to try but still no better


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Have been reading this forum for about 12 months but have never posted before, dunno why I am today, perhaps things have just got that bad?

My OCD / BDD started when I was 12...I'm now 43. I've 'managed' it for most of this time i.e. hid it, am married with a full time job etc. & no one other than my husband / parents were even aware I have this going on until recently.

When things get on top of me & I get stressed (usually with work) which makes things much worse & I get very depressed. I've now been very poorly for about 18 months but this time I am not getting any better.

I've used NHS Mental Health Services several times over the years (can't afford to go private) & have tried various medications (last one 12 months ago), none of which I've been able to tolerate taking for any length of time as they made my anxiety worse - I'd never had a panic attack until I was prescribed Prozac 15 years ago, but I've had them ever since!

I've been refered to various therapists over the years but none have been any help, the latest being CBT sessions with yet another disinterested therapist who wanted me off his books as soon as I stopped scoring as suicidal because I couldn't travel to his home office for treatment, he certainly wasn't interested in seeing my treatment through to any conclusion & suspended them after 8 because I had 'too much stress going on to achieve any progress'? I thought about asking the Health Trust if I could see another therapist but I'd had to wait well over 6 months to see this guy?!

That was November 2013 & my condition is the same, where do I go for help now? I can't go back to my GP, they made it clear they couldn't help me further when I was unable to continue with the meds!

Everyday I do all the things I've been advised to do to help me get better - healthy diet, gym, meditation etc. & work really hard to reduce the OCD behaviours that take up a massive amount of my time. I've also kept coming into work everyday to try & maintain a routine & prevent becoming housebound, despite works occupational doctor declaring me 'unfit for work indefinately' earlier this year in January.

I hate my life so much & wish I hadn't been found when I overdosed aged 20. Am constantly thinking of doing something similar now to just put an end to my pathetic excuse of an existance!

I'm not looking for any responses, after 30 years I know no one can help me, am just so angry with this all now & need to vent!

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Guest Sisyphus

A lot of parallels there SLS. I'm nearly 43 and just at the start of my 2nd attempt at CBT.

I was diagnosed with clinical depression when I first went the quacks with this thing about 17 years ago. Without batting an eyelid he put me on prozac. After a series of meetings with psycholgists and changing meds I had just had enough of being messed around and no good results so I just ditched it all in one go. thought I'd just have to make the best of it on my own. 15 years later found I had OCD, but it had really taken over completely by then. Had stopped work, just trying to tread water. Seen my savings go up in smoke. Thoughts of marriage, kids, a property of my own - forget about it. Scared no-one will employ me in my old line of work now, or whether I'd cope anyway.

It's very hard to be positive about it all now, but like the guy in Castaway, when all hope is gone, you just keep breathing, putting one foot in front of the other, but it's very difficult somteimes.

It sounds like you've fought this thing very consistently and courageously so at least you know you've done all you could. You deserve a better outcome. I won't patronise you with advice cos it sounds like you already know more than me.

I'm sorry things are so bad.

Did you ever make any in-roads reducing your compulsions using CBT techniques? I'll have to try this soon and I'm concerned about it to say the least.

David.

Edited by Sisyphus
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Hi David, thank you for your post even though I wasn't anticipating anything back on something so negative. I find these forums a bit too 'happy clappy' at times, probably because I've struggled with this illness so long, & at best, have only ever achieved a reasonable level of management which has enabled me to hide it from all but a very small number of people.

That brings me onto your question about CBT...I first came into contact with it 15 years ago & my impression then was that it was just common sense. Basically it helps you develop practical methods to challenge your intrusive thoughts & to moderate and eventually cease the resultant behaviours...simple? However this is an approach I'd developed anyway over the course of my life & what's allowed me to function, at least superficially, in a normal way for the last 30 years.

The recent CBT sessions were pretty much the same. This has been a blow, as with my usual rock bottom self esteem, I'd assumed that I must have missed something 15 years ago, & that this would finally be the answer, or perhaps my therapist was just poor, I'll never know as I can see no point going down that route again?

In some ways going back into the system for treatment has made things much worse this time. Another failed attempt with meds, so no magic pill, & the detailed assessment into the root causes of my condition done this time has resulted in my feeling so angry with everyone...my parents, my husband, my friends, my employer, my GP, my latest therapist etc. Also the expectation of receiving help has had a really adverse impact on my ability to help myself, relying on others has somehow 'switched off' my usual self reliance?

I also now have issues when people talk about OCD free. First of all because most people who talk about this have little concept of what it actually means, what's invovled achieving it, & if it's actually possible at all...at the end of the day we're taliking about my changing thinking processes I've had since I was 12 years old...I simply have no frame of reference for how it feels to think normally? Secondly, & I suppose this is reoccuring OCD theme for me, I worry about who I would be without this? I'm one of the most self disciplined, driven & determined people I know, would OCD free take that away from me or would it just allow me to relax & let go when I wanted to? I even struggle with the concept that I'm ill, & a lot of the time think this is how I'm supposed to be & it's the rest of the world that needs to change...just as it's had to change for other minorities e.g the physically disabled?

Anyway, I wish you luck with your CBT, & if you don't already apply that approach you may find it useful? Needless to say the experience has left me feeling quite hopeless..like i've just been kicked out of the last chance saloon...perhaps I'll get through it, perhaps I wont, but whatever happens it will be down to me...no more going into treatment to appease others when it really doesn't help!

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Guest Sisyphus

Hi SLS,

I find this interesting. A different slant on the whole thing. As you say it's normally a kind of happy slappy, super simple approach, and I must admit I try to aspire to that and hope it's all correct and true. But occasionally I come across what appears to be an exception to the rule, like yourself, and it part terrifies me, but part makes me wonder about the whole thing.

A lot of what you say makes sense - about the way your mind has worked since your 12 so no frame of reference, about the CBT techniques just being common sense(i.e. "just stop doing all the OCD stuff") - I was disappointed when I learned what CBT was to be honest. I hoped there was something more prescriptive - like pills that directly switched off the OCD or something.

And I can totally get how investing yourself in treatment that doesn't work would make things worse. This happened to me with my last lot of treatment. Hard to explain but I take a positive approach to these things, and what with the delays and wot not, it's important to me that it works, so if I get a bad therapist or it doesn't go so well it's a real kick in the nuts for me, and it's not like I just switch back to how it was before, I end up worse, really down, disillusioned, lost, and I've found you can be subject to a fair bit of condemnation as a result too, like everyone assumes it was you who failed or didn't want to get better. My brother laid into me accusing me of this not so long ago. It was so random and unexpected. And then you get paranoid like "oh no, they've all been talking about me and this therapy and clearly they all think IM the problem". So it left me in a bad way all that. The current one does seem better - the lady is markedly better - whether she can help with OCD is another thing but we live in hope - and it's more sessions. I have to give it a go, I have to try and be positive. I have to try and buy into this thing.

That notwithstanding, I can totally see your point of view on all this stuff and I'm so sorry for everything you've been through. I won't attempt to say anything clever or find some wisdom that may have escaped you up till now. You've been at this way longer than me and sound much more clued up about it. I wish I could think of something to help though. I wish there was something, but I'd feel naive trying after everything you've said.

I dunno SLS - I just hope you can find your peace with this thing somehow, whether it's through getting rid of the compulsions or just finding the right balance to live with them.

If you ever want a chat...

David.

Edited by Sisyphus
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Thanks David, I wish you all the best with your battle.

One piece of advice I would give is try not to fall into the trap of believing it's somehow your fault when 'normal' people loose patience with you because you can't be like them. I've found that most of the problems I encounter involve my having to function within parameters in life laid down by the 'normal' majority. These people would just curl up & die if they had to deal with what we have to deal with...it takes a strength of character they couldn't even possibly concieve of to function at all with the noise that goes on in our heads & all the things we feel compelled to do to be 'safe'.

Never shy away from challenging ignorance & misconceptions even if it means having to take on a fight you don't really feel up to. I'm currently battling with my employer trying to get them to put in place measures I'm entitled to under law because my mental health problems are currently so severe that I'm finding them very disabling. I've never asked for help before in over 20 plus years of full time employement so I figure they owe me some time, patience & help now?

In my experience people are so scared of mental health problems that they always just shove you in the 'too hard to deal with' category, & if you can't fit in with their expectations you become a problem they want rid of...don't let them do it!

Next time your brother runs you down like that challenge him about it, 'educate' him with a warts & all description of a typical day in your life & what goes on in your head no matter how crazy it may sound or how uncomfortable it will make both of you feel. Explain to him exactly why simple things he takes foregranted are so difficult for you to do. Also get angry back if that's how you feel, no one has the right to just assume...I always think walk a mile in my shoes & then perhaps you can voice an opinion about my condition, but until then keep you're mouth shut if you've nothing constructive to say!

Anyway, ending on a positive if slightly aggressive note...I've stopped making apologies for being angry about others attitudes & the 2nd class way we are treated, we have every right to be angry!

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SLS, welcome to the forum. I'll try not to be happy clappy, which for me won't be too difficult.

If you want to try anti-anxiety meds again, try to find a younger doctor who's up on the latest meds. Prozac is an oldie. There's newer ones out there that have less side effects.

You've had a bad run with therapists. Some of them just suck. Seems difficult to find ones who are engaged and know OCD well.

Notwithstanding meds, you can go the self help route. You learn all you can about OCD so you understand the disorder. Then you work to understand your own disorder. Then you work to overcome through the elimination of compulsions. It takes commitment.

You have a fear that your life may be changed negatively if you overcome OCD, that you might end up not being the go getter you are today. I experienced the opposite. So much of my brain power was used up by OCD before that when I saw a significant drop in OCD symptoms I found myself full of energy. I could concentrate like never before.

I believe you'll like who you become on the other side of OCD.

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Guest Sisyphus

Hey again SLS,

I had to take my mum shopping and when I came out to the car I realised my radiator had a leak and had ditched all the coolant so was stranded. Fun fun fun. OCD trying to go through the roof obviously. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Some days I just dont have the right head on me to be even dealing with that stuff.

It can be bad enough when Im on my own but hate it when Im responsible for someone else.

One piece of advice I would give is try not to fall into the trap of believing it's somehow your fault when 'normal' people loose patience with you because you can't be like them. I've found that most of the problems I encounter involve my having to function within parameters in life laid down by the 'normal' majority. These people would just curl up & die if they had to deal with what we have to deal with...it takes a strength of character they couldn't even possibly concieve of to function at all with the noise that goes on in our heads & all the things we feel compelled to do to be 'safe'.

I think that's a very good point. I definitely shoulder all the blame for any negative impact this thing has currently. I try and run on all pistons when I really cant, try and keep up when I cant, try and do normal stuff when I cant. And I feel guilty if I fail. I think that's the effect of accommodating this thing with the world of work/school all my life, and not knowing what it was. But it's a good point - never heard anyone talk about that aspect before. I mean you wouldn't expect a person in a wheelchair to climb some stairs so we shouldn't be expected to do certain things, but of course everyone can see the wheelchair and quickly knows the limitations - invisible and very subtle with OCD. I wish there was a quick way of making people understand that it is (a) not a made-up cop out and (b) what it's like, how hard it is. But I guess that's not gonna happen any time soon now is it.

Never shy away from challenging ignorance & misconceptions even if it means having to take on a fight you don't really feel up to. I'm currently battling with my employer trying to get them to put in place measures I'm entitled to under law because my mental health problems are currently so severe that I'm finding them very disabling. I've never asked for help before in over 20 plus years of full time employement so I figure they owe me some time, patience & help now?

Well good for you SLS. You are not only fighting for your basic rights but are spreading awareness of OCD at the same time. Nice work.

I'm not used to asking for help eoither. This period of my life is f###### killing me! Opening up, telling everyone my secrets, saying there's something wrong with me, relying on people for help. It's really not me. Yes I agree it's about time some adjustments were made to reflect your disability(I think we can call it that?).

In my experience people are so scared of mental health problems that they always just shove you in the 'too hard to deal with' category, & if you can't fit in with their expectations you become a problem they want rid of...don't let them do it!

Hell yeah - there was a guy who was moved into the office where I last worked after a mental breakdown and a stay in a facility. Even people who were friendly with him before the breakdown gave him a wide berth by then. The best they could do was make jokes behind his back about axes. I found him interesting though and already felt fairly crazy myself at that point, plus he was a smoker like me, so I went out my way to hang out with him a bit - super interesting and intelligent bloke who'd travelled the world and knew sooooo much.

Next time your brother runs you down like that challenge him about it, 'educate' him with a warts & all description of a typical day in your life & what goes on in your head no matter how crazy it may sound or how uncomfortable it will make both of you feel. Explain to him exactly why simple things he takes foregranted are so difficult for you to do. Also get angry back if that's how you feel, no one has the right to just assume...I always think walk a mile in my shoes & then perhaps you can voice an opinion about my condition, but until then keep you're mouth shut if you've nothing constructive to say!

I like the sound of it but not sure it would go so well. I seem to have 2 speeds - extremely angry, or taking cr#p. I die in that middle ground. I've tried ... hard. for some reason I am not good out there. I did try to defend myself in a non violent or angry way at the time cos part of his beef was that I apparently have an anger problem(because I disagreed with his original gripe basically!), but I didnt do very well. I feel I dont seem to have the fire I used to have when it comes to these things. Running on empty kind of thing. And all this talky clever stuff kills me. I just get angry real quick! If I think Im being unfairly attacked that is. Not at anything! Im not a psycho.

Anyway, ending on a positive if slightly aggressive note...I've stopped making apologies for being angry about others attitudes & the 2nd class way we are treated, we have every right to be angry!

I dig your no-apologies, pragmatic, fight-for-your rights attitude SLS. Take the fight to them.

That said, I really wish I could think of something good to advise you on how to treat the OCD.It p's me off thinking of you having tried the CBT and it didnt work out, and that's that. I wish I knew of something else to try. But maybe youve got it at a place where you can balance it with everything. I truly hope so.

All the best,

David.

Edited by Sisyphus
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Guest jayjay89

Hey SLS

Sorry to hear that you are having a **** time. I'm struggling with a similar issue that I picked from your post - the "what happens if I get better?" I've thought like this my entire life, I have absolutely no reference for a normal brain.

It sounds like you have managed a fairly successful life so far, but wouldn't it be good to not have to manage it? What if you could just have a life? Instead of a struggle?

That's my motivation for keeping trying at treatment, I've run the gauntlet of sh*t therapists, meds that made me sick etc. But the same can be said for mechanics, there are good ones and bad ones. We just tend to expect any therapist to be able to help us, when some of them just suck.

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Hi David - thanks for your comments.

It can be very difficult to vocalise how OCD impacts you. One way to try to help those around you understand is to write it all down and give it them to read. I used this technique at work to try to help them understand why I needed to be treated differently to operate on a level playing field. I was forced into this because my employer was threatening action against me because of a performance dip when my depression reached meltdown. I wrote down all my various OCD 'flavours'and for each of them I made a list of how that flavour effects my day to day life e.g. One of my flavours is contamination which involves hours of cleaning both my flat and myself before I'm able to leave home for work. This often results in my being late, and because I don't drive and can't get on public transport, it also restricts where I can live and the type of work I can do e.g. I can't travel to attend meetings right now. Contamination fears also effect me at work because until recently when I forced the issue and was given my own desk, I had to hot desk which involved me having to spend the first hour of each day cleaning the desk and equipment I'd be using as I couldn't secure the same desk on a daily basis because of my late start time...all of these things are stressful and exhausting when you have to do them on a daily basis?

I then repeated the process for all my OCD flavours (of which there are many, including BDD) and presented the full list to my managers at work. It had the desired impact and helped them to see the sheer volume of barriers I face on a daily basis and how the visable symptoms they see are just the tip of the iceburg. I was then able to have the first sensible conversion I've ever been able to have with my employer concerning practical help they could (and legally should) provide to help me overcome these barriers and stay in work.

Although this process involves full exposure of your OCD, which if you're anything like me will fill you with shame and self loathing, writing it down in a matter of fact way that will make sense to someone else, does help you articulate without the usual confusion and emotion getting in the way. Just try writing it all down in the first instance, you don't have to show it to anyone if you really can't face it?

Hi Polarbear - thanks for your comments.

I'm not being funny but I did mention Prozac was about 15 years back, I'm well aware it's an oldie? The latest one I tried was Sertraline about 12 months ago, like with Prozac my anxiety shot through the roof overnight, but Sertraline had the added benefit of exacerbating my sleep deprevation even further by causing horrific vivid nightmares several times a night every night. After a few months of virtually no sleep I gave up and stopped taking it. Meds don't sit well with me, but unfortunately if you're unable to take them other's perception is that you're not doing everything you could be to help yourself. I see that attitude on forums lke this with many posts urging sufferers to keep trying different meds in an attempt to find their personal panacea...where do you draw the line and accept that a chemical cure isn't for you? This attitude also applies to the medical profession in particular, various GP's have washed their hands of me when I've failed with meds because their limited experience of treating OCD primarily relies on chemical intervention.

Finally, and again, not being funny, but over the last 30 years I've been through the therapy system at least 5 seperate times, the only difference this time was that the therapist concerned was actually aware of OCD so I've been able to obtain my first official diagnosis...bit of a joke after 30 years really?

If I appear cynical about the minimal help out there for us it's not because I'm a 'down' person it's because I've been let down so many times. I simply don't believe the help I need to be rid of this is actually available on the NHS, it would take them too long and cost too much, hence my frustration and anger because I've paid into the sytem all these years and failure to effectivly treat a physical illness would not be tolerated in the same way?

Hi Jayjay89 - thanks for your comments.

I often wonder what my life would have been like if I'd just been able to live it without all these debilitating thoughts and the crazy stuff I feel compelled to do...given my lack of sucess so far I suspect I'll never know. As some have you have suggested in your responses, perhaps achieveing some limited balance and peace of mind is the best I can hope for...lol...unfortunately my OCD perfectionism just won't let me settle for that!

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Guest Sisyphus

Hi David - thanks for your comments.

It can be very difficult to vocalise how OCD impacts you. One way to try to help those around you understand is to write it all down and give it them to read. I used this technique at work to try to help them understand why I needed to be treated differently to operate on a level playing field. I was forced into this because my employer was threatening action against me because of a performance dip when my depression reached meltdown. I wrote down all my various OCD 'flavours'and for each of them I made a list of how that flavour effects my day to day life e.g. One of my flavours is contamination which involves hours of cleaning both my flat and myself before I'm able to leave home for work. This often results in my being late, and because I don't drive and can't get on public transport, it also restricts where I can live and the type of work I can do e.g. I can't travel to attend meetings right now. Contamination fears also effect me at work because until recently when I forced the issue and was given my own desk, I had to hot desk which involved me having to spend the first hour of each day cleaning the desk and equipment I'd be using as I couldn't secure the same desk on a daily basis because of my late start time...all of these things are stressful and exhausting when you have to do them on a daily basis?

I then repeated the process for all my OCD flavours (of which there are many, including BDD) and presented the full list to my managers at work. It had the desired impact and helped them to see the sheer volume of barriers I face on a daily basis and how the visable symptoms they see are just the tip of the iceburg. I was then able to have the first sensible conversion I've ever been able to have with my employer concerning practical help they could (and legally should) provide to help me overcome these barriers and stay in work.

Although this process involves full exposure of your OCD, which if you're anything like me will fill you with shame and self loathing, writing it down in a matter of fact way that will make sense to someone else, does help you articulate without the usual confusion and emotion getting in the way. Just try writing it all down in the first instance, you don't have to show it to anyone if you really can't face it?

Hi SLS,

Thanks for the tip about writing it down. Seems like a good idea. Very brave of you to share all of that with your employers and I'm happy it worked and they respected and accommodated the disorder best they could. This is inspiring.

I've been asked to write down some of my obsessions/compulsions this week by the psychologist, and I'm not crazy about the idea. But what you said about just writing it all down, but you don't have to show it anyone after helped. Could always redo it if I'm not happy with it.

For some reason I still feel the need to deal with these people on equal terms, to maintain some dignity, which is a problem obviously. But Im doing well so far so fingers crossed. I think Im gradually becoming more numb to the humiliation maybe! I hope so. I'm sure it's all nothing they haven't seen before.

And it wasn't addressed to me, but I also agree about the contrast in failure to effectively treat OCD verus a failure to treat a physical illness. Sometimes it feels like there's a kind of tacit acceptance about the whole thing, which doesn't help.

David.

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Meds don't sit well with me, but unfortunately if you're unable to take them other's perception is that you're not doing everything you could be to help yourself. I see that attitude on forums lke this with many posts urging sufferers to keep trying different meds in an attempt to find their personal panacea...where do you draw the line and accept that a chemical cure isn't for you? This attitude also applies to the medical profession in particular, various GP's have washed their hands of me when I've failed with meds because their limited experience of treating OCD primarily relies on chemical intervention.

:taz: Something that infuriates me too

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SLS, I had a marvellous reaction to meds so I do think it's an option. I'm under no illusion that meds are 'the' option. I took ERP and educated myself about my disorder, which I push as the best way to overcome the disorder.

The reason I made a comment about Prozac was I thought that was the only one you had tried. I've seen enough evidence on the forum of people with horrendous side effects to know they're not for everyone.

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I've been refered to various therapists over the years but none have been any help, the latest being CBT sessions with yet another disinterested therapist who wanted me off his books as soon as I stopped scoring as suicidal because I couldn't travel to his home office for treatment, he certainly wasn't interested in seeing my treatment through to any conclusion & suspended them after 8 because I had 'too much stress going on to achieve any progress'? I thought about asking the Health Trust if I could see another therapist but I'd had to wait well over 6 months to see this guy?!

That was November 2013 & my condition is the same, where do I go for help now? I can't go back to my GP, they made it clear they couldn't help me further when I was unable to continue with the meds!

Finally, and again, not being funny, but over the last 30 years I've been through the therapy system at least 5 seperate times, the only difference this time was that the therapist concerned was actually aware of OCD so I've been able to obtain my first official diagnosis...bit of a joke after 30 years really?

If I appear cynical about the minimal help out there for us it's not because I'm a 'down' person it's because I've been let down so many times. I simply don't believe the help I need to be rid of this is actually available on the NHS, it would take them too long and cost too much, hence my frustration and anger because I've paid into the sytem all these years and failure to effectivly treat a physical illness would not be tolerated in the same way?

Hi SLS,

You were seeing this NHS therapist at his home? Certainly for a therapist to pull the 'too much stress elsewhere in your life' card out to discontinue treatment is very inappropriate and suggests the therapist simply 'does not get it'. The only time I think that becomes a valid excuse is if a person is so depressed they cant get out of bed, but that is clearly not your case.

What you do next is give me a shout (if you wish to) to discuss your options, but I think you would benefit from specialist OCD treatment, and I think you are eligible. We may need to fight for you to get it, but if you want the specialist treatment, and are prepared to fight for it, then I will help you and conduct as much of that fight as I can for you. Treatment may mean travelling, which may mean some life disruption, but I always say short term disruption for long term gain if it leads to life without OCD.

I suspect, the quality of treatment you would receive from the specialists is like chalk and cheese to what you have received before. Have you read 'Break free from OCD'? The reason I ask is I wonder how much the CBT principles applied in the book compared to the treatment you have had before? Again I suspect very different.

Meds don't sit well with me, but unfortunately if you're unable to take them other's perception is that you're not doing everything you could be to help yourself. I see that attitude on forums lke this with many posts urging sufferers to keep trying different meds in an attempt to find their personal panacea...where do you draw the line and accept that a chemical cure isn't for you? This attitude also applies to the medical profession in particular, various GP's have washed their hands of me when I've failed with meds because their limited experience of treating OCD primarily relies on chemical intervention.

I am not sure I do see that on our forums, if anything at times myself and mods have been accused of being anti-meds. I think the vast majority of people on this forum are fully aware that the therapy is the key to recovery, the meds a mere tool, which help some, not others.

I find these forums a bit too 'happy clappy' at times, probably because I've struggled with this illness so long, & at best, have only ever achieved a reasonable level of management which has enabled me to hide it from all but a very small number of people.

I also now have issues when people talk about OCD free. First of all because most people who talk about this have little concept of what it actually means, what's invovled achieving it, & if it's actually possible at all...at the end of the day we're taliking about my changing thinking processes I've had since I was 12 years old...I simply have no frame of reference for how it feels to think normally? Secondly, & I suppose this is reoccuring OCD theme for me, I worry about who I would be without this? I'm one of the most self disciplined, driven & determined people I know, would OCD free take that away from me or would it just allow me to relax & let go when I wanted to? I even struggle with the concept that I'm ill, & a lot of the time think this is how I'm supposed to be & it's the rest of the world that needs to change...just as it's had to change for other minorities e.g the physically disabled?

I am sorry that you find the forums 'happy clappy', it is a place people can share their problems and struggles, but I think it is imperative that the forums are a place which is generally a positive place, and gives the message that OCD can be beaten, because believe me, it can.

There are forums and support groups out there where people simply like to wallow in the negative, their prerogative, but how that helps anyone I do not know, and I would hate for our charity to become such a place.

I am not suggesting that becoming OCD free is easy, or can happen overnight it can't, it takes significant work, but with the right help and support a person can get there. I am not quite there myself but I am near as damn it to the point where OCD does not register much now, when at one time my life was controlled by OCD leading me to spend hours doing compulsions, I could not even pick up a telephone due to contamination. Others I know have completely 100% overcome their OCD (through NHS therapy, admittedly specialists).

The key is finding the right help, it's out there, but sadly we do have to fight for it, but if you want it, I will fight with and for you.

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David, work have accomodated me to some degree but not as fully as they would have done if I'd had a visually obvious physical condition or something more common so better understood / accepted...I'm still very much having to fight with them over what's 'reasonable' and will keep fighting until I can function on a par with my peers. Unfortunately that involves challenging a lot of one size fits all corporate policy that inherently discrimates against anyone who doesn't fit in with the 'norm'. Having said that at least some progress has been made using the write it all down approach so I would recomend you try. Don't worry about re-drafting...lol...hate to think how many times I edited my 'final' version dossier before I let my employer have sight...it's what we do, we have OCD!

Also although I'd been driven to this to defend myself against action that would have led to termination of my employment, one positive thing that's resulted in my coming out of the OCD closet in this way is that I've lost some of the humiliation factor. It made me realise just how difficult my OCD is & just how disadvantaged I am because of it. I felt less sense of personal failure and started getting really pi$$ed off about everything around me that makes my life even more complicated and difficult. Now I'm not saying that I'm some helpless victim and the rest of the world is all blame for where I find myself now, but it has contributed considerably and I've now lost patience with that and expect / demand better.

Anyway, try it and see, even if you only use for yourself to recognise and acknowledge the full extent of your condition. It's the only way I've found to communicate to those around me and not end up sounding like some hysterical, incoherant, paranoid person who no one will take seriously.

I know this must all sound such a contradiction from my original 'no hope' post but this is how my OCD has always worked...I see-saw between despair and defience in equal measure and there doesn't appear to be much between those extreems...crazy and often a rod for my own back because the fight is always stressful?

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SLS, on 28 Jul 2014 - 3:28 PM, said:snapback.png

Meds don't sit well with me, but unfortunately if you're unable to take them other's perception is that you're not doing everything you could be to help yourself. I see that attitude on forums lke this with many posts urging sufferers to keep trying different meds in an attempt to find their personal panacea...where do you draw the line and accept that a chemical cure isn't for you? This attitude also applies to the medical profession in particular, various GP's have washed their hands of me when I've failed with meds because their limited experience of treating OCD primarily relies on chemical intervention.

I am not sure I do see that on our forums, if anything at times myself and mods have been accused of being anti-meds.

I think the problem comes from people (well-meaningly) who have benefited from medication who will say "I wouldn't have got anywhere without meds or "You've got to keep trying until you find the right one" "Medication was a life saver for me"

It's rather like the person who says

"I've got a lovely recipe for salmon, I'll give you a copy"

"Thank-you, but I don't like salmon"

"But this one is lovely, me and my Husband love it"

"I've tried it many times over the years but I really don't like it and it upsets my stomach"

"But you'd like this one.....we have it every couple of weeks, it's gorgeous, we love it" I'll print you one off and bring it for you"

Sometimes, because medication has worked well for someone there seems to be a reluctance to accept that it isn't the case for all....so I do understand where SLS is coming from

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Guest legend

I think the problem comes from people (well-meaningly) who have benefited from medication who will say "I wouldn't have got anywhere without meds or "You've got to keep trying until you find the right one" "Medication was a life saver for me"

It's rather like the person who says

"I've got a lovely recipe for salmon, I'll give you a copy"

"Thank-you, but I don't like salmon"

"But this one is lovely, me and my Husband love it"

"I've tried it many times over the years but I really don't like it and it upsets my stomach"

"But you'd like this one.....we have it every couple of weeks, it's gorgeous, we love it" I'll print you one off and bring it for you"

Sometimes, because medication has worked well for someone there seems to be a reluctance to accept that it isn't the case for all....so I do understand where SLS is coming from

I personally wouldnt say these forums are anti-meds in the 10 years ive spent on here

Id say that i , and others have had awful experiences with them , so on that basis its great to see the "overall" picture

of what the benefits and pitfalls of medication has

Fact is meds dont cure ocd . Cbt does , with or without

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Guest Sisyphus

David, work have accomodated me to some degree but not as fully as they would have done if I'd had a visually obvious physical condition or something more common so better understood / accepted...I'm still very much having to fight with them over what's 'reasonable' and will keep fighting until I can function on a par with my peers. Unfortunately that involves challenging a lot of one size fits all corporate policy that inherently discrimates against anyone who doesn't fit in with the 'norm'. Having said that at least some progress has been made using the write it all down approach so I would recomend you try. Don't worry about re-drafting...lol...hate to think how many times I edited my 'final' version dossier before I let my employer have sight...it's what we do, we have OCD!

Also although I'd been driven to this to defend myself against action that would have led to termination of my employment, one positive thing that's resulted in my coming out of the OCD closet in this way is that I've lost some of the humiliation factor. It made me realise just how difficult my OCD is & just how disadvantaged I am because of it. I felt less sense of personal failure and started getting really pi$$ed off about everything around me that makes my life even more complicated and difficult. Now I'm not saying that I'm some helpless victim and the rest of the world is all blame for where I find myself now, but it has contributed considerably and I've now lost patience with that and expect / demand better.

Anyway, try it and see, even if you only use for yourself to recognise and acknowledge the full extent of your condition. It's the only way I've found to communicate to those around me and not end up sounding like some hysterical, incoherant, paranoid person who no one will take seriously.

I know this must all sound such a contradiction from my original 'no hope' post but this is how my OCD has always worked...I see-saw between despair and defience in equal measure and there doesn't appear to be much between those extreems...crazy and often a rod for my own back because the fight is always stressful?

No I totally get the see saw between despair and defiance. And it didn't think it was contradictory, we're talking about 2 different things - the recommended approach, and your personal struggle to get the condition recognised and fight for your rights, somehow live with it. So no contradiction.

I think you've done really well for yourself in the circumstances. Fought your corner.

I still hope that somehow there's still a hope for you to get the upper hand over this thing though cos you deserve better than a struggle. We all do don't we.

And yes I appreciate work didn't go out of their way to accommodate you but you had to fight for it all off your own back. Well done.

I agree that life is much more difficult for us with this than people without. I mean *much* more. So yes, it's tough to be compared like for like in the workplace. You've done well to make them aware and make them acknowledge it. I tried for a lopng time to fit in like everyone else but boy, I made myself ill really. Of course I didn't know I had OCD then, but I knew we weren't in Kansas any more.

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There is a segment of the anti-medication folk who come across as rather militant in their behaviour. The fact is meds have helped a lot people find a new life from this dreaded disorder.

On the other hand, many people have had awful times while on meds. The side effects can be horrendous. I hazard a guess that the number helped is less than the number harmed, based on comments on this forum.

I was at the point with my ocd that I'd be willing to try anything. I gave meds a whirl and they worked beautifully.

Of course legend is quite right in that meds do not cure OCD. They mask it. The monster lurks in our brains, cowering yet desiring to be unleashed again.

Edited by PolarBear
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Guest legend

There is never a militant part of the forum where people say DONT TAKE meds , ever in my lifetime

Im bloody glad they have helped you , and others , ive seen many people take meds and make life changes , ive seen many

people take them and end up commiting sucide

But what i wont see is people going to there GP in the UK and getting meds thrown at them as a cure , and be distracted

from the fact that CBT is the golden key , IMO to recovery

Its an open forum , for discussion , no militancy here, Just Facts

Edited by legend
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There is a segment of the anti-medication folk who come across as rather militant in their behaviour. The fact is meds have helped a lot people find a new life from this dreaded disorder.

This sort of sums up my point really

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Furthermore, I'm beginning to wonder about gps who have little to no psychological training and little to no experience with OCD writing prescriptions for SSRIs and antipsychotics without really knowing what they're doing and without it being part of a bigger wellness plan.

My meds were prescribed by a psychiatrist who monitored me very closely and got me into the only ERP therapy within 500 miles.

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Furthermore, I'm beginning to wonder about gps who have little to no psychological training and little to no experience with OCD writing prescriptions for SSRIs and antipsychotics without really knowing what they're doing and without it being part of a bigger wellness plan.

My meds were prescribed by a psychiatrist who monitored me very closely and got me into the only ERP therapy within 500 miles.

That's a very good point actually that I had never considered before. Should a GP be allowed to prescribe meds, prior to a psychiatrist assessment? I know for some people though, with CBT so hard to get meds is about the only choice they are given whilst waiting for therapy, so I guess for some people it is meds or nothing for months at a time.

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Should a GP be allowed to prescribe meds, prior to a psychiatrist assessment?

Where and how would you draw the line though?

Should they be allowed to prescribe before someone has had an assessment with an endocrinologist, a cardiologist, an obstetrician say?

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Guest Sisyphus

And why do GPs always seem to have a go-to brand of medication? In my case I was dosed up with Prozac within minutes of arriving in my GPs office back in 1997. He even had a little speech prepared about how "people have prozac parties".

Perhaps these go-to brands are what they are told to give people with certain things, or perhaps a medical salesman is involved somewhere along the line? Just idle specualtion obviously :)

Edited by Sisyphus
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