Intrusive thoughts

[SuchFun]

Hi there!

Just wanted to introduce myself and hopefully find some people who are going through or have been though the same experience as myself .

Since September I have been suffering from unwanted thoughts- it drives me insane! I would quite like to wake up one day and have normal thoughts again?! For the last 4 weeks I've been on a 20mg dose of Citalopram and just recently it's been upped to 30mg . I haven't been formally diagnosed with anything but I know I'm not my normal self!

I wake up anxious, dreading the day ahead. Once I start plodding along with the day, I'm okay. But if I'm alone or doing something that requires little attention, that's when the intrusive thoughts and anxiety kicks in again! I'm intensely scared of my thoughts and I have to chant in my head to feel calm but as you can imagine that only leads to a vicious cycle but I find it almost impossible to stop! It's almost like I don't like my mind to be settled!

The intrusive thoughts include: I'm a bad person; I'm a liar; I'm doing the wrong degree. I've asked myself: am I a bad person? I most certainly not! I'm not a liar and I most certainly on track to fulfilling my dream of becoming a primary school teacher . But my intrusive thoughts make me doubt everything! I could tell you I love pink (so true!) and my brain would go into overdrive: you're lying; you hate pink...I hate my brain! The more I get these thoughts I'm scared that I'm going to do something crazy..I'm living life on a very distressing edge! I just want my brain to leave me alone!!

Anyone else been through a similiar thing? Would love to share experiences!

[Guest nettles585]

Hello Suchfun, this sounds all too familiar to me, been there and am going there now. I think most of us have this sort of thing in some form or another. Whatever form we have it in its ocd.

You sound like your doing very well in recognising this is ocd, and that you know in your heart the thoughts that pop into your head arent true.

Have you heard of cbt (cognitive behavioural therapy?) and how do you find the citalopram?

You arent alone, most of us here feel the same way as you and get very similar if not exact symptoms.

Your doing very well (even though it doesnt feel like it), you will get better.

OCD brings out our worst fears, I convinced myself I was going mad, I was a terrible person, I didnt deserve anything.

It does get easier!

[Guest nettles585]

A lot of us with ocd like to be certain, yes or no answers , we dont like the grey areas at times like this.

Im glad to hear you like pink, ocd likes messing with us, and the best way of getting over these thoughts is by not fighting them.

For example 'you hate pink' instead of being like 'well no i dont i love pink' and fighting it, its best for us to leave it alone.

Its like getting in to a heated argument with someone and no matter how much you argue and all those terrible feelings you get, sometimes it just doesnt get resolved. But if you wait until your calm and talk it out and think in a calmer way things get resolved. Does that make any sense?

I feel for you, I understand how you are feeling, and that distressing edge will become a more comfortable easier edge xx

P.S well done for following your dreams, am happy to hear that the primary school teacher stuff is going well

[Guest Hockey30]

Hi SuchFun and welcome to the forum,

What you have described is classic OCD. The inner dialogue feels like it is out of control and makes you doubt everything you thought you believed. No matter how much you tell yourself something about yourself, sure enough, the other internal voice will tell you different. I had the same sort of thing at Uni where, despite maintaining high grades, I would still convince myself at times that I was going to fail.

You aren't going crazy, you are just paying too much attention to the intrusive thoughts. What you now have to work on is accepting that the thoughts are there and not arguing with them, as that simply fuels the fire.

The meds should help with the anxiety and will probably take the edge off of the racing thoughts. Have you looked into CBT? Or getting a few recommended self help CBT books? This will help you to understand what is going on and to help you rationalize your thoughts.

What you have to try and realize is your thoughts are not you, they are just meaningless fireings of the brain. Some of them are positive and some negative, but when anxiety sets in the negatives always drown out the positives.

Distraction is a very good coping mechanism too. The less time sat around thinking about your thoughts the better. Don't give the intrusive thoughts the time of day, and gradually they will become less of a problem over time.

Everyone on here has great advice that will be extremely valid to you and what you are going through, so don't hesitate to ask!

[Guest Hockey30]

Oooops, I replied at the same time as nettles. I pretty much echo what she says, and well done on doing so well at Uni despite suffering with OCD.

[SuchFun]

Thank you for the replies ).

It's tough because I just want to wake up and have a day where I can think about normal things!

I'm being referred to a psychiatrist so I'll see what they suggest ). Perhaps CBT would be useful?

To be honest, Citalopram hasn't made a massive difference? My GP has referred me to a psychiatrist so that they can give me the right antidepressants!

Mornings are the worse! How on earth do you cope with the mornings??

[Guest nettles585]

We all want those days, and those days do come back

CBT is very very useful, it helps you think differently about how you react to your thoughts, which fuel your ocd, which makes you better. Its a difficult process but it really helps.

Im not sure about citalopram, but I understand that a lot of SSRIs take a while to kick in, keep with them at the moment and have a good chat with your pschiatrist when you see him. It may be that it takes a while to kick in, or it may be that something else will be better for you.

Mornings... I feel the same way as you, I always relate it to my minds had a good relax, and my body and mind isnt ready to cope with whatever my brain has cooked up for me over night.

The only thing I can suggest is, your getting bad mornings, get up do something, go. Dont allow time for ocd to sneak in, and after a while mornings will become easier. and with cbt also mornings will get easier.

Its a hard step to take getting the help, and going through with it, but as bad as you feel now, I can honestly say you are sounding quite positive at the moment to me your doing extremely well

There are a lot of websites where you can learn more about ocd and cbt. It may be worth learning more about the illness as knowledge and acceptance is key

Do you know when your seeing the pschiatrist? And sort of know what your going to say? x sometimes ocd gets our tongue too, its important you explain as best as you can how you are feeling and suffering x

[SuchFun]

Thank you again- you are a star!

I'm not sure- I have an appointment next week to see my doctor at Uni and I'll be taking along an open referral form (my family doctor recommends that I go to a psychiatrist- being at Uni is very confusing when it comes to doctors!! ). I'll be going through BUPA (gaaah hate to sound like a snob..but desperate times, desperate measures!) to make sure that I get seen quickly because its driving me insane and with such an important term at Uni, I need all the help I can get!

I'm planning on saying to the psychiatrist pretty much everything I've said here ). That I have unwanted intrusive thoughts which drive me insane and give me anxiety and making me feel low..and I just want to get rid of them!!

[Guest sarah1984]

Hello SuchFun and welcome to the forum,

I also suffer from intrusive thoughts. Like yourself, my thoughts are always much worse when I have too much time on my hands. Keeping busy and finding lots of distraction is a good idea for all OCD sufferers. I can't give you an official diagnosis but it sounds very much like you are suffering from OCD and/or GAD (generalised anxiety disorder). You mention that you are at university. Are the university aware of your problems? I suffered from severe anxiety during my second year at uni and I ended up taking a year's leave of absence. My supervisor and department couldn't have been more supportive. If you haven't already done so, I would recommend speaking to your supervisor asap. Student support services might also be able to help you.

I would always recommend seeking treatment on the NHS before looking into private treatment. Just because you're paying for it, doesn't mean you will get better treatment. The doctors have the same qualifications as those on the NHS - in fact many NHS psychiatrists also do private work on the side. They can also only offer you the same medications that are available on the NHS. I have looked into private psychiatric treatment in the past and I was warned that if I went down the private route, I would effectively rule myself out of treatment on the NHS. I've never had any problems with waiting lists to see NHS psychiatrists - I was told that the waiting list in my area was 2-3 weeks.

I think it's also important to be realistic about how much medication can achieve. Yes, it can take the edge off your anxiety and improve your mood but it won't make the intrusive thoughts go away. You also have to find the right medication for you - meds work in different ways for different people so finding the right med is a case of trial and error. Some people have to try several medications or even combinations of medication before they find the right treatment for them.

I think a big part of your problem is your desire to get rid of the intrusive thoughts for good. When someone first experiences intrusive thoughts, it's natural to want to get rid of them asap. Unfortunately, the more you fight the thoughts the more persistent they become. There's also a scientific explanation for this. When you are afraid to have a specific thought again your body moves into defence mode and starts to produce adrenaline. This causes your muscles to tense, your heart rate and breathing to increase and your thoughts start to race. And what thoughts come to mind? How not to have that particular thought again! When you are scared of your intrusive thoughts and you deliberately seek to prevent their reoccurrence, your body's response actually brings the thoughts to mind.

Here's a list of the ways in which your thoughts and behaviour can encourage an obsession to return:

• If you are afraid of your obsessions
• If you actively fight back against them
• If you deliberately seek to avoid situations that might remind you of them
• If you set yourself a goal of 'never ever' having a thought again
• If you worry about the next time you might have an obsession

A well-known example of the difficulties of thought control is the 'white bear story'. Try as hard as you can not to think of a white polar bear. Do not think about its furry white coat, its shiny black nose and the cute cubs snuggling up to their mum. What happened? I bet you couldn't stop thinking about that polar bear! If it's so difficult to block thoughts about neutral topics such as polar bears you can see how difficult it is to suppress thoughts that cause us distress.

As well as trying to stop their thoughts, sufferers can spend hours ruminating in attempts to reassure themselves that what they fear couldn't possibly happen. Just like thought control, reassurance seeking doesn't work. It may provide a temporary relief from anxiety but sooner or later the mind will find a flaw in the reassuring argument and a nasty voice pops up that says "Ah, but what if....?" For every reassuring argument you can come up with, there will always be an accompanying "What if?" thought.

So if thought suppression and reassurance seeking doesn't work, what does? The most successful strategy is to accept the presence of the intrusive thoughts and to let them be without trying to push them away or engage with them at all. Obviously this is much easier said than done! The best way to learn to do this is via a course of cognitive behavioural therapy (CBT). To learn about CBT and how it is used to treat OCD visit the following page: http://www.ocduk.org...vioural-therapy. The therapist will teach you exposure response prevention techniques (ERP). ERP involves confronting your intrusive thoughts head on (exposure) while resisting the urge to use your usual compulsions to reduce your anxiety (response prevention). The idea behind ERP is that through repeated exposure to distressing thoughts, something called 'habituation' happens. This means that the sufferer's tolerance for the thoughts increases with each exposure and they cause less and less of a fearful reaction. Eventually, through repeated exposure, the thoughts cause little to no anxiety and they don't interfere with the sufferer's life.

The two important things to remember about intrusive thoughts are:

1. It's not the thoughts that are the problem but the way in which you respond to them.
2. You may not be able to control the presence of the thoughts but you can change the way in which you respond to them.

There are two ways to access CBT. First, you can ask your GP for a referral. In certain parts of England, you can self-refer direct to your local IAPT (Improving Access to Psychological Therapies) team. Here's a link to a post with more info on self-referral: http://www.ocdforums.org/index.php?showtopic=50179. The one downside to NHS CBT is that there is normally a long waiting list. I can tell you want to access help asap so you might be interested in reading this page on finding a private therapist: http://www.ocduk.org/finding-therapist. Before looking into private therapy, I would advise you to find out from your GP/IAPT team how long you would have to wait for therapy on the NHS.

You might find the following articles on intrusive thoughts helpful:

1. OCD and thought suppression: http://www.ocdla.com/blog/ocd-thought-suppression-1249#more-1249

2. Accepting intrusive thoughts: http://www.ocdla.com/blog/ocd-anxiety-resistance-1766#more-1766

3. "Thinking the Unthinkable" http://www.ocdonline.com/articlephillipson1.php and "Rethinking the Unthinkable" http://www.ocdonline.com/Rethinkingtheunthinkable.php by Steve Phillipson

Sarah