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Getting over certain cleanliness issues


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5 hours ago, taurean said:

Dave I am currently wearing my OCD-UK enamel lapel badge inscribed with the words "just a thought".( If anyone wants one they, along with similarly worded wrist bands, are available from the store on the main OCD-UK website). 

And that is what all our OCD obsessional intrusive thoughts are ; not the lies exaggerations or revulsions OCD says they are - they are silly worthless nonsense. 

Obviously there are real threats and risks in life, of course there are - but OCD fabricates threats that aren't real ones. 

 

But is touching a dirty bag or getting sprayed by wee or dirty water a thought. It’s a feeling that is given more importance than it deserves right? I just had a shower and went to my room when I saw the internet was working.  It meant I had to move the bin and everything. I couldn’t move the bin but I went downstairs and sorted it. I guess the contamination thing will take time. It is upsetting but I need to just let the thoughts go as a key to a happy life!

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1 hour ago, taurean said:

The thought is the response to those things. The OCD thought is threat involved, my response would be no response (no threat no need to carry out a compulsion). 

 

Ok so I’m trying an experiment. I have touched the light switch by the toilet and I know it isn’t perfectly clean. I know my brother touches it without washing his hands and I’m now back in my bedroom. I’m telling myself that it might not be clean but so what. Nobody has died from it. But the fact that I’m thinking about it I think is the problem. I should just let it go! Let it float away. My parents touch them switches all the time. They are fine. I just need to relax. 

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Yeah, you've got the right idea - there's nothing wrong with acknowledging that you're having an obsessive thought, but once you've identified it as obsessive, you're absolutely right that you should then stop giving it importance and disengage from it.

Edited by bobfish
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So its been an interesting day today. I'm not going to lie. There have been some compulsions done which have broke me out in a sweat (by the way, does anyone else have really sweat drenching anxiety? I have it a lot and makes me so self conscious and uncomfortable) but for the most part I've been trying to fight back. 

Im finding the experiments the hardest to cope with because having to follow through with them without doing the compulsions is very stressful. I just picked a napkin left on the sofa and then grabbed my iPad to type this so that isn't fun but I'm saying to myself see it through!

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Ok so this is just a pain in the **** now. My Dad left his worn work trousers on the side when I was coming up with my new video game and the box or my hand may have grazed them as I walked past. It’s ridiculous because I should just let it go, not wash my hands etc, it’s fine but the more I try and push it out, the more it attaches. I think it doesn’t help that I’m feeling unwell today for other reasons but it’s bugging the **** out of me. May try some of the breathing exercises that my therapist taught me. The real problem with contamination is that you can’t always see it. So there might be many feces bits all over the box that I can’t see and I’ll never know because I can’t see them. Unless I get a black light or something but that’s insane. 

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The real silliness is the wanting to know, the ruminating, agonising. 

All pointless. Because OCD is exaggerating, and trying to build connections that actually are simply nonsense. 

When you get to that belief, stop giving meaning to intrusions, and stop carrying out resultant compulsions -you will be well down that yellow brick road towards recovery. 

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30 minutes ago, taurean said:

The real silliness is the wanting to know, the ruminating, agonising. 

All pointless. Because OCD is exaggerating, and trying to build connections that actually are simply nonsense. 

When you get to that belief, stop giving meaning to intrusions, and stop carrying out resultant compulsions -you will be well down that yellow brick road towards recovery. 

So an example of this would be even though I got a splash or two or urine on my legs while going for a whizz, to just go oh well and carry on like it wasn’t a big deal right?  I kind of find that mad! Like I can’t see logic in that but I’m doing it anyway. 

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Oh well. 2 hours in and I can’t shake the thoughts from my mind. The worst thing is that I’m sure a bit of urine spray hit my legs and because I ignored it and went back into my room, I’m now questioning the possible of whether I spread it around my room. The usual suspect place for panic are my DVDs so if I wipe anything then it will be them. It’s funny. The more I seem to try and take it on, the more pushback. 

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It's the nature of the OCD beast. 

When it is wearing us out, I think it may be best to try and shift focus away from the overthinking and ruminating, and find something to otherwise engage us. 

I used to do puzzles or watch TV or read. Having learned mindfulness, I can now ease my mind into the mindful state, bringing peace rest and recuperation.

Our brain obsesses and compulses in the active "doing"  part, so switching operations to the benign, just "being"  part of the brain, where we just focus in the present in the moment, brings needed rest and recuperation. 

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3 minutes ago, taurean said:

It's the nature of the OCD beast. 

When it is wearing us out, I think it may be best to try and shift focus away from the overthinking and ruminating, and find something to otherwise engage us. 

I used to do puzzles or watch TV or read. Having learned mindfulness, I can now ease my mind into the mindful state, bringing peace rest and recuperation.

Our brain obsesses and compulses in the active "doing"  part, so switching operations to the benign, just "being"  part of the brain, where we just focus in the present in the moment, brings needed rest and recuperation. 

My therapist recommended a mindfulness audiobook to listen to as apparently it can be really useful. I just need to set some time aside to listen to it I guess. 

It does feel like I have a point about the urine spray though. That’s the problem. Because it’s a liquid the motion of the walking could spread it. My therapist said perfectionism is often found in people with OCD so maybe it is my desire to keep things perfect. Part of me wants to say “David, it’s very unlikely I got urine all over my room. It would dried near instantly”. That’s what some people tell me but that’s an IF. However, as much as I know it’s a feeling of disgust, I’m pretty positive everyone would think I’m disgusting if I said I spread droplets of urine around my room. It is disgusting. My DVDs would be disgusting. So I feel the need to clean them. Thing is I know it is harmless and the feeling of disgust is just a thought but I think anyon would be disgusted by it. So telling myself it isn’t disgusting seems like a lie? Does that make sense?

Edited by BigDave
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55 minutes ago, BigDave said:

My therapist recommended a mindfulness audiobook to listen to as apparently it can be really useful. I just need to set some time aside to listen to it I guess. 

It does feel like I have a point about the urine spray though. That’s the problem. Because it’s a liquid the motion of the walking could spread it. My therapist said perfectionism is often found in people with OCD so maybe it is my desire to keep things perfect. Part of me wants to say “David, it’s very unlikely I got urine all over my room. It would dried near instantly”. That’s what some people tell me but that’s an IF. However, as much as I know it’s a feeling of disgust, I’m pretty positive everyone would think I’m disgusting if I said I spread droplets of urine around my room. It is disgusting. My DVDs would be disgusting. So I feel the need to clean them. Thing is I know it is harmless and the feeling of disgust is just a thought but I think anyon would be disgusted by it. So telling myself it isn’t disgusting seems like a lie? Does that make sense?

This is all ruminating. You are trying to rationalize this and make uour compulsions okay. Doing this over-thinking is a compulsion and it needs to stop.

Not washing things is great but it does no good if you substitute hours and hours of ruminating. Thats' still a compulsion and it will keep you maddeningly stuck. 

ERP means exposing yourself to that which you fear and then doing NO compulsions. None. Not a one.

You think you got pee on yourself? You think 'whatever' and you get on with your day. You don't avoid touching things. You don't wash yourself, your clothes or your belingings. And you certsinly don't ruminate.

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11 hours ago, PolarBear said:

This is all ruminating. You are trying to rationalize this and make uour compulsions okay. Doing this over-thinking is a compulsion and it needs to stop.

Not washing things is great but it does no good if you substitute hours and hours of ruminating. Thats' still a compulsion and it will keep you maddeningly stuck. 

ERP means exposing yourself to that which you fear and then doing NO compulsions. None. Not a one.

You think you got pee on yourself? You think 'whatever' and you get on with your day. You don't avoid touching things. You don't wash yourself, your clothes or your belingings. And you certsinly don't ruminate.

I think you really make good points and I do automatically sway to ruminating on every ocassion. Even if I wipe my dvds, Im wondering if my wipe has touched my thigh and the uncertainty kills me. 

I think I’m just scared of overlooking something gross as getting urine on me as OK when actually it is disgusting if that makes sense. It’s like now, I’m thinking of my wipe touched my shorts that has urine on it while I was wiping up and consequently I’ve spread that everywhere. I know I’m overthinking and ruminating. I do. Honestly. I just need to find a way to be confident in my decisions and to stop ruminating. 

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The third angle that OCD uses - after lies and exaggerations - is revulsion. 

But people in general have learned to accept such slings and arrows as just a part of modern living. 

Not so the OCD sufferer who has this theme. It seriously offends them - whereas a non-sufferer or non-sufferer from this theme wouldn't give it time of day. 

In ERP this is where we need to focus our thinking to overcome revulsion. 

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So I thought I'd update on this situation. 

I have actually had a fair few good days but sadly that all came crashing down about 12 hours ago. It's a real shame because things had been going really well and now I just feel really useless that I've buckled. Writing it out just makes me feel more stupid. 

The thing is that I know what everyone will say. It doesn't matter but it seems huge. At 3AM last night, when I went for a pee, after I finished and I was pulling up my shorts, the hand I used brushed against my shirt. And I'm right in thinking that it's not a big deal. I mean it can't be? But yet it seems a big deal. What is worse is that I went back to bed without changing my shirt and then this morning, after sniffing it, I went about and touched a bunch of things without washing my hands thinking I'd be clever. Obviously I don't think I was being clever anymore. 

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30 minutes ago, BigDave said:

 

So I thought I'd update on this situation. 

I have actually had a fair few good days but sadly that all came crashing down about 12 hours ago. It's a real shame because things had been going really well and now I just feel really useless that I've buckled. Writing it out just makes me feel more stupid. 

The thing is that I know what everyone will say. It doesn't matter but it seems huge. At 3AM last night, when I went for a pee, after I finished and I was pulling up my shorts, the hand I used brushed against my shirt. And I'm right in thinking that it's not a big deal. I mean it can't be? But yet it seems a big deal. What is worse is that I went back to bed without changing my shirt and then this morning, after sniffing it, I went about and touched a bunch of things without washing my hands thinking I'd be clever. Obviously I don't think I was being clever anymore. 

 


First of all, congrats on having some good days.  I'm sorry that you are having a rough time after, but thats not at all out of the ordinary for recovery from OCD.  Its not one smooth straight path upward, it involves stumbles and falls too.  You don't have to be perfect, you just have to keep working hard and doing your best to move forward.  After all, two steps forward, one step back, is still one step ahead of where you were.

Meanwhile, you are doing the absolute right thing by challenging your anxieties!  Its great that you didn't change your shirt.  Its great that you made yourself touch things without washing your hands.  Thats absolutely the right approach!  Again it doesn't have to go perfectly, and in the beginning it probably won't.  You are facing down some very strongly ingrained habits and anxieties.  Challenging those is going to take effort and courage.  You are going to feel anxiety because you are pushing outside your previous boundaries.   And yes, that might mean you fall back into using compulsions sometimes too.  Don't worry, no one here expects you to go from zero to hero in one day, or one week, or even one month (maybe not even one year depending on your severity and situation).  The idea is to get better over time by making small improvements.  In addition to challenging your anxieties you can also work on reducing your compulsions.  Lets say your cleanliness anxiety usually involves you taking 5 showers a day.  While the ideal is to reduce it to 1 (fairly normal) or even 0 (hey, its a day for being lazy, gimme a break), for you an improvement would be 4 showers.  And then 3.  And then 2.  And then 1.  Or maybe its hand washing.  Instead of taking 10 minutes, take 9.  Then 8.  Then 7..etc etc. until you are down to a reasonable level.  Same with any other compulsive behaviors you can identify, such as changing clothes, ruminating, etc.  If you can go from your current level to normal in one step, wow, thats amazing, and good for you.  But that would be well outside the norm.  So focus on what you have accomplished so far, forgive yourself for not being perfect (none of us are!) and keep working towards your goal.  You can do this!

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I’m a little annoyed this evening because I had this big plan in my head to really push through and deal with things. 

But tonight, I had two random events that totally through nails in the wheel. I figure it’s my OCD trying to test me but here are the two situations.  

 

1) I was going for a pee and got some urine on the back of my shorts. I carried doing everything no big deal and then without thinking, I backed into the low hanging towel rack. Thinking I got urine on a bunch of towels I through them in the wash. Some may argue that was overkill but I thought that was the decent thing to do. 

 

2)after having a shower, I went to get my meds and my bro (who walks barefoot in the garden and doesn’t wash his feet without someone else doing it was lying on the sofa. I walked past in a panic and I’m not sure but I *think* the bottom of his foot (whole of it) touched my side. I really panicked and ended up using a baby wipe to wash my skin as I was hopeless and changed my shorts. I think probably was overkill. But dirty feet and clean self I wasn’t prepared to take the chance. 

But now I’m angry with myself as I feel like I gave in too easily. I know all I’m doing now is ruminating but it’s just bore out of nothing. And the more I try and block it out the more it sticks and irritates me. What would you have done in my shoes? And do you know any great methods to getting rid of that pesky voice in your head they taunts you?

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1 hour ago, BigDave said:

But now I’m angry with myself as I feel like I gave in too easily. I know all I’m doing now is ruminating but it’s just bore out of nothing. And the more I try and block it out the more it sticks and irritates me. What would you have done in my shoes? And do you know any great methods to getting rid of that pesky voice in your head they taunts you?

Hi BigDave,

Dont be angry with yourself, it's done now, but instead see it as a good thing that you feel you gave in too easily because that shows you that you know you didn't need to do these things (compulsions). With regards to the ruminating, the more you try to block the thoughts the more they will come. Just try and notice them and gently ease away. If you want you could say something to yourself like 'I'm not thinking about that right now' to help you ease away and then continue with what you were doing.  You then repeat that each time the thoughts come. Remember that OCD likes a vacuum, so keep busy with enjoyable or beneficial things. 

Above all, be kind to yourself, it's done, treat it as a learning experience.

 

Edited by Emsie
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24 minutes ago, Emsie said:

Hi BigDave,

Dont be angry with yourself, it's done now, but instead see it as a good thing that you feel you gave in too easily because that shows you that you know you didn't need to do these things (compulsions). With regards to the ruminating, the more you try to block the thoughts the more they will come. Just try and notice them and gently ease away. If you want you could say something to yourself like 'I'm not thinking about that right now' to help you ease away and then continue with what you were doing.  You then repeat that each time the thoughts come. Remember that OCD likes a vacuum, so keep busy with enjoyable or beneficial things. 

Above all, be kind to yourself, it's done, treat it as a learning experience.

 

Thanks Emsie. 

Im intrigued though. My therapist asks me what friends would do in that situation. What would have your reactions been to the situations I provided? Do I want to know the answers?

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11 minutes ago, BigDave said:

Thanks Emsie. 

Im intrigued though. My therapist asks me what friends would do in that situation. What would have your reactions been to the situations I provided? Do I want to know the answers?

You're welcome.

I don't want to give you reassurance because as you know reassurance seeking is a complusion and it doesn't help. But, I have seen people on here survey different reactions to situations as part of their therapy, so I'll answer it from a hopefully therapeutic stand point. 

I would do nothing, I would have no reaction to either situation and it wouldn't be on my radar. As you know, I have OCD but this is not my theme. Btw, I walk barefoot in the garden all the time too. 

I'm glad you are in therapy at the moment, you can do this.

Edited by Emsie
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16 minutes ago, Emsie said:

You're welcome.

I don't want to give you reassurance because as you know reassurance seeking is a complusion and it doesn't help. But, I have seen people on here survey different reactions to situations as part of their therapy, so I'll answer it from a hopefully therapeutic stand point. 

I would do nothing, I would have no reaction to either situation and it wouldn't be on my radar. As you know, I have OCD but this is not my theme. Btw, I walk barefoot in the garden all the time too. 

I'm glad you are in therapy at the moment, you can do this.

Thank you. That’s what I thought too. My therapist gave me 5 points to work with. 

1) what proof do you have that this happened?

2) what proof do you have it didn’t?

3) if you asked a friend’s opinion, what would they say?

4) what do you think the vast majority would say ?

5) in the scheme of things, would this incident matter in 5 years?

and after that, he’d ask if I think there is any better solution in my head. 

That does help quite a bit and I can actually move quite well with that premise. Hence why I was annoyed I buckled so much with the feet thing?

i think it’s the ruminating that gets me hard. I’ve got some breathing exercises but I don’t find them that useful or I’m doing them wrong. I figure I should give mindfulness another go too because I hear a lot of people including Taurean who have said it worked well and my therapist has recommended it too. I’m not sure if it’s just the audiobook I have, the narrator seems quite patronising haha. 

Anyeay im feeling better now. I’m really fighting hard against the pee thing. Just come back into my room after peeing and I’m not caring (much). You are right though! It can be done. I also figure if I can do this, I can do anything. 

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10 hours ago, BigDave said:

 

Thank you. That’s what I thought too. My therapist gave me 5 points to work with. 

1) what proof do you have that this happened?

2) what proof do you have it didn’t?

3) if you asked a friend’s opinion, what would they say?

4) what do you think the vast majority would say ?

5) in the scheme of things, would this incident matter in 5 years?

and after that, he’d ask if I think there is any better solution in my head. 

That does help quite a bit and I can actually move quite well with that premise. Hence why I was annoyed I buckled so much with the feet thing?

i think it’s the ruminating that gets me hard. I’ve got some breathing exercises but I don’t find them that useful or I’m doing them wrong. I figure I should give mindfulness another go too because I hear a lot of people including Taurean who have said it worked well and my therapist has recommended it too. I’m not sure if it’s just the audiobook I have, the narrator seems quite patronising haha. 

Anyeay im feeling better now. I’m really fighting hard against the pee thing. Just come back into my room after peeing and I’m not caring (much). You are right though! It can be done. I also figure if I can do this, I can do anything. 

Hi, you’re welcome. 

Your therapists points to work with are good, I particularly like point 5. 

Yes, it’s the ruminating that gets us hard. It’s a harder compulsion to tackle but it is doable. PolarBear has a very good video on YouTube about stopping ruminating. Just put in ‘how to stop ruminating’ and it will come up. 

Good idea to continue with the mindfulness.

I’m glad you are feeling better. It can be done and it’s good to see it as a positive challenge. Praise yourself for all achievements, however small. 

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