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OCD or Psychosis?


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51 minutes ago, PolarBear said:

Why do so many think there must be something worse than OCD going on? Why must it be psychosis or schizophrenia or something else? Is OCD not bad enough a diagnosis?

Look, OCD is bad. It's as bad as it gets. It's a serious mental disorder... as serious as any other. 

Hey PB,

I don't think it's a case of many thinking there's more going on but worrying there's more...as far as I'm aware, worrying about having psychosis, schizophrenia etc is quite a common theme of intrusive thoughts? 

I certainly agree that OCD is a bad enough diagnosis, I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. I really do reckon the psychosis/schizophrenia fear though is just another spin on intrusive thoughts. 

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12 minutes ago, Skullpops said:

I really do reckon the psychosis/schizophrenia fear though is just another spin on intrusive thoughts. 

It is a very common concern, not necessarily a fear but where a sufferer thinks that their thoughts must be caused by some sort of psychosis.  It is also evidence of a lot of rumination accompanying an intrusive thoughts.

My concerns for Anna are that she doesn't seem to be managing to move forward towards changing the way the thoughts are responded to.  .We see a doubt/fear/intrusive thought and the compulsion (often a question) and this pattern repeats.  I know that that is what happens when we are OCD sufferers but we can change this but to do that we have to change the response.

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I'm aware of people who get intrusive thoughts about having other mental illnesses. This is different. I don't mean to pick on one person; I've seen this raised before, where people say,  but it can't be just OCD. My question is, why not?

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6 hours ago, PolarBear said:

I'm aware of people who get intrusive thoughts about having other mental illnesses. This is different. I don't mean to pick on one person; I've seen this raised before, where people say,  but it can't be just OCD. My question is, why not?

I'm with you now. 

My answer to your question, it's my opinion of course, not sure if I'm correct. 

I'd say it all boils down to extreme anxiety, which we know is classic OCD. When the thoughts get too much, when compulsions take over, sufferers feel they are "losing their mind." Perhaps it's at this point concerns begin about "what if there's more than OCD at play here?" 

 

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14 hours ago, PolarBear said:

I'm aware of people who get intrusive thoughts about having other mental illnesses. This is different. I don't mean to pick on one person; I've seen this raised before, where people say,  but it can't be just OCD. My question is, why not?

Honestly PolarBear I wasn't asking for reassurance! I was just speculating that it met the criteria for psychosis. I don't fear Schizophrenia or Psychosis and have never had obsessions involving these worries.

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I never said you were having obsessions about other mental illnesses.

You have to get a bit resl here. What were you wanting from us after your first post in this thread? Didn't you expect us to respond? So what were you looking for? I believe you wanted confirmation that your fears were true and we thought you had psychosis, or you were looking to be told that it's just OCD, which would make you feel better. That's reassurance.

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1 hour ago, Lynz said:

So true, PB. The World Health Organisation classifies OCD as the 5th most debilitating mental illness in the world. That's bad enough for me.

Interestingly, I see that women aged 15-44 are ranked considerably higher than males & females outside that age group? I wonder why for the rest of us, we are ranked 10th? 

OCD ranks tenth in the World Bank’s and WHO’s ten leading causes of disability and, in the case of women aged 15–44 years, OCD occupies the fifth position.

 

 

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10 hours ago, BelAnna said:

Honestly PolarBear I wasn't asking for reassurance! I was just speculating that it met the criteria for psychosis. I don't fear Schizophrenia or Psychosis and have never had obsessions involving these worries.

Just as a point of interest, what response/feedback/outcome were you wanting from creating the thread Anna?

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8 hours ago, felix4 said:

Interestingly, I see that women aged 15-44 are ranked considerably higher than males & females outside that age group? I wonder why for the rest of us, we are ranked 10th? 

OCD ranks tenth in the World Bank’s and WHO’s ten leading causes of disability and, in the case of women aged 15–44 years, OCD occupies the fifth position.

 

 

I notice the rankings are measuring how disabling the illness can be, so I'd imagine the difference is because in the majority of countries younger women do most of the child-rearing/running the household/looking after elderly relatives etc., and if they get an illness such as OCD then the effects are more devastating not only to them but to the wider family and children.

Edited by Lynz
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Belanna’s initial question does seem to have particular relevance in the context of comorbidity. That is in situations where a person has more than one mental health diagnosis. In the case of OCD, the most common comorbid conditions are  depression followed by the other anxiety disorders. A person might have personality disorder, bipolar or schizophrenia as well, although these are less common co-conditions. 

Edited by Angst
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I remember reading about how people with OCD can have varying levels of insight into their condition. The degree to which they believe their fears are likely? Which shares features with delusional thinking/loss of touch with reality/psychosis. And that lack of insight could impact successful CBT outcomes. It might help explain why some people can do poorly even with multiple rounds of CBT.

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On 14/09/2018 at 01:41, Caramoole said:

Just as a point of interest, what response/feedback/outcome were you wanting from creating the thread Anna?

Hi Caramoole,

I wasn't looking for reassurance that my worries were unfounded, I was just feeling fed up with the fact that I consistently believe things to be true that are not true!

I was also speculating whether severe OCD with low insight could really be categorized as psychosis, just as severe Depression can slip into psychotic Depression. I guess the difference is that on some level we are aware that our fears are irrational.

I find it upsetting when family members say that at times my OCD is bordering on Psychosis but maybe recognizing this is helpful when labelling my thoughts as irrational and working on distracting myself from the thoughts and accepting the anxiety.

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On 12 September 2018 at 00:56, BelAnna said:

I have a recurring thought that I might have given my dog human medication (e.g. paracetamols). Just now I was sitting down on the sofa, next to my Mum's handbag (which has some tablets in it) and had an intrusive thought in which I pictured giving my dog tablets to eat and now a small part of me is unsure whether it's true or not. 

As this is so silly but I still partly believe it then surely although this is OCD, it is also psychosis?!

 

Your theme is very similar to mine, something I have been struggling with that truly is irrational, but I've had it all my life I get intrusive thoughts and think they have taken place, if you look into reality monitoring its a compulsion that is done to make sure, things haven't occured, I literally used to have to ask if I had left a room in the last five minutes, it's almost like a day dream and you coming to, you are not aware of your surroundings so the anxiety plays on that and made me feel something had transpired, yeh I was referred to a psychosis team initially but it is ocd, it's very obscure in how it's distorting your perception, I even handed myself imto the police once that didn't go well.

 

unfortunately it's the same crux of all ocd issues - uncertainty and anxieties manipulation of that uncertainty the mechanism to beat it is still the same treating it as it were psychosis is an error. Lack of insight is possible a good rule of thumb is if the thoughts are coming with anxiety treat it as an ocd issue

 

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44 minutes ago, Sparklesmango said:

Your theme is very similar to mine, something I have been struggling with that truly is irrational, but I've had it all my life I get intrusive thoughts and think they have taken place, if you look into reality monitoring its a compulsion that is done to make sure, things haven't occured, I literally used to have to ask if I had left a room in the last five minutes, it's almost like a day dream and you coming to, you are not aware of your surroundings so the anxiety plays on that and made me feel something had transpired, yeh I was referred to a psychosis team initially but it is ocd, it's very obscure in how it's distorting your perception, I even handed myself imto the police once that didn't go well.

 

unfortunately it's the same crux of all ocd issues - uncertainty and anxieties manipulation of that uncertainty the mechanism to beat it is still the same treating it as it were psychosis is an error. Lack of insight is possible a good rule of thumb is if the thoughts are coming with anxiety treat it as an ocd issue

 

That makes sense- thanks Sparkles. It sounds like you've had been through a really difficult time with OCD.

I can completely relate to the asking whether you have just left a room- I have had OCD for most of my life but the less realistic symptoms are quite a problem at the moment and I feel embarrassed that I look and sound 'crazy' when I feel distressed by my OCD at the moment. Obviously OCD always causes doubt but it's the Thought Action Fusion and false memories that I guess fall at the extreme of OCD doubt, which I'm so bothered by at the moment! 

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