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The disorder, is perpetuated by, compulsions.


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No. You need to stop carrying out compulsions, sure - but that's just part of the B - behavioural - side of Cognitive Behavioural Therapy. 

We also need to understand the C - cognitive side of OCD ; how it works, why it affects us. And stop connecting with, giving belief to, OCD intrusions. 

And we need to work towards disarming the triggers that flow from a false exaggerated or revulsive OCD core belief. We do this by structured sessions of exposure and response prevention, another part of the B in CBT. 

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13 hours ago, humbleno1 said:

So the simplicity of it is if you stop compulsions you have beaten the disorder? yes?

As the others have said, I am afraid it's not that simple.  Think about it this way, what drives the need to carry out compulsions?   We don't do them because we want to, we do them because we feel we have to, because we are compelled by a feeling or an intrusive thought, i.e. 'obsessions'.

So whilst stopping compulsions is part of the end game, if we don't deal with the reason we need to carry out compulsions (i.e. the obsessions) then the OCD will either shift to some other theme or the compulsions will be back quickly. 

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Guest OCDhavenobrain

 No compulsions = no OCD. Now some will say that there are beleifs. Those beliefs won't last if you don't do compulsions. 

 

The thing is that there are a few anxietydisorders and having thoughts and beliefs are not limited to OCD-sufferers 

The B is a really tricky thing. Because as easy as it can help you it can also been used against you of your OCD. And you are back with the realisation that you need to sit with the anxiety

Edited by OCDhavenobrain
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Guest OCDhavenobrain

I am not trying to be provocative it is just that I am more often seeing sufferers being stuck with the notion they need to get there therapy right (thoughtprocess) before they can start the work than I see it helping. Now I am strongly biased because I am mostly seeing people who suffers and not those who have recovered

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I guess im kind of a different opinion in this, while understanding why you are doing compulsions can be meaningful. If the thoughts are truly meaningless, which I think they are, and simply a fight or flight response, then surely any investment in there reason or validity, is feeding the disorder? I mean I think that in the UK there is still a strong notion to, "figure things out", almost a freudrian practice. The experience I had and im by no means an expert and I could be wrong here, is that ocd is simply behavioural, meaning if you change your behaviour you will no longer have it. I accept there are many ways to approach the disorder, and you have to find out what best works for yourself.

I think above cutting out compulsions, true acceptance and mindfulness would probably overcome the disorder alot quicker.

This article by fred penzel which i disagree with that ocd is chronic as I do think it can be fully overcome, I really like the sentiment that, with true acceptance it is 80-90 percent of the work, it reminds me of the film "a beautiful mind", only at the point when John Nash accepted his mind was impaired could he overcome.

 

http://www.wsps.info/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=53:acceptance-and-ocd&catid=0

Edited by humbleno1
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Guest OCDhavenobrain
On 17/10/2018 at 16:12, humbleno1 said:

I guess im kind of a different opinion in this, while understanding why you are doing compulsions can be meaningful. If the thoughts are truly meaningless, which I think they are, and simply a fight or flight response, then surely any investment in there reason or validity, is feeding the disorder? I mean I think that in the UK there is still a strong notion to, "figure things out", almost a freudrian practice. The experience I had and im by no means an expert and I could be wrong here, is that ocd is simply behavioural, meaning if you change your behaviour you will no longer have it. I accept there are many ways to approach the disorder, and you have to find out what best works for yourself.

I think above cutting out compulsions, true acceptance and mindfulness would probably overcome the disorder alot quicker.

This article by fred penzel which i disagree with that ocd is chronic as I do think it can be fully overcome, I really like the sentiment that, with true acceptance it is 80-90 percent of the work, it reminds me of the film "a beautiful mind", only at the point when John Nash accepted his mind was impaired could he overcome.

 

http://www.wsps.info/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=53:acceptance-and-ocd&catid=0

Couldn't agree more. I really dislike Freud and the fact that psychology STILL let him impact so much, he is a fraud. 

Studies even show that talkingtherapy doesn't work. 

But I also have to agree with those who talk about the cognitive sid eof overcomming this disorder, it is just that I don't think there is that much to dwell on there, and I OFTEN see people dwelling on it and it just becomes a part of the obsessions. I am a strong believer in ERP I really do think that it is what it takes to overcome OCD. Exposure exposure exposure

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I  believe that ERP won't work unless we fully understand, and accept, how OCD works in our case. 

The purpose of ERP is to convince the sufferer, through therapy, that the fears and/or revulsions suggested by the OCD are lies and/or exaggerations, such that we no longer react strongly, negatively, emotionally to the triggers connected to them. This won't happen without the cognitive knowledge first being understood and accepted. 

I don't agree with no brain that we might end up overthinking and obsessing about the cognitive side - this may be so for some, but not generally I don't think. 

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3 minutes ago, taurean said:

I  believe that ERP won't work unless we fully understand, and accept, how OCD works in our case. 

The purpose of ERP is to convince the sufferer, through therapy, that the fears and/or revulsions suggested by the OCD are lies and/or exaggerations, such that we no longer react strongly, negatively, emotionally to the triggers connected to them. This won't happen without the cognitive knowledge first being understood and accepted. 

I don't agree with no brain that we might end up overthinking and obsessing about the cognitive side - this may be so for some, but not generally I don't think. 

It depends when you say understand, I know some therapists that, when someone is going through HOCD, or POCD, would maybe draw the conclusion the person is having some sort of sexual identity crisis. I have had this before.

The NHS from my experience is clueless in OCD, I was assigned to a psychosis team, and had a "nurse" playing freud in my home.

If your talking about understanding your fear, that oh you fear being ostracized or you fear responsibility, thats great, that will help. But any more time dwelling on that, is I think an indulgence of a therapist, thinking hes in some kind of hollywood movie, while we sat on his proverbial couch.

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Guest OCDhavenobrain

I do agree with the cognitive side being important. Just take a child with OCD and one can see how important knowledge about the condition before she/he can give it less importance. But beside that I really do think that many of us just get obsessed about it being "right" about the cognitive side, needing more knowledge about how it works and why and so on. 

 

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Guest OCDhavenobrain
2 minutes ago, humbleno1 said:

It depends when you say understand, I know some therapists that, when someone is going through HOCD, or POCD, would maybe draw the conclusion the person is having some sort of sexual identity crisis. I have had this before.

 The NHS from my experience is clueless in OCD, I was assigned to a psychosis team, and had a "nurse" playing freud in my home.

 If your talking about understanding your fear, that oh you fear being ostracized or you fear responsibility, thats great, that will help. But any more time dwelling on that, is I think an indulgence of a therapist, thinking hes in some kind of hollywood movie, while we sat on his proverbial couch.

THis is such a terrible thing to happen to an OCD-sufferer. I can just imagine how many of us who get therapists who don't have a clue. About 20 years ago it was popular to engage with "false memories", going in therapy so one could figure out if something happened in early childhood. I am afraid many many people with OCD got stuck with this kind of therapy. It's bad. 

Agree with you about Freud, personally I can't take psychology 100% serious til the day they stop using Freud and his methods. Studies actually shows that talking about things "freud-style" is contraproductive. IT actually hav e alot in common with compulsions, feel good in the moment but do more harm than good in the long run.

 

I am sorry that your therapists was so useless in your case. Try to shake it off as soon as you can, I can promise you that there are A LOT of those people, it is like yourself said psychiatry have MUCH to learn when it comes to OCD.

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