Jump to content

Asbestos contamination/ERP questions


Recommended Posts

Hi

New member here and would be really, really grateful for some advice. For many years I've suffered from anxiety about contamination by hazardous substances, diseases and parasites, and I tend to focus heavily on a particular topic before moving on to another one. Now I have a children, the anxiety its getting worse and worse and I now spend most of my time worrying about them rather than me. Since the summer I've been particularly focused on asbestos after a few unlucky episodes where I was exposed to it - one where I spotted loads of the stuff and reported it (later confirmed) after I was already covered in dust. This led to months of behaviours I now realise may be compulsions - throwing away clothes, bagging clothes, wiping my car, vacuuming, running an air purifier, endless internet research, precisely calculating risks to me and my family, checking all buildings on google to see if they are pre-1980's before visiting them etc. I've started to worry constantly (pretty much every waking moment for months now) about my child's nursery, which is in a 1960's/70's building that is fairly likely to contain some of the more dangerous types of asbestos. I've had some sessions of CBT which haven't helped much yet, but I can see how ERP potentially could help for some of my issues like lead paint, dog poo and lyme disease. I have a couple of questions that I would be really interested to hear others' thoughts on:

  • As my anxiety if now largely focused on my children’s health rather than my own health, what is the best way to go about ERP for this? e.g. I think I could probably expose myself to lead paint relatively easily now, but the thought of one of my children touching old paint and then not washing their hands fills me with anxiety.
  • What would be the best way to go about ERP for asbestos? It really is hazardous in tiny amounts so not good to expose yourself too, and you can’t see the effect (or lack of) on health for decades so it’s not easy to dismiss fears after, for example, spending time in an old building.
  • How/where do you draw the line between thoughts caused by OCD and taking action on something that might actually be a risk? I have emailed the nursery a couple of times for reassurance about their asbestos. They have responded saying they don’t think there is any, but they don’t appear to be actually doing what they legally are required to do (have asbestos surveys and keep a register of locations etc.). I quite often see workmen drilling into things like old panels with the nursey windows open etc., which sends my anxiety through the roof. This absolutely could be a major health risk to the children but no-one else apart from me seems worried! I guess the ERP approach would be to try to ignore it rather than seek further reassurance, but what does everyone think would be the best approach?
Link to comment
Guest OCDhavenobrain

Asbestos have been a huge thing/trigger for me. The problem I have found with obsessing aobut things and trying to keep yourself safe is that the "need of safety" always increases. One day it is not enough to not being aroud unmoved asbestos. Then you can't be in old buildings or you can't go past a constructionsite. And then you can't entering any building - which buildings are safe (probably best to be safe and not entering any - just to be safe). Later on you start to think/doubting about other hazardous compounds. What about plastic and so on and so on. My point is that THE DOUBT will never just be contended with you answering it once and for all, it will always come back with some other question. 

You accept that asbestos is dangerous (this will probably be easy for you), then do you follow the guidelines around asbestos, but do NOT try to "make your own opinion" about it. Follow what the experts are telling you or it will just end up with you questioning the experts and you are back to square 1. By the way, stop contacting people about buildings and sites where there can be asbestos, you will probably feel a rush of reassurance if it turns out that there are no asbestos, but this will only last for so long and you will very quickly be back doubting. 

I first thought that you were an old member, this topic is not new, you are not alone with the fear of asbestos and other chemicals. So I need to welcome  you to the forum! 

Edit: Edited a bit.

Edited by OCDhavenobrain
Link to comment

Thank you for you useful advice  OCDhavenobrain - I really appreciate it. No, not an old member, so thanks for your welcome! I've had a pretty difficult few days and haven't thought about much else really, which I'm sure has affected my family's Christmas too. I can see that I need to stop asking about buildings for reassurance, as you say. At the moment I'm assessing every building I go to for it's age and likely risk - that's why I'm spotting asbestos hazards that no-one else seems bothered about. I find it very difficult when I can see that people aren't even following the basic laws on asbestos management and knowing when I should try to step in and do something or just let it go. I guess good ERP for me would be to try to spend time in old buildings and force myself not to analyse the surroundings for asbestos etc.?

Link to comment

Welcome to the forum.

Before you work on ERP, you need to work on slowing down and stopping your compulsions. Your first post is littered with compulsions you do.

Researching the age of buildings and Googling about asbestos are two of them. You don't need to do that. No one else does. It is an overblown reaction to something with minimal risk. 

Link to comment

Thanks Polar bear, will try. Have started working on reducing some of the things I do such as internet research - not very successful so far but early days. Because my main anxiety is focused on the health of my family and putting them at risk of asbestos contamination/not doing enough to prevent it, not doing the compulsions makes me feel extremely guilty as well as anxious. I know the risk to them is either low or not really in my control but it's not easy.

Link to comment
Guest OCDhavenobrain

 

How I would approach it. Forcing yourself not to researching when you are anxious could be the first step. Then entering any building you want to entee could be the second step. And suddenly you are able to go past constructionssites. 

Also all the mental rumination/thinking about asbestos have to stop. You are wasting your time. 

Link to comment
23 hours ago, OCDhavenobrain said:

 

How I would approach it. Forcing yourself not to researching when you are anxious could be the first step. Then entering any building you want to entee could be the second step. And suddenly you are able to go past constructionssites. 

Also all the mental rumination/thinking about asbestos have to stop. You are wasting your time. 

Thanks for the advice, will try! I think those steps could be something I could potentially do... The ruminating/thinking is a bigger challenge though. Pretty much constant at the moment (even find myself unintentionally assessing buildings I see on TV for likely risk!).

Link to comment
Guest OCDhavenobrain
On 29/12/2018 at 22:47, Rob77 said:

Thanks for the advice, will try! I think those steps could be something I could potentially do... The ruminating/thinking is a bigger challenge though. Pretty much constant at the moment (even find myself unintentionally assessing buildings I see on TV for likely risk!).

Sounds like me when I had the fears. Very intrested in the collapse of World Trade Center because those had asbestos and I "compared" them to my risk home with some building I enters. Bizarre really. U need to stop the analyzing

Link to comment

Yes, I've had very similar thoughts too - you're right about the need to stop analysing. Having now researched it so much it's very difficult not to notice it (saw some today in a relative's house - I was desparately trying not to think about it but couldn't help noticing it - and of course then felt highly anxious). Will keep working on reducing my ruminating and see how it goes.

Link to comment
On 27/12/2018 at 20:06, Rob77 said:

I have emailed the nursery a couple of times for reassurance about their asbestos. They have responded saying they don’t think there is any, but they don’t appear to be actually doing what they legally are required to do (have asbestos surveys and keep a register of locations etc.). I quite often see workmen drilling into things like old panels with the nursey windows open etc., which sends my anxiety through the roof. This absolutely could be a major health risk to the children but no-one else apart from me seems worried! I guess the ERP approach would be to try to ignore it rather than seek further reassurance, but what does everyone think would be the best approach?

Nobody has full control over what they are interested in/what they do. Hypervigilance about legitimate dangers isn't the worst form of OCD, especially if it legitimately results in tangibly lower risk. It could to enrich your scientific knowledge, if you got it bad enough you might even become an expert yourself and make progress in the field. Or you could start an asbestos awareness group or something like that. I wouldn't bother trying to attack this form of OCD, it will likely run its course eventually. Like people have hobbies they get obsessed with that don't particularly make them feel good anymore, it's not bad as a hobby, most people would rather watch tv!   

If you genuinely believe there may be a health risk to children or others, you should definitely make enquiries and try get to the bottom of it. Even if it turns out to not be the case, you might inspire some awareness or expose something that appears to be lacking here in any case with what you've described. 

It's funny how some people seem to be so cautious and concerned about every tiny little aspect of risk to the point of pointlessness and then you have the other extreme - people who couldn't give the slightest toss, they'll just drill anywhere or do anything. To try to be somewhere in the middle of that, where you have a rational and cautious approach that doesn't get into risks that are less likely than being struck by lightning  And this is mirrored in safety laws and policies sometimes - with very banal regulations for some things and totally feckless ones for others - you could be one to expose that. Just don't expect to do so and don't come in like some crazy guy because it might actually be perfectly safe. 

Edited by SuperInfinity
Link to comment

Cheers Superinfinity, some interesting and good advice there, and I like the way your're thinking about the positives. As you say, it's trying to get to a good middle ground on the worry front (at the moment I'm thinking and worring about it 90% of the time, so would definitely like to cut that down). I'll try to take sensible actions where I feel there's a genuine risk but I need to work on then reducing the ruminating and 'move on' once I've taken sensible actions/precautions that are within my control.

Link to comment

Ah, but you will easily slip into taking sensible precautions every time. That's the risk you run. You could easily begin justifying compulsions at every turn. And that will only keep you stuck.

People with contamination OCD are so far over on one side of the caution scale that moving to the centre won't work... It's simply too close to that side. What you need to do is move yourself far over to the other side, where there are no compulsions and stay there for a good while.

Link to comment

Hi Rob, welcome to the forums.  Sorry to hear about your struggles.  It sounds like you have some good knowledge about OCD given that you are aware of things like ERP and CBT.
ERP in relation to actually dangerous situations can be a bit tricky.  The key of ERP requires us to push past what we feel comfortable, but when it comes to certain things sometimes the right thing IS to feel comfortable.  Unfortunately one problem for the OCD sufferer is struggling to know where that line is.  If your OCD fear was about exposure to marshmallows it would be totally reasonable form of ERP to make you breathe and eat a marshmallow.  Obviously thats not reasonable at all for asbestos.  So how do you do ERP in this situation?  I think there are two options (and you can combine them).  

The first, which you can do on your own, is imaginal exposure.  In this type of exposure you'd record yourself describing in as much detail as possible an asbestos related scenario that causes you to feel anxiety just hearing it.  Then you listen to that recording repeatedly and work on sitting out the anxiety without engaging in compulsions.  Over time the recording should no longer cause you anxiety, in which case its time to come up with an even more detailed, anxiety causing recording.  You repeat this experience until you are comfortably able to handle intrusive thoughts and situations related to your trigger.  Imaginal exposure is safe and effective, but it might not be as rapid as real life ERP scenarios.  You can find more detailed guides for this online or in various self-directed CBT help books.

Second is traditional ERP, where you put yourself in real situations that might trigger your anxiety.  The difficulty here is drawing the line between legitimate ERP and dangerous actual exposure.  The best way to handle this is to engage in ERP thats done with a trained medical professional such as a therapist or doctor.  They will know what types of activities are reasonable and which aren't and can help you come up with a plan.  It doesn't mean you can ONLY do exposure scenarios in their presence (though some situations might require that) but it will allow you to have a list of activities and steps which are both reasonably safe for you but also will require you to step outside the comfort zone of your OCD.  You mentioned that you had had some sessions of CBT (give it time, the skills take practice and it might be awhile before you really get the hang of it!) so a good first step would be to discuss this with your therapist.

Of course, as PolarBear wisely points out above, there are many parts of OCD to address in your recovery, and you might not be at the point where you are ready for ERP.  Though its tempting to want to dive in to get rid of any OCD its also important not to get too far ahead of yourself.  Keep in mind, OCD recovery is a marathon, not a sprint.  Best of luck moving forward!

Link to comment

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...