How do I know? - Merged Thread

[don't know]

Yes, another post from me. 

I've posted on other sites and they say I have OCD or some anxiety condition. I don't trust their judgement though. I have been diagnosed once and twice have been told that it's not OCD. I have read many many articles, blogs, books to educate myself about OCD - each time I can't relate. 

How do I know I'm not in denial or using this to cover up my true intentions or what I was supposed to be? It seems as though everything in my life is telling me that I'm attracted to family members. It's not a 'what if' it's a genuine worry at this point. There's nothing to disprove that at this point. I can't get off to normal sexual thoughts, nothing turns me on and I feel as though anytime I do feel something for a guy it's false. I'm shaking writing that out. I'm scared to get into a relationship or have sex because if it goes bad or doesnt feel right it's means that all of this was right and I have to commit incest. All my dreams have surrounded the topic, I look up things to see if I'm aroused and it seems like I am. I read articles and that about people that thought they were normal but actually did have sex with a family member and really enjoyed it. Is that me? I get aroused by these thoughts. I don't like to fantasise about it but upon further research fantasises don't prove or disprove anything (that's makes me worry), so either I could end up doing these things. It feels as though everything is fake. I'm sorry for posting. I don't even know why I still bother posting especially when it's not OCD. I'm wasting people's time - I guess I would rather have something to blame this on rather than facing the harsh reality that this is me. I hate it so much, but it's probably something I'll get used to. 

[Ollie46]

I’m really feeling for you right now, my friend, the place you are in is a horrible one  At the risk of seeming harsh, I think you need to start taking some of the advice I’ve seen people give to you many times on this forum. Clearly you are experiencing very damaging anxiety and it’s warping your sense of self, something I think most people here can relate to. But you have to listen and stop posting here with a seemingly aimless, nihilistic attitude. You post here because you have OCD and you know it, despite what you say. Please, for the sake of your own sanity listen to what people have been saying to you. You should also try and be gentle with yourself, some self-compassion goes a long way. This ride is not an easy one but you must commit to at least trying, we can only offer guidance, change must come from within you. If you keep coming back, we’ll only say the same thing over and over. Try to recognise your compulsions, they can be subtle beasts. After recognising them, distract yourself and allow your anxiety or discomforting feelings to be there. And above all, practice being kind to yourself  

[malina]

Hey DK, 

I'm sorry to see that you are feeling so horrible. I think that you need to get some support. You are not going to feel better with how things are going right now. If I was you, I'd go speak to a professional about this, regardless of what you believe your problem to be. You can give them the details and let them decide. Even though you believe that therapy and medication hasn't helped you before, your way of dealing with things is making it worse. 

Just a question - when the previous therapists told you that you didn't have OCD, what did they actually think you were suffering from? One told you that you didn't have OCD because you're not washing your hands all the time right?

Another question - do you believe that people with sexual disorders (like people who want to commit incest) are horrible people? Could it be that they also have an illness, like those of us who have OCD? These people can and absolutely should get treatment so that they too can have a normal life and healthy relationships. They are not monsters, they just have a problem that they need to deal with. 

Is there anyone in your life, besides forums, that you can talk to about this? Are you comfortable talking with your parents or a sibling or something like that?

A few more things:

1 hour ago, don't know said:

it's means that all of this was right and I have to commit incest.

 

No, nobody has to commit incest. People do these kinds of things because they choose to. If you don't want to commit incest, who is going to force you? 

1 hour ago, don't know said:

I'm scared to get into a relationship or have sex because if it goes bad or doesnt feel right it's means that all of this was right 

 

If you think like this, it's very likely that it will go wrong. Look, to put it bluntly, having sex for the first time doesn't always feel wonderful. It can be awkward and painful and that is just simply because our bodies are built a certain way and it takes some getting used to. If you put so much pressure on having sex, you're not going to enjoy it and you'll convince yourself it was because you weren't attracted to the guy. But it wouldn't be true, it would be because of your mindset. 

I really feel worried for you. I don't know you and I'm not going to try to convince you that you have OCD. But I would really urge you to speak to a professional and get some sort of help as soon as you can. 

[don't know]

Thanks for the reply, 

i just don't feel anxious. I've tried to identify compulsions, I can't see how they are any. I know people get annoyed at me but I'm just so tired.

Edited March 25, 2019 by don't know

[don't know]

The first therapist I saw didn't say I had anxiety or depression. They also said I didn't have OCD for that exact reason. I don't know what he thought I had but I was told to go for normal counselling sessions. The second time I saw a therapist they diagnosed me with OCD (had a health obsession that made going to school really difficult and almost housebound) I didn't go into the sexual side. I was put on medication and brought in for weekly sessions. I was given tons of information and my therapist was really nice and understanding; it just didn't work. The therapist left and I was interviewed for another one. They told me to come back in six months. I never did because I thought I was feeling better. 

I don't like to judge other people but it grosses me out. 

I've spoken to my family about this - they don't believe I have OCD. They refer to me as being 'ill' I've been told that my diagnosis was wrong. That's not their fault though, I don't want it to seem like I'm blaming them, they saw that I was really struggling. 

The thing about it is if it's in my head and feeling aroused by the idea of it, doesn't it mean that I want it? I'm just very confused. 

I understand rationally that it isn't always great the first time but it's a genuine worry that I have. It's stupid I know - but it makes me think if that happened all my worst fears would come true and I wouldn't be able to hide behind anything anymore. Especially seeing people experiencing that - I'm afraid that's going to be me. 

 

Edited March 25, 2019 by don't know

[PolarBear]

Who said you have to feel anxious? Sounds like more bad information you've received.

[PolarBear]

4 minutes ago, don't know said:

The first therapist I saw didn't say I had anxiety or depression. I don't know what he thought I had but I was told to go for normal counselling sessions. The second time I saw a therapist they diagnosed me with OCD (had a health obsession that made going to school really difficult and almost housebound) I didn't go into the sexual side. I was put on medication and brought in for weekly sessions. I was given tons of information and my therapist was really nice and understanding; it just didn't work. The therapist left and I was interviewed and they told me to come back in six months. I never did. 

I don't like to judge other people but it grosses me out. 

I've spoken to my family about this - they don't believe I have OCD. They refer to me as being 'ill' I've been told that my diagnosis was wrong. That's not their fault though, I don't want it to seem like I'm blaming them, they saw that I was really struggling. 

The thing about it is if it's in my head and feeling aroused by the idea of it, doesn't it mean that I want it? 

No. Thoughts of having sex with children were in my head and I had arousal (what I found out later is called groinal response) and I had OCD. Just everyday, ordinary OCD.

Edited March 25, 2019 by PolarBear

[don't know]

I thought the intrusive thoughts had to cause anxiety. Everything on OCD says that. 

[malina]

Just now, don't know said:

The first therapist I saw didn't say I had anxiety or depression. I don't know what he thought I had but I was told to go for normal counselling sessions. The second time I saw a therapist they diagnosed me with OCD (had a health obsession that made going to school really difficult and almost housebound) I didn't go into the sexual side. I was put on medication and brought in for weekly sessions. I was given tons of information and my therapist was really nice and understanding; it just didn't work. 

 

Well it sounds like the therapists didn't specifically say that you didn't have OCD, it's more that they didn't bring it up. Also, if you want to get the most out of therapy, you really have to tell them everything in as much detail as you can. They are not mind readers and only go on the information that you give them, so if you don't go into something, they won't guess that you are feeling that way. 

3 minutes ago, don't know said:

 I was given tons of information and my therapist was really nice and understanding; it just didn't work. The therapist left and I was interviewed and they told me to come back in six months. I never did. 

 

How long were you in therapy for and why didn't you return? Sometimes it takes a long time to make progress and, honestly, in your case, speaking to someone who is nice and understanding may be just what you need right now. 

27 minutes ago, don't know said:

I've spoken to my family about this - they don't believe I have OCD. They refer to me as being 'ill' I've been told that my diagnosis was wrong. That's not their fault though, I don't want it to seem like I'm blaming them, they saw that I was really struggling. 

 

I'm sorry to hear that your family aren't more supportive. I'm sure they mean well but mental health issues can be very hard to understand for people who don't have these experiences. Saying that you are 'ill' is incredibly general and can mean absolutely anything. No offence to them, but how can they say that you are ill but don't have OCD? Does OCD mean then that you are mentally healthy? Because it certainly doesn't feel that way. 

18 minutes ago, don't know said:

I thought the intrusive thoughts had to cause anxiety. Everything on OCD says that. 

Well you say you don't feel anxiety, but what do you feel? In your mind, what does feeling "anxious" mean? You certainly don't seem to be enjoying the thoughts, otherwise you wouldn't be posting here about how dreadful you feel. 

 

[PolarBear]

3 hours ago, don't know said:

I thought the intrusive thoughts had to cause anxiety. Everything on OCD says that. 

No it doesn't. 

The technical definition is having obsessions (intrusive thoughts, images, feelings, urges, impulses or physical sensations) that cause DISTRESS and lead to compulsions (repetitive acts, behaviors, rituals or mental rituals done to relieve the distress and/or to stop a bad thing from happening).

Distress is commonly referred to as anxiety but can also be guilt, shame , disgust and a few others.

Now given that, can you agree that the thoughts have continually distressed you? I mean if they didn't bother you, why are you posting about them five times a day for a year or more?

Edited March 25, 2019 by PolarBear

[don't know]

It's not that we didn't go into the sexual side of it. I'm saying that upon diagnosis I didn't talk about it because I was embarrassed and scared they would say they were true. They came up a couple of times but every time they asked about it I would feel uncomfortable or like I was lying, so I just avoided it. 

I was in therapy for six months. My family say that I would still struggle with OCD, but in their eyes I don't. 

I don't know what I feel in terms of my thoughts it's difficult, because I feel like I feel normal. 

[don't know]

I post about them because I hate them. But a lot of people hate their thoughts and then come to terms with them. Maybe that's me? 

[Guest OCDhavenobrain]

A new thread with absolute nothing new

[malina]

1 hour ago, don't know said:

It's not that we didn't go into the sexual side of it. I'm saying that upon diagnosis I didn't talk about it because I was embarrassed and scared they would say they were true. They came up a couple of times but every time they asked about it I would feel uncomfortable or like I was lying, so I just avoided it. 

 

I completely understand that it's difficult to talk to a therapist about these things, it is embarrassing and scary. However, you can't say that therapy simply didn't work for you. It didn't work because you avoided talking about the one subject that causes you most grief. You have to be actively involved in your own therapy and give the therapist information. If you avoid talking about something, it simply won't work. 

1 hour ago, don't know said:

I was in therapy for six months. 

 

Six months isn't that long. When I first got diagnosed with OCD, it took me a good year and a half to get back on my feet. Now, 10 years on, I've had a relapse in my OCD and I've been seeing a therapist for almost 6 months. I feel much better but still feel like I need the sessions. My point is that OCD is a life long condition, it goes up and down and 6 months in the grand scheme of things is really nothing. 

1 hour ago, don't know said:

I don't know what I feel in terms of my thoughts it's difficult, because I feel like I feel normal. 

 

What do you mean when you say you feel 'normal'? Sometimes you write on here that you saw a picture and screamed or that you are shaking. Do you think these feelings are normal?

8 hours ago, don't know said:

i just don't feel anxious. I've tried to identify compulsions, I can't see how they are any. 

 

Ok but multiple people on this forum have listed a number of compulsions that you clearly do. Do you remember some of the things they have said?

[don't know]

But it didn't work with the other symptoms either. 

I mean I don't feel anxiety. I understand they aren't normal reactions but there's no sense of panic or anything like that. It's difficult. 

People have said I should stop looking up articles related to my fears and websites. But the thing is if I don't do that and see if I relate I could be living in denial. I should really see if I am actually into these things. 

[PolarBear]

8 minutes ago, don't know said:

But it didn't work with the other symptoms either. 

I mean I don't feel anxiety. I understand they aren't normal reactions but there's no sense of panic or anything like that. It's difficult. 

People have said I should stop looking up articles related to my fears and websites. But the thing is if I don't do that and see if I relate I could be living in denial. I should really see if I am actually into these things. 

You have been trying this for how long now? Are you any closer to the truth? No! You just keep doing the same thing everyday, going around in circles.

I noticed too that you sidestepped my response above. You said all sufferers feel anxiety. I explained why that isn't true. You didn't even acknowledge my answer.

You have blinders on.

Edited March 25, 2019 by PolarBear

[don't know]

I'm sorry I didn't respond to your answer. Might be getting closer to the truth but don't want to admit it though. It seems like everything fits. 

But a lot of people feel anxiety and I don't. I think that's just me not wanting to face up to the truth. I don't like the thoughts but because I don't get extreme anxiety from them I'm not sure whether it is OCD. 

[PolarBear]

I just explained why you don't have to have extreme anxiety for it to be OCD and you came back and said it can't be OCD because you don't have extreme anxiety! 

You're not willing to listen to reason, yet you keep posting on an OCD forum. Go figure.

[malina]

You also missed my question DK - you say that you don’t have any compulsions yet many of us have pointed out several compulsions that you do. Do you remember any of the things we mentioned?

[Sputnik]

Do you feel that unless someone knows every last detail of what you're experiencing, they cannot advise you accurately? Because I identify fully with that feeling and I imagine that's very common with OCD, the belief that there is always something else they don't know, and if they did know all the details then maybe they'd say 'oh, no you don't have OCD at all'. So you fear you're deceiving them and/or yourself because you can't be sure they understand the full picture. This is all rumination, obsessing over 'getting it right'.

Thoughts and actions are not the same thing. Anxiety/shame/guilt etc can manifest in many different ways, in different people. Sometimes people who are experiencing intense negative emotions get a feeling of numbness, or of not having emotional reactions, which is often your mind trying to defend itself from too much distress, so that may explain why you think you feel nothing. Maybe the distress the OCD is causing you is being clouded by your brain's natural defense-mechanism. Doesn't mean you don't care, it means you care A LOT. 

I know you're probably reading all of our replies with a constant feeling of 'yeah, but...' or 'but for me it feels different because...' etc. That's also an OCD thought-pattern. Just because we don't have the exact same experience as you (and no-one ever will, you are an individual) doesn't mean our own experiences can't help shed some light on your situation.  Everyone here is trying their hardest to help, and I really feel for you the way you can't accept it because you're just so afraid. I've been there too, I know how horrible it is. From my observation and experience, it seems OCD often (if not always) lays a HUGE sense of responsibility on the sufferer - so do you think maybe you're trying to keep your family safe, by telling yourself you are a danger to them and taking on this responsibility of ensuring you will not harm them?

[PolarBear]

I wish we had a like button.

LIKE the above.

[don't know]

Malina

The thing is people tell me that I google and read articles. That's the only things I can remember, but what those articles talk about end up allligning exactly with me. 

I was reading about people that experience anxiety when people like them back. I'm scared that this is me and because of that I can never have a relationship, especially with all these sexual thoughts in my head - it's like I can't be happy whatsoever. 

 

Edited March 25, 2019 by don't know

[malina]

9 minutes ago, don't know said:

Malina

The thing is people tell me that I google and read articles. That's the only things I can remember, but what those articles talk about end up allligning exactly with me. 

 

Ok that’s good, the googling and reading articles we would call testing and reassurance seeking. These are compulsions.

Lets forget for a minute that you think these articles align with you. Regardless of the outcome, doing this research is still a compulsion.

So your claim that you don’t have compulsions is purely wrong.

Lets look at what @PolarBear said - the intrusive thoughts don’t necessarily cause panic or anxiety for everyone. They do cause distress, you don’t like them and you don’t want them. The fact that you post here so frequently, say you hate the thoughts and have reactions like screaming and shaking suggests that you are distressed by them. 

You also claim that professionals have said you don’t have OCD, but we have established that you didn’t really tell them all the details so they didn’t have relevant information to go on.

People on this forum and others you have visited tell you it’s OCD. 

You claim to have so much evidence that you want to commit incest, right? If that is the case, why do you keep coming back and asking “is that me?”. If you have proof, what is causing you to question it? Is there a seed of doubt in your mind that makes you think perhaps you are not that way after all?

[don't know]

But they do I get a lot of anxiety from them. You're right I don't like them, but sometimes people don't like their thoughts but they really are into that type of thing. 

I ask because I hope that I won't do it. I don't want to but at the same time it goes back to my point of it being in my head so often it must mean something. 

[malina]

5 minutes ago, don't know said:

But they do I get a lot of anxiety from them. You're right I don't like them, but sometimes people don't like their thoughts but they really are into that type of thing. 

I ask because I hope that I won't do it. I don't want to but at the same time it goes back to my point of it being in my head so often it must mean something. 

You say “they” but you’re literally talking to people who have intrusive thoughts. I have intrusive thoughts all the time and I know very well how they feel. Heck sometimes I get them so much that I am scared I enjoy them. They don’t always feel bad, I sometimes feel nothing at all.

Try to see things from a different perspective for a minute. Can’t you see how you filter information to confirm your fears? You remember things about incest that you align with, yet you barely remember things about OCD that you also align with. You dismiss everything that is a sign of OCD and agree with everything that is a sign of incest. 

Why do you hope you won’t do it? Even if you want to commit incest and are deeply attracted to a family member, who is going to make you do it? If you don’t want to, you certainly don’t have to.