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That moment you realise that things have got to change


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I wanted to come back to this in favour of starting a new thread because to be honest I don’t want a million and one threads that state the same thing. 

Anyway, so I really want to kind of make progress with this OCD thing and I’m feeling extremely nervous about the next step. Essentially, this issue relates to my brother and his cleanliness habits. He doesn’t wash his hands and obviously goes to the bathroom, touches parts of his body, as well as touch things that other people might not touch like the floor or the pavement. He also has been known to put his hand in the food bin to dig something out if he has put something in there he needs to remove. I hate to say it but it repulses me. That being said, I have to live with him and much of my OCD pertains to the fact that it freaks me out. I believe the answer to the problem is to suck it up and basically expose myself to this thing that repulses me but obviously I don’t know if I am putting myself into harms way/unnecessary dirtiness for the sake of it. I want to be better but I don’t want grease or poo or urine or garbage on the things I value most. But I can’t see anyway around it. My folks don’t see it as an issue but then my Dad will eat while at the computer. So you see my problem?

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Hey @BigDave, You're situation is definitely a tough one.  On the one hand, OCD is definitely at play and its important for you to confront that and work at recovering.  On the other hand your brothers behavior is definitely outside what most people would have to deal with on a day to day basis due to his own mental issues (I seem to recall you mentioning he is on the autism spectrum).  I think in general a lot of people, not just those with OCD would be bothered by someone in their immediate environment who uses the toilet without washing, etc.  I know I would, and I am far from a contamination worrier or particularly "neat" person.  In your situation one thing I would try is to speak with your doctor/therapist and see if they can also speak with your parents about how much this affects you.  Honestly it would be best for all involved if at the very least your brother was taught/told that he needs to at least wash his hands after using the toilet, both for his own health and everyone elses.  I know there are unique challenges in dealing with people who have autism, but there should hopefully be some way to get things to a point where a reasonable middle ground can be reached.  It sounds like its doubtful you'd ever get things to the point where your OCD demands, which shouldn't happen anyway, but its also not unreasonable to expect some basic levels of cleanliness and courtesy in ones life.  I really do hope that you, maybe with the help of your doctor, can help your parents better understand your concerns.  Again it sounds like a very frustrating and difficult situation and I'm sorry you have to deal with it and your OCD at the same time.

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20 hours ago, dksea said:

Hey @BigDave, You're situation is definitely a tough one.  On the one hand, OCD is definitely at play and its important for you to confront that and work at recovering.  On the other hand your brothers behavior is definitely outside what most people would have to deal with on a day to day basis due to his own mental issues (I seem to recall you mentioning he is on the autism spectrum).  I think in general a lot of people, not just those with OCD would be bothered by someone in their immediate environment who uses the toilet without washing, etc.  I know I would, and I am far from a contamination worrier or particularly "neat" person.  In your situation one thing I would try is to speak with your doctor/therapist and see if they can also speak with your parents about how much this affects you.  Honestly it would be best for all involved if at the very least your brother was taught/told that he needs to at least wash his hands after using the toilet, both for his own health and everyone elses.  I know there are unique challenges in dealing with people who have autism, but there should hopefully be some way to get things to a point where a reasonable middle ground can be reached.  It sounds like its doubtful you'd ever get things to the point where your OCD demands, which shouldn't happen anyway, but its also not unreasonable to expect some basic levels of cleanliness and courtesy in ones life.  I really do hope that you, maybe with the help of your doctor, can help your parents better understand your concerns.  Again it sounds like a very frustrating and difficult situation and I'm sorry you have to deal with it and your OCD at the same time.

Thank you for the message and I do really appreciate it. To be honest, my brother has severe autism with learning difficulties and unfortunately has picked up some unfortunate habits through interactions with other autistic people of a similar elk. These learned behaviours are extremely challenging and frankly I think it would be near impossible for us to ever reach that middle ground because he doesn’t understand and can’t understand these issues. That’s not to say we haven’t tried but through countless years of experience, dare I say that it is more than a rarity for an autistic person of his age to “improve” in these circumstances. The fact is that my parents aren’t bothered by it or have accepted it on account of the fact that they have had no negative consequences from it and see it more appropriate to shower my brother with as much love as possible rather than fight the impossible task of keeping on top of what he does all the time. I can understand that as well to be honest. The problem is - where does that leave me? My OCD isn’t the accepting kind AND it isn’t completely wrong on this one. So it’s awkward. Part of me thinks that what I should do is try the ERP route and suck it up but there is a part of me that says that I shouldn’t have to accept this. It’s a really difficult situation. I have just started seeing a new psychiatrist and I already have a great therapist but my therapist seems to believe that I need to “bite the bullet” on this one. I know EVERY OCD sufferer will say this but  it seems like a ridiculous ask of me. 

I understand with ERP sometimes the solution is to just let everything come at you and not respond and goes along the times of you need to over do the “normal” thing but go beyond that to show your OCD who is boss. Seems daunting but maybe that is best. That would of course be hell though. This is for someone who feels reluctant to touch his television because I used my mobile phone today while I was eating a sandwich and now I’m thinking I’m carrying around a carrier of grease and mayonnaise so the idea of coming face to face with worse things doesn’t sound appealing lol. 

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Guest OCDhavenobrain

Hello. You are having anxiety, that feeling is just too common within us sufferer is it not? Even if you find it gross it could be used as an exposure, sometimes you can use extreme exposure to your advantages and you say this is extreme. I have no idea about how much germs you are exposed to and I am SURE that you won't be content with any answer from me or any other here if we aren't going to undergo an extensive inspection of your house. And if we did that you would just wonder again next day. I am just saying this so you see that your thoughts are not uncommon, they are actually really common in people with OCD. Wanting to know exactly how much of something you are exposed to. 


Btw, both of us should have as a goal to move out, I know it somedays feels like your only task is to overcome deadly threats or at least severe threats but you have to try to overcome this or it will just take away your life. Do your best

Edited by OCDhavenobrain
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15 hours ago, BigDave said:

my therapist seems to believe that I need to “bite the bullet” on this one.

Yes i would agree with your therapist.I would work on it little by little. You mention already a couple of things that would help you on this route.

15 hours ago, BigDave said:

The fact is that my parents aren’t bothered by it or have accepted it on account of the fact that they have had no negative consequences from it

 

15 hours ago, BigDave said:

These learned behaviours are extremely challenging and frankly I think it would be near impossible for us to ever reach that middle ground because he doesn’t understand and can’t understand these issues.

So you can see that your brother probably can't change and that your parents aren't having any negative consequences in not avoiding him. 

While most people accept that it's good hygiene to wash one's hands after using the bathroom, lots of people don't. One can then become afraid of shaking people's hands in case they didn't wash. Or buying groceries in case there are germs on it and on, and on, and on...So we need to yes, bite the bullet in these cases, and face our fears that someone might not have washed their hands and there might be some germs around. I would definitely work with your therapist on this and go ahead with exposures. 

 

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Hi BigDave,

wow I can absolutely relate to your situation, my brother has autism too and is also severe. I love him to bits but it's very tough. There are many things that I've had to sacrifice and learn to accept. You're right that you shouldn't have to accept it but, at the same time, what choice do you have? You said yourself that you can't make him change and in an ideal world there are lots of things we shouldn't have to accept but we just don't have a choice. Besides, doesn't ERP push us into extremes to do things people don't actually do everyday? Think of this an an exposure exercise where you are being forced into the extremes. Good luck!!

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On 14/06/2019 at 22:38, malina said:

Hi BigDave,

wow I can absolutely relate to your situation, my brother has autism too and is also severe. I love him to bits but it's very tough. There are many things that I've had to sacrifice and learn to accept. You're right that you shouldn't have to accept it but, at the same time, what choice do you have? You said yourself that you can't make him change and in an ideal world there are lots of things we shouldn't have to accept but we just don't have a choice. Besides, doesn't ERP push us into extremes to do things people don't actually do everyday? Think of this an an exposure exercise where you are being forced into the extremes. Good luck!!

That’s what I’m thinking Malina. I don’t like it one but also I don’t have too much choice. It’s going to be hell putting myself through this though. Really really not looking forward to it (not that I would). 

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On 14/06/2019 at 15:46, leif said:

Yes i would agree with your therapist.I would work on it little by little. You mention already a couple of things that would help you on this route.

 

So you can see that your brother probably can't change and that your parents aren't having any negative consequences in not avoiding him. 

While most people accept that it's good hygiene to wash one's hands after using the bathroom, lots of people don't. One can then become afraid of shaking people's hands in case they didn't wash. Or buying groceries in case there are germs on it and on, and on, and on...So we need to yes, bite the bullet in these cases, and face our fears that someone might not have washed their hands and there might be some germs around. I would definitely work with your therapist on this and go ahead with exposures. 

 

You make really good points Leif! I really want to beat this obviously but I'm struggling. I have been struggling for too long and things have to change. It's driving me literally insane and I'm so unhappy all the time. I went on holiday and was overcome but the OCD. I think that I'm doing things right but then I realise what I'm doing is reassurance seeking behaviour. Wish there was some sort of magic bullet.

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