Compassion for other users

[Ashley]

Something I have been guilty of in the past is showing frustration when users are not seeing the obvious. Over the years I came to realise that sometimes understanding OCD is a little like those weird optical illusions, some people see the image immediately and others take a long time to see it, if at all.

So I would like to make this little gentle reminder to the forum to please show patience and compassion to each other.   What is really helpful, is helping users struggling to identify what's going on and helping them find ways to make changes, like resisting compulsions (rather than just telling them to stop doing compulsions).  Remember, sometimes we don't all learn at the same speed and like optical illusions, some people really struggle to see what's right in front of them. 

If, you don't have anything practical and helpful to say to a user, don't reply....  If you're frustrated at a users inability to take on the advice being offered, count to 10 and don't reply.... it really is that simple.  No reply is better than a unhelpful or judgemental reply. 

Please allow myself and my team to moderate where WE feel it appropriate to do so. By all means report content to us you want us to look at.  Try and remember how you felt at the start of this journey and how you wanted to be treated with understanding, respect and dignity.

 

Duck or Rabbits?

A 19th-century optical illusion — or, more precisely, "ambiguous image" — of a rabbit that looks like a duck that looks like a rabbit. First published in 1892 by a German humor magazine. You can interpret the image as either a duck or a rabbit. It gets trickier if you place two copies of the illusion side by side. You're likely to see two ducks. Or perhaps two rabbits.

[Madchoc]

Well said Ashley, and very true, thank you. Xx

[gingerbreadgirl]

A great reminder ashley x 

[MentalChecker]

Very good and nice post. Sometimes when in the height of anxiety another users post can be very upsetting and create even more problems.

I must admit though the majority of the members on this forum do provide good advise and appear to be very kind. 

[lostinme]

What a great reminder Ashley, we have to remember that people come here often in a state of despair and the last thing we want to do is add to their distress. 

[taurean]

What you say is beautifully put Ashley. We must always bear this in mind. 

[Guest]

Thanks Ashley, that's brilliantly put.

Can I just add that people with autism and OCD are fairly common, and an autistic person may not realise that their comments are being perceived as inappropriate or offensive. That's not to say people shouldn't be called out for their comments, autism is not an excuse, but I think it is something to bear in mind and therefore to be wary of accusing others of malicious intent unless there is very clear evidence they are deliberately trying to be hurtful. 

[taurean]

It's a valid point Wren. 

A good lady friend's teenage boy has autism and OCD. 

[Handy]

Everyone using the forum will have their own reasons for being here, as everyone will be at a different stage in their journey with their OCD. The forums should be a safe place to explore and be accepting of whatever a user chooses to bring here. 

[Guest OCDhavenobrain]

1 hour ago, Handy said:

Everyone using the forum will have their own reasons for being here, as everyone will be at a different stage in their journey with their OCD. The forums should be a safe place to explore and be accepting of whatever a user chooses to bring here. 

Well not really, there are trolls on every forum out there and why couldn't this be just another place for a troll to do its thing? 

Like someone denying CBT having effect and instead offering a cure from eating flowers which grows beside roads, I really don't see any benefits from that. The forum is very specific after all.

Edited July 7, 2019 by OCDhavenobrain

[gingerbreadgirl]

3 minutes ago, OCDhavenobrain said:

Well not really, there are trolls on every forum out there and why couldn't this be just another place for a troll to do its thing? 

Like someone denying CBT having effect and instead offering a cure from eating flowers which grows beside roads, I really don't see any benefits from that. The forum is very specific after all.

Yes - compassion does not mean freedom from critique. 

[Ashley]

15 hours ago, gingerbreadgirl said:

Yes - compassion does not mean freedom from critique. 

True, to an extent. I,e critique the content not the motive for posting.

We don't know what is going on in somebody else's shoes.  For example some people may come across very 'to the point' seemingly without emotion when they post, in their head they are posting content intended to help, but to others it's seemingly nonsense. So as Wren points out we don't know if that person might be suffering co-morbidly with other conditions. 

So as mentioned we should be careful of accusing others of malicious intent unless there is very clear evidence they are deliberately trying to be malicious... For what it's worth, right now on the forum I don't think we have any users that are deliberately being malicious. 

So critique the content in terms of correcting it, but I don't think we should critique the motive for posting, so until there is clear evidence to the contrary I would like the forum to give each other the benefit of the doubt in terms of motive for posting.

 

[gingerbreadgirl]

I do see what you're saying. I think though when someone continually posts factually wrong and even harmful information and doesn't respond to challenges or even questions about it, it suggests at least an element of mischief in my view. Maybe I am being unfair though. 

[taurean]

I have to agree here with GBG. 

Whilst I think we can all make errors of judgement or happen to post something others deem unhelpful, consistently posting as per GBG causes harm and can affect the beneficial guidance on a thread. 

[Ashley]

23 minutes ago, gingerbreadgirl said:

I think though when someone continually posts factually wrong and even harmful information and doesn't respond to challenges or even questions about it, it suggests at least an element of mischief in my view

 

13 minutes ago, taurean said:

I have to agree here with GBG. 

 

No, not necessarily, as mentioned above, some of what you're seeing could in fact be symptomatic of something else.  I will repeat again, lets please give each other the benefit of the doubt and refrain from public judgemental assumptions.

Remember, I have done this for nearly 20 years and I can spot a mischief maker a mile off, even the subtle ones who like to stir the pot occasionally. 

 

[Ashley]

On 07/07/2019 at 16:17, Handy said:

be accepting of whatever a user chooses to bring here

Open to what a user brings, and treat users fairly, but not necessarily accepting of the content they bring if it's not accurate or misleading. Then it is fair to question, challenge or dismiss that content. 

[BristolChris]

Hello Ashley long time no see .

I agree it is very important that we are compassionate and remember it is not easy for some people who are at the beginning of recovery

[taurean]

8 hours ago, Ashley said:

 

 

No, not necessarily, as mentioned above, some of what you're seeing could in fact be symptomatic of something else.  I will repeat again, lets please give each other the benefit of the doubt and refrain from public judgemental assumptions.

Remember, I have done this for nearly 20 years and I can spot a mischief maker a mile off, even the subtle ones who like to stir the pot occasionally. 

 

I think here is a case where I have to agree to differ, regarding recent experience. 

But there we are, we can't always agree, that's unrealistic for people willing to freely express their opinions. 

 

Edited July 8, 2019 by taurean

[felix4]

The way I see it, posts that lack compassion/empathy run the risk of driving sufferers away, or underground, by way of private messages where although well meaning, advice given might not be quite so helpful. 

Also, I think some posts lacking compassion/empathy can make recovery sound oh so simple, resulting in the sufferer thinking they have a more extreme case, or on the flipside questioning just how bad the other sufferers OCD was.      

[dksea]

Hey @Ashley Any recommendations/guidance on how you'd like us to approach people who are at a spot where they need frank words and advice?  I'm sometimes concerned about coming across as overly harsh, yet at the same time I know from my own experience that being firm and sometimes terse with someone is the right approach.  I'd hate to see that seen as being uncompassionate, so happy for any tips or observations based on yours (or others) experience.

[Guest OCDhavenobrain]

46 minutes ago, dksea said:

Hey @Ashley Any recommendations/guidance on how you'd like us to approach people who are at a spot where they need frank words and advice?  I'm sometimes concerned about coming across as overly harsh, yet at the same time I know from my own experience that being firm and sometimes terse with someone is the right approach.  I'd hate to see that seen as being uncompassionate, so happy for any tips or observations based on yours (or others) experience.

I don't think you are in any way risking to been seen as harsh. If that is the case then everybody are harsh

 

It all comes down to a certain donation, if that donation was made then I think Ashley have more knowledge than me. 

Edited July 9, 2019 by OCDhavenobrain

[DC82]

In my opinion, I think it is very risky for forum users to make guesses, however educated those guesses are, that someone is causing mischief. No reply (if you suspect mischief) is better than making a dangerous guess and doing damage. 

I think it's better to leave it to Ashley or forum moderators to gently explore, identify and deal with forum posts as and when they suspect something. The forum moderators are there to spot and keep an eye on people who might be causing trouble unnecessarily, or even lying about their condition.

Obviously debate about evidence and the validity of information doesn't have to be personal. Theories and ideas don't have feelings - they stand up to scrutiny (which doesn't have to be personal or nasty) or they don't. 

Edited July 9, 2019 by DC82

[taurean]

A good point of reference is the forum rules, and the fact that OCD-UK is a UK charity and follows the NICE recommendations on treatment for OCD. 

On occasion I have pointed these out to posters who I think are offering wrong or unhelpful advice, or things outside those terms of reference. 

I think in general terms the knowledge and experience and involvement of regular active people such as myself greatly helps, as the need for moderation reduces and assists the workload of those wonderful moderator volunteers. 

[taurean]

Dksea I haven't seen anything untoward, from the point of view of this topic, in your posts - which I think are truly helpful and based on your own knowledge and experience. 

When we exercise a little "tough love" I reckon we do it sensitively and necessarily. 

[dksea]

4 hours ago, OCDhavenobrain said:

I don't think you are in any way risking to been seen as harsh. If that is the case then everybody are harsh

 

It all comes down to a certain donation, if that donation was made then I think Ashley have more knowledge than me. 

I think there may be a misunderstanding here on what I was referring to.  I wasn't intending my post to be connected to the trolling topic being discussed above, but when addressing posters who, for example, get trapped in loops seeking reassurance over and over.  In such situations I feel like its necessary to sometimes be more blunt if initial, more diplomatic efforts don't seem to stick.  I think there is a place for that in treatment and helping others, but I also wanted to make sure to avoid coming across as uncompassionate.  I just thought it would be good to ask for some thoughts on that particular area.