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looking for advice extreme bowel rumination is this OCD or medical?


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Can anyone relate to this?? Is this OCD or ansimus  ( which I’ve been reading about) …ive been told for its IBS but im really no longer convinced. Im so desperate about it im thinking of trying to go private for healthcare around it. Any thoughts would really help.

I apologise about the detail and if im in the wrong place, Im  just begin to wonder if this a form OCD? Thoinking about trying to find a way to get Private Health care or assessment around it.

Difficult to know which symptoms come first, cant validate them, name the problem. Feels isolating and disabling but cant be validated as so, so makes me hate myself and feel its my own fault.

Lots of anxiety about going for a poo, the more anxious about it, the more I cant relax the pelvic floor and feels tight and im pushing forcing, because desperate to get it out but the more I push the more the bowel/anus something clenches. can only let out if I have loose poo. I drink strong coffee to make it come out. But even when its loose, its still clams up (spasms?) so even diarrhoea won’t come out.

Symptoms

 For what left inside my body are weird uncomfortable sensations –  aches, knots/cramps/dragging feelings/ bloating/fullness so don’t want to eat, slight nausea, burning sensations recently causing lower back pain, drained of energy, feel foggy and tired and body feels dirty. Don’t want to eat as loss of appetite also if I do eat it can almost feels like lumps in my tummy – wind smells very bad, but if unable to get the wind out the bloating gets much worse much tighter intensely uncomfortable -in work places going to the toilet every 20 mins feeling desperate to get wind out but clamps up, when I got back and sit down gurgling and moving around, but as soon as try to go to toilet in clamps up, once anxious which I am most of the time, about it I’m in a vicious circle the more desperate I am to get rid of the wind or poo, the more I cant, the more depressed and the more I feel the physical symptoms/sensations. Sometimes feel a sensing of stomaching/feels rubbery. I focus on the sensations. Cant bear to do things like swimming as will show my tummy, doing exercise classes as the wind my come out. Been recently trying to go to a personal trainer, but when wake up with it all feels unbearable

Psychological symptoms

Obsessive about the problem on my mind through out day and evenings, comes out in dreams, anxiety around starts when I get up, feels irritable, dirty, tired, frustrated, despair, desperate, lonely angry with my body and self, can feel suicidal had problems around all this my whole life ( im 46 now) and have fear and anxiety that this is for the rest of my life and is only going to get worse as I get older. Feel very ashamed and can’t explain to anyone really what the problem is. I imagine life with out and seems so much better but can’t see a way out of it.

Affects sex life, getting involved with anyone, feels humiliating, fear of smelling due to constant wind, but if hold it in and be socially acceptable I quite literally  look pregnant and feel ashamed of my body the  discomfort  becomes awful and I just want o go home and lie down to let the wind out

 I Can just obsess about the releif of going to the toilet properly. Coffee get some out initially, but once clams up that’s it. Even anus clamped so tight I cant actually let the wind out. My body working against me. At times just cannot face another day of it. The occasional times I go and almost empty, feels so much better, but tends to get more symptoms as day goes on as unable to use public toilets /other people toilets so symptoms reoccur often wind worse as day goes on.

The bloating and pressure causes daily heartburn/reflux, again this effects my eating habits also get big blood sugar drops. Don’t want eat as so uncomfortable as feel full or can feels hungry but don’t want to eat as can than feel so uncomfortable and more bloated and heavy. Sometime when the sensation and fullness suddenly switches to hunger I get shakes and sweats as blood sugar drops. I also sometimes get excessive thirsts and fear of bad breath for the poo inside me

Put pressure on bladder as well aggravates the urge incontinent. Getting into imagining this toxicity/faeces left in body poisoning me, damaging my bowel images of horrible stuff going in my body. Problems there on daily  basis, but always more intensified with things like working, new relationship being out in the world more often, lots of fears around working being in an office because of the discomfort and isolation with it.  

The last few months have had suicidal thoughts around it as I really want to work have been out of work with my mental health for sometime, but just get so scared that I will not be able to cope with these symptoms in the work place… and then I cant see I future.

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Well whatevers wrong it's certainly making your life miserable.

Have you been to see a doctor about this, and told them all your symptoms, even the embarrassing ones. If not I think that's your first step.

 

I wouldn't even begin to guess about what s wrong I'm not a doctor, and most people on hear are pretty open and shut cases of OCD. 

You have some troubling physical symptoms, go see a doctor and then we can see the wood from the trees.

 

Edited by Closed for repairs
Edited out an opinion.
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I am with the doctors on this Artemis. 

I currently have IBS and other physical issues as a result of anxiety caused by my obsessional thinking. 

I am perfectly fit otherwise - I know this as I was perfectly fit before this episode of OCD started. 

You are clearly engaging in a lot of obsessions and compulsions around this, and unfortunately that only maintains the anxiety and the physical symptoms. 

I know this only too well from my own OCD and am myself trying to tackle this with CBT and cutting down the compulsions. 

Gas issues is another indicator of IBS as also constipation as well as diarrhoea. 

Getting some CBT on your obsessional thinking will help you understand what is going on and help you reduce the obsessional thinking and resultant compulsions. 

When you find that working then the unpleasant physical symptoms including the issues with digestion should fade. 

Why do we get these physical symptoms with anxiety? The body goes into fight or flight mode. Energy is fed to the muscles and cortisol and adrenalin are secreted to raise blood pressure and increase heartbeat. 

The digestive system shuts down. 

If we don't burn off this arousal by flight or fight, the continuing arousal level results in the physical symptoms you are experiencing.

The catastrophic thinking - I will be stuck like this, I will never be able to work - also maintains this high level of anxiety. 

Whilst awaiting therapy you can work on your problem by starting to believe the symptoms are the result of that obsessive thinking and the resultant compulsions. A good book to help you would be "Break Free From OCD" by Dr Victoria Bream Professor Paul Salkovskis and another. 

 

Edited by taurean
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1 hour ago, artemisberry said:

Thanks, maybe that at least clarifies its not OCD.

To me, some of what you're experiencing could very well be. It can be tricky identifying if anxiety's causing physical symptoms (especially when it comes to the bowel) and then getting as you say caught into a cycle of being hyper aware, monitoring motions and sensations (the OCD bit) and how much might be caused by a stand alone pre-existing physical condition like IBS the anxiety's worsening...the lines can blur and create a cycle.

If the doctor's have ruled out things like Celiac Disease or Crohn's and diagnosed IBS, did they refer you to a registered dietician to help you tweak your diet by cutting out things like FODMAPS...one of which is coffee and caffeine? That in itself is a pretty big trigger in IBS, it might be worth a trial and cutting that out to see if it helps.

I'm worried you're not eating tho' that'll also affect how you feel and the anxiety if your blood sugar levels aren't maintained, feeding into the cycle again.

I think I would be tempted to tackle this on two fronts...as Roy's (Taurean) suggested by looking into CBT and also going back to your GP for more help with the IBS. Small changes here and there with diet, CBT, exercise and relaxation techniques will all hopefully help you break the cycle.

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43 minutes ago, artemisberry said:

Thanks, maybe that at least clarifies its not OCD. it was just i started reading about bowel obsession as OCD type thing. Yeah been to the doctors many, many times over the last 30 years, just always told its IBS.

Just had to check, 

It's amazing what people don't got to the docs with.

Taurean has some pretty good advice, so the only thing I'll add is that I I don't think drinking lots of strong coffee is going to help with any anxiety.

There's no reason that you can't have IBS and also some mental health  issues and it all feed into its self.

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Have the doctors suggested OCD before? One might think that if someone suggested those symptoms it would be worth looking to consider what underlying cause might be bringing on the IBS. 

I responded to this thread because of my current experience of OCD-induced IBS. When my obsessions and compulsions aren't playing up, then nor is my digestive system and other physical symptoms of anxiety. 

 

Edited by taurean
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That sounds miserable Artemisberry! 

The good thing is that your GP must have ruled out other serious causes. Have they prescribed you any anti-spasmodics? (If not you can buy these over-the-counter- 'Buscopan' is the most common one, and they reduce cramping and spasms). Also have they ruled out Helicobacter Pylori? 

I agree with Hal that it's worth asking for a referral to a Dietician to ask about possible intolerances. I have reduced histamine tolerance so that I have to only eat limited amounts of histamine-rich foods (which means I have to have very little/no mature cheeses, matured meats, tomatoes, smoked fish etc.). If I eat multiple histamine-rich foods in a day then I suffer from incredibly severe abdominal spasms, wind, need to go frequently etc. 

Anxiety definitely can make functional digestive conditions (IBS) much worse so it's important to do fun/distracting/enjoyable things to help to take  your mind off it; which I know is easier said than done when you're rushing to the loo every 20 minutes but even listening to your MP3 player or watching a distracting film might help!

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I think as the others have said, it's back to the doctors (or a more sympathetic one) for some help with the psychological/emotional issues.  It may well be IBS, it certainly has become obsessional.  It shouldn't be a one or the other situation, you deserve more help with this.  It may be that a referral to a specialist Physiotherapist may be helpful.  There are physio's who work with these sort of things.  I know it's not quite the same but there is a condition some women suffer from called Vaginismus.  This is an involuntary condition where the muscles around the vagina contract making penetration impossible,  It isn't caused by an abnormality and is often thought to have an emotional basis.  It is an automatic response rather than just a tightening of the muscles by the sufferer.  I'm wondering if a similar  thing could occur with the anal sphincter muscle.  It's worth discussing :)

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Hi @artemisberry, ooof, sounds like you have been going through the wringer with this.  Sorry you've had to deal with so much.  Lots of good advice in the thread so I'll just add a few more thoughts.

I've had some gastrointestinal issues over recent years, I found out I had become lactose intolerant, and later had some other mild food sensitivities.  It can help speaking with a specialist to get proper tests done, but even something as simple as trying to eliminate likely problematic foods for a bit and see how you feel might help narrow things down too.

This doesn't have to be (and likely isn't) an either/or question.  Its entirely possible you might have some physical problem (IBS, IBD, allergy, intolerance, etc.) AND a psychological one, and the two are playing off each other, magnifying each problem, since stress can upset your gut and an upset gut can cause stress.  Getting help for both is both reasonable and wise.  You deserve to feel better, and there's nothing wrong with taking reasonable steps to get there, and that can involve being pushy and asking questions.

Best of luck with your recovery, I hope you can get some answers soon.

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Aww thank you so much for all  your kind responses. i've felt particularly desperate with it the last couple days..but that's what tends to happen, i cope sort of, and then feel really desperate and despairing. I have a diagnosis of complex PTSD  from multiple trauma in late childhood and throughout my teens. ive always tried really hard to work on myself. Had last breakdown ( major crisis) a few years ago triggered by job i was in and haven't worked since but have been working on mental health recovery in all sorts of ways through doing creative stuff, therapy, challenging myself ( I started doing standing comedy in June) been making loads of steps to try and get back in to work - course, voluntary work ect. And yet I still constantly struggle with this issue, its so life limiting. Im a single mum and have been for last 9 years and all this stuff effects my ability to parent and I don’t have any family to help out. I definitely get stuck in a lot of intrusive and repetitive thought patterns around other stuff too.  About 15 years ago i got stuck for quite some time in terrifying intrusive thoughts and images that I would be violent or abuse children. I used a OCD forum back then and took a great deal of comfort from it and had some CBT around those thoughts, so that particular  thing is not really issue anymore

Ive contacted the doctor today and want to refer me to a private specialist, and use my PIP money to pay for it. ive read about something called bio feedback, but the physio idea might be something too. I was supposed referred to dietitian but that never materialised. Thank you for the validation of how hard it is to live with it. As yet I don’t know anyone who experiences the same symptoms, so its incredibly lonely and often impossible to explain, but I think just writing it all out has given a way to communicate it better to the professionals

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Well done for being pro-active and making that appointment.  Fingers crossed it goes well for you.  Please continue to share your journey and gain support from the forum, we're quite a good bunch in here at brain storming so you never know just how much it may help.  There are clearly OCD problems here, challenging this problem from different angles may ultimately help you find a solution.  Good Luck :)

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10 hours ago, artemisberry said:

Ive contacted the doctor today and want to refer me to a private specialist, and use my PIP money to pay for it. ive read about something called bio feedback, but the physio idea might be something too. I was supposed referred to dietitian but that never materialised. 

I hope once you say you're willing to pay with your PIP's that will be enough for them to recognise how serious you are about needing more help and spur them on with an NHS referral for your physical symptoms and the CBT...you really shouldn't be having to spend your money on seeing someone privately. As dksea's said, be prepared to be pushy....they may get a bit huffy and resistant about a referral, but don't be fobbed off. At the very least as you haven't already been able to see a dietician they should follow through with that. 

You've probably guessed I've been around this particular gastro block too, if it would help I'm happyto chat about the weird world of FODMAPS via DM's :)

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