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Said the wrong thing.


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So even after reading the comment I made in the first post of this thread? It's like I'm tempted to do the horrible thoughts surely some guilt would be accompanied by it whether it was meant or not. I'm really surprised if that's the case. 

Edited by phillev
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9 hours ago, phillev said:

So even after reading the comment I made in the first post of this thread? It's like I'm tempted to do the horrible thoughts surely some guilt would be accompanied by it whether it was meant or not. I'm really surprised if that's the case. 

Just wondering if you could follow up this please PolarBear, I know I'm like a stuck record but I just wanted your opinion. I still don't know why I even said tempting and probably never will, I do remember saying afterwards to the doctor do I sound psychotic and he said no. 

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I'm not going to debate with you about this word. That would be assisting you with a compulsion. 

You are right... you'll never know. You can ruminate on it for 10 years and you'll be no further ahead. So give up the search for an answer.

Lastly, the longer you leave it alone, the less it will bother you.

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14 hours ago, phillev said:

surely some guilt would be accompanied by it whether it was meant or not

Why?  If I say "Hey I want to go rob a bank this afternoon" I have exactly zero feelings of guilt.  By your current reasoning I should shouldn't I? I mean after all robbing a bank would be a bad thing.  Shouldn't I feel guilty for even thinking it? For even talking about it? For even saying it?  I don't though.  Because of two reasons, 1. saying "I want to rob a bank" is meaningless, you can say literally anything without actually wanting/needing/being compelled to do it.  2. OCD isn't confusing my thoughts on that issue.  So no, no reason to feel guilt whatsoever because its a meaningless.
 

5 hours ago, phillev said:

I still don't know why I even said tempting and probably never will

Yup, you probably never will, and it doesn't particularly matter why either.  You said it, it was a momentary event with basically no consequences except for your own panic over it (no thank you OCD).  You can treat it as super important OR you can treat it as unimportant.  OCD might cause you to worry that its important but you can work at overriding this by treating it like its not, even if you aren't sure.  Thats the choice you make.

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6 hours ago, dksea said:

Why?  If I say "Hey I want to go rob a bank this afternoon" I have exactly zero feelings of guilt.  By your current reasoning I should shouldn't I? I mean after all robbing a bank would be a bad thing.  Shouldn't I feel guilty for even thinking it? For even talking about it? For even saying it?  I don't though.  Because of two reasons, 1. saying "I want to rob a bank" is meaningless, you can say literally anything without actually wanting/needing/being compelled to do it.  2. OCD isn't confusing my thoughts on that issue.  So no, no reason to feel guilt whatsoever because its a meaningless.
 

Yup, you probably never will, and it doesn't particularly matter why either.  You said it, it was a momentary event with basically no consequences except for your own panic over it (no thank you OCD).  You can treat it as super important OR you can treat it as unimportant.  OCD might cause you to worry that its important but you can work at overriding this by treating it like its not, even if you aren't sure.  Thats the choice you make.

I think it's because I was trying to honestly best explain how these thoughts feel and in using the first word that came into my head I got the massive rush of guilt and anxiety from it because I used the wrong description, my OCD is saying something else unfortunately though. 

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5 hours ago, phillev said:

I think it's because I was trying to honestly best explain how these thoughts feel and in using the first word that came into my head I got the massive rush of guilt and anxiety from it because I used the wrong description, my OCD is saying something else unfortunately though. 

All right then, keep on wallowing in what your OCD says. 

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2 hours ago, paradoxer said:

All right then, keep on wallowing in what your OCD says. 

You're dead right, my OCD scares the **** out of me and I am wallowing, sometimes I feel helpless!

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14 hours ago, phillev said:

I think it's because I was trying to honestly best explain how these thoughts feel and in using the first word that came into my head I got the massive rush of guilt and anxiety from it because I used the wrong description, my OCD is saying something else unfortunately though. 

The thing is it doesn't matter why.  Its not important.  Its just not that big of a deal.  I know it FEELS to you right now like its super important, like you have to figure this out, and maybe if you do it'll make the doubt go away, but it won't and you don't have to.  It doesn't matter what your OCD says.  The right answer is to not dwell on this anymore, to not analyze it, to not try and solve it.
 

5 hours ago, phillev said:

You're dead right, my OCD scares the **** out of me and I am wallowing, sometimes I feel helpless!

Its understandable to feel that way, OCD can seem overwhelming at times, but you aren't helpless, you can make choices to handle this differently and change the situation.  Not as fast as you might like perhaps, but still you can do it. One step at a time.

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9 hours ago, phillev said:

You're dead right, my OCD scares the **** out of me and I am wallowing, sometimes I feel helpless!

It's your choice not to wallow, it's you in the driver's seat. The secret truth is, that seemingly giant step is much smaller you think.  

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That's the problem that I feel so overwhelmed that I'm scared I'll lose it and do something terrible. It just won't go away! And every morning when I wake is like a living nightmare. 

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On 04/03/2020 at 11:18, phillev said:

saw my doctor today and was trying to be as honest as possible

So, I don't know if I'm understanding the situation correctly... apologies, if I'm not.

It seems to me that you took a big step in being more open with your doctor about your OCD thoughts. That's a difficult step, but a great step, because that's what will help you do therapy and overcome OCD.

The thing is, when you try and fight OCD (for example by talking to a Dr or therapist about it) OCD fights back.

My experience is, that OCD often fights back with a vengance, really ramping up the symptoms hugely.

Overcoming things like OCD or addictions is really hard... And as you take steps to overcome it, it gets harder before it gets better.

So IMO this is a normal reaction to be having... talk to your Dr, be really honest, take steps to beat OCD... and the OCD thoughts go wild.

I think it's normal to experience this fallout... and you should prepare yourself for this basically every time you take a step to beat your OCD.

The bottom line is: You did really, really well to be more honest and open with your Dr and now you're struggling with the fallout that was to be expected.

Try to be kind to yourself and try to stay calm and then do the same thing again, next time you see your Dr: be as honest and open with your Dr about this stuff as possible.

As you do therapy and treatment for OCD, remember that in therapy the truth is what sets you free.

So well done on being honest with your Dr - that's a big achievement and took a lot of courage - and sorry that you're experiencing the fallout from that at the moment.

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That's pretty much it, I was trying to explain how the thoughts make me feel and regrettably used the word tempting as regards the evil thoughts and knew straight away I'd said it wrongly I should have used the word powerful or real but said what came into my head first, its all a muddle now and I'm not 100% sure what I said but it was wrong as my anxiety was through the roof. Funnily he didn't bat an eyelid at my comment. I can't get that damn word out of my head! 

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17 minutes ago, phillev said:

my anxiety was through the roof

Yeah, of course. Opening up to people about OCD is really scary and sets off lots of anxiety. And we all explain things poorly and choose imperfect wording when we are anxious.

17 minutes ago, phillev said:

Funnily he didn't bat an eyelid at my comment.

If your Dr understands OCD, then he would realise all of what you said is "just part of OCD" and yeah, why would he bat an eyelid? He's a Dr, he knows what OCD is like, he knows it's difficult to be honest about it, he knows that the process is messy.

Now, instead of allowing OCD to focus on the fallout from the last Dr's appt, can you try focussing on what you will say to your Dr next time?

What can you say to him next time that is another step in being more honest and open? What is the next step on the journey of treating your OCD and freeing yourself of it?

Don't let the fallout prevent you taking those steps and prevent you being on that journey.

What is the next step? :)

Edited by Lizzy
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It's my poor explanation that has been the cause of my anxiety and as I explained to my therapist yesterday I've now got brain lock and can't move on, I've basically been suicidal over this and don't know how to move on. It feels like I've admitted that I want to do all the horrible things in my head, hence the guilt and anxiety. 

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So, I think there's 2 different types of social situations re "saying the wrong thing".

1) If we're in a social situation with people we don't know well/ with people in a work setting/ with people who are judgemental/ with people who are mean... then "saying the wrong thing" can feel like a big deal, and can cause issues depending on the situation.

2) Luckily, with people we like and trust, which includes good friends and therapists and people like your doctor, it's okay to get things wrong and then to correct them. With these people, we get a "do over". We can say "What I actually meant to say is......." and often, really valuable conversations ensue from this, leading to deeper understanding on both sides.

Maybe you can use this opportunity to work out what you ACTUALLY wanted to say to your Dr?

How do you explain your OCD thoughts better?

Can you work out the wording/ write it down, so that you can tell your Dr next time "This is how I actually wanted to explain it..." ?

Maybe this is a really valuable opportunity to find the right words to explain this complicated OCD stuff that is so hard to express?

 

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I've done that after seeing him Friday and thought it would help, my OCD tries to impress the fact that I should have done it at the time as it was I'm sure I said something afterwards but due to the stress can't remember what,  I do remember at the time asking if he thought that sounds phsycotic and he said no but what else I said is now lost as I was about to walk away from his office. Thank you all for the continued support. 

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My head is now asking the question as to why after I said that stupid word why did I ask the doctor if I sound like I'm phsycotic? As if I meant to say tempting all along as that was the perfect time to say what I really meant, I'm such a mess ?

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Again just thinking about that spikes my anxiety level , I'm a busted flush, I get rid of one worry only to be replaced by another, my therapist said to me yesterday my OCD is extremely strong. I think personally I'm beyond help. 

Edited by phillev
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16 hours ago, phillev said:

It's my poor explanation that has been the cause of my anxiety

No, your explanation is not the problem.  Your anxiety is because you have OCD and because you are engaging in behaviors that continue to fuel your OCD.
People explain things poorly all the time, hell most of the time.  Believing that somehow if they can/did just "explain something better/clearer/more right" it will fix things is a very OCD behavior.  And it's wrong. 

 

18 hours ago, phillev said:

That's the problem that I feel so overwhelmed that I'm scared I'll lose it and do something terrible. It just won't go away!

Been there, it sucks.  
Like literally I have had a very similar fear.  In my case it was fear of harming myself, specifically with knives.  Very specifically by cutting my wrists.  Think about how irrational OCD is.  I wasn't worried about stabbing myself in the heart, or shooting myself with a gun, or taking poison.  I was specifically worried about losing control and cutting my wrists with something sharp (also of jump off something high, again, totally random).  When I first had the intrusive thought I was afraid it meant I was suicidal.  I didn't actually WANT to do these things, I was terrified I MIGHT lose control and do it anyway.  When it first hit I was so panicked I took all the knives in my apartment aside from dull butter knives, put them in an old tool box, and locked that toolbox in my storage room on the first floor of the apartment building.  Never mind that I still had scissors in my apartment.  My reaction was driven by fear but it was clearly not rational to anyone looking at it from the outside (or me after the fact) but AT THE TIME I allowed the fear to take over and drive my actions, it SEEMED to make sense to me because of the panic I was dealing with thanks to OCD.  Thats the thing you have to keep in mind, the panic, the fear, it drives us to do things that aren't actually logical or reasonable.  It SEEMS logical or reasonable to us in the moment, but thats because we aren't thinking straight, we are panicking.   It took months for me to climb back out of that OCD hole, but I go there thanks to a combination of therapy, medication, and hard work.
Ruminating did not help.
Not ruminating did help.

You feel overwhelmed.  Almost certainly true.
You feel scared. Almost certainly true.
Because of the above two you will "lose it and do something terrible".  Almost certainly false.

I can't actually say there is zero possibility it won't happen, anything is technically possible.  But I can say that the liklihood of it happening is incredibly low, and the amount of effort you are putting into the worry is vastly vastly disproportionate to the level of risk.  Its like trying to build an impenetrable bomb shelter because you are afraid a meteorite might hit you on the head and kill you one day.  Does that seem like a reasonable reaction to you?

 

Edited by dksea
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The first step is stop arguing, stop analyzing, stop trying to figure it out. When the thoughts come, think, "Whatever." The idea here is to just leave the thoughts alone and not fo compulsions. 

Do that for a while. Then you can fo ERP atound this, agreeing with the thoughts and then not doing compulsions. 

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