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Hi guys,

I recently spent months on a worry that consumed me and somehow managed to let it slip into the background. It involves harming my little daughter so it is very distressing for me. Anyway I got caught in rumination these past days and now I’m nervous and shaking like hell trying to get back to the good state I was in before I broke down crying in my car over this stuff yesterday. I guess I’m just scared and afraid to not ruminate, to not try and deal with this the way therapy has told me to coz it’s awful for me to say but I just feel so guilty and horrible inside over these worries. I met my friends it’s my child and they brought their children and I feel like I’m a bad person. It’s tearing me apart. I just want to be ok and enjoy my life with my toddler. Please help, I’m shaking today. I’m also on a new anti depressant which so far seems to be making me tired and nervous. I’m taking it just one week. I just need someone to talk to, thanks for reading.

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Hi Nikki,

 

Sorry to hear you are suffering. 

One thing I picked up on above, is that you are too scared and nervous to NOT ruminate over this worry? But isn't ruminating causing you to be EXACTLY what you are saying you don't want to be? i. e it IS THE RUMINATING that IS causing you to be scared and nervous.... 

Unfortunately it's a Paradox, and when you're caught in the OCD loop (like i have been many times), you can't see that the very thing you are doing to try and free yourself, is the exact same thing that is causing you the distress - it doesn't work! 

The only thing that DOES work, is to stop ruminating, do not respond with anything, no physical compulsions, no mental compulsions, and if you can do this, then you will be back exactly where you were before, like you said you wanted to me.

Ive been in some very bad places also.  And the more I have tried to get myself out of the dark places, the more it has caused me problems.

I'm probably in one of the best places ive been in a long time now, by learning to expose myself to my problems, and learning to tolerate the anxiety it causes.

We need to re-teach our bodies to accept risk, accept that we 'may' have done something bad, but then likewise we 'may' not have.

Its also not a flip of a coin, or a 50/50 bet, it can be any number out of any number, i. e it could be 1 out of 100 that we 'may' have done something bad, the important thing is that we accept that we will never know 100% for certain, and that's ok, and we can live a happy, enjoyable, eventful, and fulfilling life like that, we don't need to be certain of anything ?

Edited by MentalChecker
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Hi Mentalchecker,

Thanks for responding. I agree with so much of what you said. I think perhaps not trying to find any answers not even think of numbers or stats or whatever might be the way to go, what did you think? I think the problem is I feel guilty for doing nothing about it so the thinking has been to reassure myself that I didn’t do anything yet I still feel unsure in spite of this. Can you relate?

I feel really low and just so disheartened. 

Edited by Nikki79
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3 hours ago, Nikki79 said:

Hi Mentalchecker,

Thanks for responding. I agree with so much of what you said. I think perhaps not trying to find any answers not even think of numbers or stats or whatever might be the way to go, what did you think? I think the problem is I feel guilty for doing nothing about it so the thinking has been to reassure myself that I didn’t do anything yet I still feel unsure in spite of this. Can you relate?

I feel really low and just so disheartened. 

I wont tell you whether i can relate or not, as that's reassurance as well, trust me!  I know all of the subtle ways of getting reassurance, as im a suffer as well remember ?

But what i can say is, most definitely, what you mentioned above about not getting answers, will DEFINITELY make you feel better in the 'long term'. 

To give you some idea, i have been in some very dark places in the past, due to my anxiety being through the roof. 

 

However now, i dont feel any anxiety, only the feeling of something not being right, it feels like when i was reassuring, there was a great big fire burning fiercely out of control, whereas now its nothing more than smouldering cinders.  Its still there ready to ignite at any time if I reassure, however presently not causing me many issues.

I can't comment on the medication, as even though I've been recommended them in the past, i have a thing about drugs, even prescribed drugs, that i cant bring myself to take them, which hasn't helped the situation, as i understand drugs takes the edge off the anxiety. 

Edited by MentalChecker
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I’m also not a fan of drugs and struggling to be honest to keep taking them.

Mentalchecker I spoke to my Father this evening who has listened to me for over twenty years on different ocd ‘worries’ as I spoke to him he told me to look at the stuff I’ve done in therapy and go over it and don’t get stuck in my old ways of thinking around whatever is worrying me. He said it is the illness just tricking you again and I must fight back against it. 

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3 hours ago, Nikki79 said:

I’m also not a fan of drugs and struggling to be honest to keep taking them.

Mentalchecker I spoke to my Father this evening who has listened to me for over twenty years on different ocd ‘worries’ as I spoke to him he told me to look at the stuff I’ve done in therapy and go over it and don’t get stuck in my old ways of thinking around whatever is worrying me. He said it is the illness just tricking you again and I must fight back against it. 

Sounds like you have a really great dad ?

Just remember though, try not to fight the worries, just let them be, and let them leave on their own when ready to do so, if you try to fight them, then your still responding to them, which isn't what you should be doing, just leave them be, without responding in any way, shape, or form ?

Edited by MentalChecker
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I do have a Dad that has saved my life when I couldn’t bare my OCD anymore and didn’t want to carry on ? 

I guess Mentalchecker I was desperate this past week to be free of what bothered me I chose the wrong path and it caused me so much pain. The reality is I need to accept it is the illness that is causing me these problems and not real. They aren’t real questions with real problems. Would you agree with this?

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20 minutes ago, Nikki79 said:

I do have a Dad that has saved my life when I couldn’t bare my OCD anymore and didn’t want to carry on ? 

I guess Mentalchecker I was desperate this past week to be free of what bothered me I chose the wrong path and it caused me so much pain. The reality is I need to accept it is the illness that is causing me these problems and not real. They aren’t real questions with real problems. Would you agree with this?

Hi Nicky, you do realise the last two sentences in your post are asking for reassurance? 

You have experienced anxiety, you want reassurance, for the anxiety to go away (for a very short time), and then the anxiety will be back much stronger than last time, and the whole process will start over again. 

A much better way would be for you to NOT do the reassurance, let the anxiety go away on its own (it will really peak and will make you feel terrible before it starts to subside), and then the next time it comes along, you will know that you can live with the anxiety, until it fades and goes away all on its own. 

As ive said, ive been in some really dark places for many years, however im now managing it a lot better. Only the other morning i felt the need to do a reassurance compulsion, and i realised if i did it, then it will only help me for a very short period before it comes back again with a vengeance. I also realised that to ignore it, is so much easier than doing the time consuming and mentally draining compulsions for such a short lived free time from anxiety. I therefore let it pass on its own, without responding to it, and now i cant even tell you what it was about ?

Have you got to a stage yet whereby you haven't responded to an anxious worry/obsession?

Once you've not responded to an obsession, and realise that you were able to get through it without reassurance, you can then look at any future obsessions as just the same, and it gets easier the more you do.  The hard part is being able to get to that stage and i know 1st hand it's not easy..... 

Edited by MentalChecker
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29 minutes ago, MentalChecker said:

Hi Nicky, you do realise the last two sentences in your post are asking for reassurance? 

You have experienced anxiety, you want reassurance, for the anxiety to go away (for a very short time), and then the anxiety will be back much stronger than last time, and the whole process will start over again. 

A much better way would be for you to NOT do the reassurance, let the anxiety go away on its own (it will really peak and will make you feel terrible before it starts to subside), and then the next time it comes along, you will know that you can live with the anxiety, until it fades and goes away all on its own. 

As ive said, ive been in some really dark places for many years, however im now managing it a lot better. Only the other morning i felt the need to do a reassurance compulsion, and i realised if i did it, then it will only help me for a very short period before it comes back again with a vengeance. I also realised that to ignore it, is so much easier than doing the time consuming and mentally draining compulsions for such a short lived free time from anxiety. I therefore let it pass on its own, without responding to it, and now i cant even tell you what it was about ?

Have you got to a stage yet whereby you haven't responded to an anxious worry/obsession?

Once you've not responded to an obsession, and realise that you were able to get through it without reassurance, you can then look at any future obsessions as just the same, and it gets easier the more you do.  The hard part is being able to get to that stage and i know 1st hand it's not easy..... 

Hi Mentalchecker. Yes I have had a few other obsessions this morning and managed to leave them go pretty easy. I know I can do what I’m supposed to and feel pretty well. For the last few weeks the ‘worry’ I speak of, didn’t bother much at all. But then it came back in other guises and made me feel guilty and horrible and horrendous really and I got duped into ruminating on it and bringing it back to life.    It seems when my doubt is strong I have a hard time doing what I’m supposed to do. Basically that is accepting the thoughts are there but not engaging. 

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@MentalChecker I’m trying to give more belief to the idea that the content of the obsessions cos let’s face it that’s what they are, are irrelevant. My Father said for 21 years now I’ve had OCD and he said it’s all the same no matter how it disguises itself.  To me of course it feels worse ( as whatever is bothering me at the present time) is the worst ever!! It targets things I value most and fear happening and make me wonder did they or didn’t etc etc...

I really want to have a renewed sense of optimism and start again on what has been a really hard few days. I must say I’m exhausted and lacking energy with it all and have my fingernails bitten down to the last. I seem to always need someone to tell me it’s ok to feel good and not let this bother you and move on. 

Edited by Nikki79
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Yep because what you've just said in your last paragraph is reassurance! 

Also by you 'trying to give more belief to the idea that the content of the obsessions cos let’s face it that’s what they are, are irrelevant', is also reassurance, and by doing both of those things, is why you can't move on, because by doing those things you are keeping the OCD loop going. 

Imagine it like an electrical circuit? If you make ANY break in the electrical circuit, the electricity (OCD in this case) it cant flow/work.

Or imagine the M25 (circular motorway in the South) (sorry not being patronising but don't know where in the Country you are and important to know it's a circular motorway that keeps going around and around if you stay on it driving).  To get off the motorway, you need to obviously leave at a junction/slip road, otherwise you will keep going around and around forever!

And that is EXACTLY what you are doing at the moment, by doing what you are doing (i realise its unintentional and you are only doing it because you incorrectly believe its the only way to freedom - but it's not).

To get out of that loop you've been in for the last 20 years, you need to do something different from what you've previously been doing, because what you've been doing doesn't work does it? 

Therefore take that slip road and get off the motorway!! ???

P. S Ive had OCD (mental checking/obsessions/compulsions/reassurance) for around 34 years (but only diagnosed about 8 years ago), and I therefore do realise what you are going through Nicky.  But i can honestly tell you that these last few months have been some of the best ive had, due to not doing the compulsions.

Yes its been hard, but the irony is, although its hard, its actually EASIER than doing the compulsions, and i never ever thought i would have said that.  Maybe you need to be able to get to a certain stage in your recovery and tolerance to uncertainty to be able to feel that, but what im saying is 100% the honest truth Nicky. 

Give it a go....?

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I think so I must be reassuring myself and not even realizing it. 

May I ask apart from not giving the thoughts time, what else are you doing to feel so good? Btw I’m delighted for you that you have enjoyed feeling good you deserve it especially after what you went through for so long: 

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Hi Nicky, 

I know exactly what you are referring to.

When i was doing compulsions, I was getting the most uplifting of feelings right inside my heart?

The only way i can try and explain it is, like when you haven't had a drink all day, and when you eventually have that drink, you feel completely refreshed with all your senses open and aware again? 

Its because you have had that huge weight lifted off your shoulder, the weight that has been closing all of your senses off, to enable you to closely analyse and obsess with 100% concentration on the worry. Once you get the release from the anxiety, all of the bodies senses start working again, and it feels great doesn't it? But it's very short lived.....

The reason you do the compulsions is to rid yourself of the anxiety. 

However, if you build up the tolerance to the anxiety, the anxiety doesn't cause as much distress or last as long, therefore no need for the compulsions. 

That feeling I was getting when i did the compulsions was such a euphoric experience, it felt like my adrenaline was constantly racing all of the time, and its very addictive, hence another reason why you keep repeating the same behaviour, because its both anxiety reducing and a great feeling...... 

 

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32 minutes ago, MentalChecker said:

Hi Nicky, 

I know exactly what you are referring to.

When i was doing compulsions, I was getting the most uplifting of feelings right inside my heart?

The only way i can try and explain it is, like when you haven't had a drink all day, and when you eventually have that drink, you feel completely refreshed with all your senses open and aware again? 

Its because you have had that huge weight lifted off your shoulder, the weight that has been closing all of your senses off, to enable you to closely analyse and obsess with 100% concentration on the worry. Once you get the release from the anxiety, all of the bodies senses start working again, and it feels great doesn't it? But it's very short lived.....

The reason you do the compulsions is to rid yourself of the anxiety. 

However, if you build up the tolerance to the anxiety, the anxiety doesn't cause as much distress or last as long, therefore no need for the compulsions. 

That feeling I was getting when i did the compulsions was such a euphoric experience, it felt like my adrenaline was constantly racing all of the time, and its very addictive, hence another reason why you keep repeating the same behaviour, because its both anxiety reducing and a great feeling...... 

 

Until it doesn’t work and causes more problems and issues with more images and questions and worrying, that’s what most likely happens. The assured false comfort never lasts at all.

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9 minutes ago, MentalChecker said:

It will get easier and better providing you DONT do any compulsions ?

So far I’m managing pretty well my friend. I have tools to help me with the intrusive thoughts as they come into my mind. I was saying to my Dad that it can be difficult to treat them all as intrusive thoughts as there is so many! Honestly Mentalchecker it’s like a computer game with loads of enemies flying at me and I have to shoot them all off one by one. Like I said also there all these horrid feelings which would make you feel quite low. 

Edited by Nikki79
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13 hours ago, Nikki79 said:

So far I’m managing pretty well my friend. I have tools to help me with the intrusive thoughts as they come into my mind. I was saying to my Dad that it can be difficult to treat them all as intrusive thoughts as there is so many! Honestly Mentalchecker it’s like a computer game with loads of enemies flying at me and I have to shoot them all off one by one. Like I said also there all these horrid feelings which would make you feel quite low. 

Yes I now what you mean, I had all of that as well, and still do.

But you don't need to 'shoot them off one by one', you don't need to even acknowledge them, as they come into your mind, just continue doing whatever you were doing beforehand and completely ignore them. 

The more you can do the above, the less you will get, and the less anxiety you will feel.

Also, as a side note, please do not take this the wrong way what I'm about to say. However as great as your dads intentions are, by the sounds of things you've written above, you are getting some type of reassurance from him, which will not help you recover. 

ANYTHING you do or receive that reduces the anxiety, will not help, you need to let it go down on its own without any interventions from either yourself or any others. 

 

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Yes I agree about the reassurance, you are spot on there and honestly I rarely ask for it anymore but if I am particularly weak it can be incredibly difficult to manage on my own. 

It seems that to carry on regardless is teaching the brain that the thoughts don’t really matter. The thing for me is I’m still not 100% there yet but I aim to be. 

 

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On 26/07/2020 at 11:26, MentalChecker said:

Yes I now what you mean, I had all of that as well, and still do.

But you don't need to 'shoot them off one by one', you don't need to even acknowledge them, as they come into your mind, just continue doing whatever you were doing beforehand and completely ignore them. 

The more you can do the above, the less you will get, and the less anxiety you will feel.

Also, as a side note, please do not take this the wrong way what I'm about to say. However as great as your dads intentions are, by the sounds of things you've written above, you are getting some type of reassurance from him, which will not help you recover. 

ANYTHING you do or receive that reduces the anxiety, will not help, you need to let it go down on its own without any interventions from either yourself or any others. 

 

You know one thing that catches me is that whatever is occupying my ocd brain always tends to be the most scary thing it could be and all the catastrophic consequences that follow thereafter...This is why I get stuck. 

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1 hour ago, Nikki79 said:

You know one thing that catches me is that whatever is occupying my ocd brain always tends to be the most scary thing it could be and all the catastrophic consequences that follow thereafter...This is why I get stuck. 

They are ALL the MOST scary things at the time when they are bothering you. 

I got caught out by one yesterday afternoon, and I inadvertently thought about it for a few minutes and got reassurance, ever since then it's been bothering me and i feel like I need to check it again in case I didn't check it correctly, or I didn't really feel reassured (meaning that there could be something wrong with it) , otherwise its going to bother me forever.... But.....I haven't checked it since yesterday afternoon, and although its still there in the background of my mind, asking me to check it again just one last time, then it will go away forever, I know from history that it will never be the last time, and I can NEVER be sure, therefore again from history I know it will eventually fade away...and change into something else..... 

I've had some that have lasted several weeks at a time, before they change into something else, and then they come back around again several months later....

It just goes to show that it was due to it catching me out thinking about it, giving it time, and getting reassurance, that has caused this problem. 

So... You see what I mean Nicky about reassurance? It's not good.... 

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4 hours ago, MentalChecker said:

They are ALL the MOST scary things at the time when they are bothering you. 

I got caught out by one yesterday afternoon, and I inadvertently thought about it for a few minutes and got reassurance, ever since then it's been bothering me and i feel like I need to check it again in case I didn't check it correctly, or I didn't really feel reassured (meaning that there could be something wrong with it) , otherwise its going to bother me forever.... But.....I haven't checked it since yesterday afternoon, and although its still there in the background of my mind, asking me to check it again just one last time, then it will go away forever, I know from history that it will never be the last time, and I can NEVER be sure, therefore again from history I know it will eventually fade away...and change into something else..... 

I've had some that have lasted several weeks at a time, before they change into something else, and then they come back around again several months later....

It just goes to show that it was due to it catching me out thinking about it, giving it time, and getting reassurance, that has caused this problem. 

So... You see what I mean Nicky about reassurance? It's not good.... 

Yeah it’s the devil’s potion right from the cup!! It’s so weird how we can get ‘stuck’ on one in particular tho isn’t it? I mean the one that has been bothering is actually about as bad as it gets cos it involves my child. Horrible.

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