I have to accept it.

[mchmis26]

I always thought my new obsessions over myself being a covert narcissist were related to undiagnosed OCD.

But I think I actually might be a narcissist. And I’m feeling like I should just accept it.

Ive been looking at articles on it for the past hour and I can’t find anything telling me I’m not. The symptoms match.

I know this is unrelated to narcissism but I don’t know where else to go with this information. I have to keep it to myself.

I just want to be normal. I don’t want to hurt anyone but there’s always a “what if you’re saying that just to keep people around”. I want to live normally and have no ulterior motive.

I’m ******.

[PolarBear]

I suggest you tslk to a psychiatrist or psychologist for a determination.

However, it should be noted that narcissists don't spend their days worrying that they are narcissists. 

[Mike68]

I went through a phase where I was convinced that I was a covert narcissist. Research on the internet made things worse, as I reviewed events in my life that matched each of the symptoms given.

It seemed that, despite how rarely I may have displayed a particular symptom of narcissism, the proof was undeniable - I was a narcissist. This caused me immense distress.

I read somewhere that narcissists can experience anxiety and depression. I was anxious and depressed, therefore I must be one. The thing is, I was anxious at the thought of being a narcissist. I began to think about what causes a narcissist to be anxious and depressed and came to the conclusion that it's because they're not receiving the respect and and admiration that they feel entitled to. 

It has taken a while for me to accept that I am most probably not a narcissist, although I sometimes lapse.

The fact that you are worried about being a narcissist is evidence that you are not one.

[mchmis26]

9 hours ago, Mike68 said:

I went through a phase where I was convinced that I was a covert narcissist. Research on the internet made things worse, as I reviewed events in my life that matched each of the symptoms given.

It seemed that, despite how rarely I may have displayed a particular symptom of narcissism, the proof was undeniable - I was a narcissist. This caused me immense distress.

I read somewhere that narcissists can experience anxiety and depression. I was anxious and depressed, therefore I must be one. The thing is, I was anxious at the thought of being a narcissist. I began to think about what causes a narcissist to be anxious and depressed and came to the conclusion that it's because they're not receiving the respect and and admiration that they feel entitled to. 

It has taken a while for me to accept that I am most probably not a narcissist, although I sometimes lapse.

The fact that you are worried about being a narcissist is evidence that you are not one.

But there are some self aware ones. I’m just convinced at this point, everything matches up. I really appreciate your response but I don’t feel normal. I want to be but I’m so, so convinced. I keep testing myself and my empathy and I’m about to give up.

[Mike68]

I too was convinced that I was a narcissist. The internet didn't help as there are so many definitions of narcissism - basically anyone can believe that they have the symptoms.

Testing yourself for empathy and compassion is very much a symptom of OCD. In my case, I would ruminate for hours over whether I could feel empathy, did I really love my family and were my friendships just a means of exploiting others.

I think that narcissism has become a popular topic on the internet and consequently people with OCD are more likely to develop a theme around it than in the past. That's what happened to me, I googled 'lack of empathy' and was sucked into a world that brought terror and despair - being a narcissist was the last thing that I wanted!

[mchmis26]

1 hour ago, Mike68 said:

I too was convinced that I was a narcissist. The internet didn't help as there are so many definitions of narcissism - basically anyone can believe that they have the symptoms.

Testing yourself for empathy and compassion is very much a symptom of OCD. In my case, I would ruminate for hours over whether I could feel empathy, did I really love my family and were my friendships just a means of exploiting others.

I think that narcissism has become a popular topic on the internet and consequently people with OCD are more likely to develop a theme around it than in the past. That's what happened to me, I googled 'lack of empathy' and was sucked into a world that brought terror and despair - being a narcissist was the last thing that I wanted!

Thank you for sharing this, it’s really giving me hope. It’s just that my thinking lines up with npd and I believe I’m scared to have it because people will leave me which is an npd trait. It’s proving really hard to convince myself otherwise.

[Mike68]

The fear of people leaving you is a natural human trait and doesn't prove that you have NPD.

OCD will cause the sufferer to believe the worst and is fuelled by doubt and questions about your thoughts and feelings. Try not to focus on things that prove your fears and remind yourself of the times when you have felt empathy and compassion toward others.

I hope you get through this - it's truly awful to believe that you are something that is abhorrent to you.

[MrStar]

4 hours ago, Mike68 said:

I too was convinced that I was a narcissist. The internet didn't help as there are so many definitions of narcissism - basically anyone can believe that they have the symptoms.

Testing yourself for empathy and compassion is very much a symptom of OCD. In my case, I would ruminate for hours over whether I could feel empathy, did I really love my family and were my friendships just a means of exploiting others.

I think that narcissism has become a popular topic on the internet and consequently people with OCD are more likely to develop a theme around it than in the past. That's what happened to me, I googled 'lack of empathy' and was sucked into a world that brought terror and despair - being a narcissist was the last thing that I wanted!

I really like the way Mike put it because I've suffered with OCD for years and I'm not sure if I've ever thought about the role the internet and the media play in relation to my OCD.

Thank you Mike.

I wish you all the luck Mchmis26.

Edited November 24, 2020 by MrStar

[mchmis26]

37 minutes ago, MrStar said:

I really like the way Mike put it because I've suffered with OCD for years and I'm not sure if I've ever thought about the role the internet and the media play in relation to my OCD.

Thank you Mike.

I wish you all the luck Mchmis26.

That’s true. I’m not diagnosed but I’ve realised most of my obsessions came from seeing a topic on tv (cancer, “evil” personality disorders or sexuality etc) and would run with it.

Today has been a mix of reassurance in my mind and sudden bursts of “hey (m/n) remember you’re a narcissist) whenever I’m alone or undistracted. But I feel like I’m using it to be in denial. What I’ve done in the past, the things that go through my mind and how manipulative I can be ,and I hate to admit that but I have to to give you guys an idea about how it may not be just ocd, just justifies that I am one. It all matches up and I’m scared, but why I’m scared is probably narcissistic in itself.

I must be really frustrating you guys with my stubbornness to believe you, and I really really appreciate the support and advice and wisdom you have both given me but right now I fully believe I have npd and I’m not normal. 
 

That’s where I am right now, I don’t know if it’ll pass like my episode on my sexual/gender identity which also felt real but for now I am convinced. Could be ocd, could be autism as I’ve been suspecting I have for a while due to my feelings of understanding and empathy and fitting in. But that does not change the fact that I’m most likely a narcissist. I don’t know anymore to be fairly honest. I just needed to vent somewhere.

[Mike68]

There are so many people on this forum who fear being something that really upsets them. If you were to read a post by someone who believes that they are a paedophile, for example, you may see a similarity to what you are experiencing. It's the fear of being something that you find abhorrent that drives the obsessive thoughts and subsequent rumination that reinforces your worst fears.

This is easy for me to say but I'm really struggling at the moment. I have a reasonable grasp of the'theory' of OCD but I find the feelings around it almost unbearable.

Can I suggest that if you feel compelled to use the internet, try to research OCD not NPD.

 

[BigDave]

22 hours ago, PolarBear said:

I suggest you tslk to a psychiatrist or psychologist for a determination.

However, it should be noted that narcissists don't spend their days worrying that they are narcissists. 

This is the truth. A narcissist would be like “man, I love that I’m me”. At least that’s my take on what a narcissist would feel. He wouldn’t be worried. You could have another anxiety disorder maybe but you really would need a professional opinion. 

[mchmis26]

9 minutes ago, Mike68 said:

There are so many people on this forum who fear being something that really upsets them. If you were to read a post by someone who believes that they are a paedophile, for example, you may see a similarity to what you are experiencing. It's the fear of being something that you find abhorrent that drives the obsessive thoughts and subsequent rumination that reinforces your worst fears.

This is easy for me to say but I'm really struggling at the moment. I have a reasonable grasp of the'theory' of OCD but I find the feelings around it almost unbearable.

Can I suggest that if you feel compelled to use the internet, try to research OCD not NPD.

 

I have so many times to try and reassure myself that I’m not a bad person. I haven’t been taken seriously by anyone I’ve spoken to in the medical field, my GP and old therapist told me my intrusive thoughts were normal for everyone and I need to meditate and keep reassuring myself. I’m a goddamn mess and nobody believes me. This website is my only form of support. But then again, what if? You know?

[BigDave]

Just now, mchmis26 said:

I have so many times to try and reassure myself that I’m not a bad person. I haven’t been taken seriously by anyone I’ve spoken to in the medical field, my GP and old therapist told me my intrusive thoughts were normal for everyone and I need to meditate and keep reassuring myself. I’m a goddamn mess and nobody believes me. This website is my only form of support. But then again, what if? You know?

Just a heads up. The more times you try to seek reassurance whether it’s from yourself or others, then you are literally feeding the beast. Mindfulness is actually quite a cool way of dealing with these things. Rather than engaging, just accept the thoughts are there. Don’t make any judgement on them at all. And they lose power. I can recommend you some good mindfulness stuff. 

[Mike68]

It's frustrating when you seek help and your problem is trivialised.

One of the features of OCD, is that sufferers don't present as being mentally ill in the standard sense. They're not delusional or paranoid but they are very frightened and I think that some medical professionals don't really appreciate how upsetting OCD is to the sufferer.

It is a very personal experience. The thoughts that cause such anxiety are tailor-made to attack values and beliefs that you hold dear. Conveying this to a medical professional is difficult - it's difficult enough to understand it yourself.

 

Edited November 24, 2020 by Mike68

[MrStar]

36 minutes ago, mchmis26 said:

I have so many times to try and reassure myself that I’m not a bad person. I haven’t been taken seriously by anyone I’ve spoken to in the medical field, my GP and old therapist told me my intrusive thoughts were normal for everyone and I need to meditate and keep reassuring myself. I’m a goddamn mess and nobody believes me. This website is my only form of support. But then again, what if? You know?

I'm sorry Mchmis your feeling this way.

In all honesty I'm really struggling lately with OCD to the point I'm feeling at times like I want to just cry.

I wish you all the best .

[PolarBear]

8 hours ago, mchmis26 said:

But there are some self aware ones. I’m just convinced at this point, everything matches up. I really appreciate your response but I don’t feel normal. I want to be but I’m so, so convinced. I keep testing myself and my empathy and I’m about to give up.

I can say with absolute conviction that OCD sufferers don't ferl normal either.

You keep testing yourself. Thst eould be a compulsion, as in OCD.

[mchmis26]

@BigDave @Mike68 @PolarBear @MrStar  I want to thank you guys so much for the support. This is the only place I feel I can talk about my thoughts as they vary in taboo and makes me seem like a terrible person out loud. I’m trying not to fight the voice in my head but I know I can’t keep putting off getting help and insisting there is something wrong. Do you guys have any tips on getting yourself a diagnosis even if that means being firm sometimes?

Im honestly so, so grateful for you guys’ insight, I hope you’re all well.

[Phil]

In the UK, only  a registered clinical psychologist/psychiatrist can formally diagnose. Can I ask, why do you need a formal diagnosis?

[mchmis26]

16 minutes ago, Phil said:

In the UK, only  a registered clinical psychologist/psychiatrist can formally diagnose. Can I ask, why do you need a formal diagnosis?

I guess I came across wrong, diagnosis or not seeing a professional would help me to understand myself. I keep being brushed off which is making me feel like what I’m experiencing is normal. I need answers rather than a diagnosis and whether it’s in that form or not I need some form of help.

[Phil]

Whoever brushed you off is an idiot, and are not professionally experienced/trained/qualified. I only ask about diagnosis because a reputable therapist will work on your negative symptoms with you as a person. Working in the NHS as a high intensity therapist (retired now), very few of my patients had formal diagnoses. We worked in a therapeutic collaboration to improve their symptoms.  OCD or OCD pure-o is everyday work to a CBT professional. You probably know CBT /ERP is the recommended therapy in the  NHS here in the UK , but CBT can be individualised. A professional (CBT) will undoubtedly help, but CBT is collaborative and a client has to be prepared to be committed, engaged and motivated. A therapist can give  initial relaxation/stress management techniques before doing the protocol, but the therapy is a 50/50 collaboration between you and the therapist. Usually with OCD, no background/history of problems is raised. however, if their is a 'significant' backstory then this needs to be discussed.  Some of my patients disclosed and we worked just cognitively and they recovered without ERP. CBT is a relatively short therapy ( we in the NHS were allowed up to 20, 1 hour sessions, and that was stretching it). Please bear in mind that if you see a therapist (CBT), they can only focus on, say OCD, at once. They, and yourself are focusing on your MAIN mental health problems. 

At the end of this long post, the goal is to be in therapy, and with a therapist you can have a therapeutic relationship with (trust). If you feel you require a formal diagnosis, then that's ok,  I'm just giving my view on how therapy can help without one. Regards Phil