Dakagraphics-David Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Hi everyone... This just might be a good idea... For a long time, I actually believed that I contaminated the world... Literally... Everything I touched... Even walking on an indoor carpet after walking on the pavement outside... My doormat... Any mail that came to my home was 'Contaminated'. If I touched my hair, and then touched something else, I would be transferring 'something', from 'something' to something else. I would sit in a therapy room at a day centre, Staring at the door handle... I was trapped, because What if I touched the handle to leave the room? What would I put on it for someone else to touch? What what I be taking off it, to then pass to something/ someone else? It became impossible... My grandchildren would crawl on a floor that I had walked on in outdoor shoes... What if they became ill because of anything on my shoes? Because I knew... That was a while ago now... 'Bontamination', the state of being 'Bontaminated', by a 'Bontaminator' .eg. I 'Bontaminate' everything I touch... Even the air I breathe is 'Bontaminated' in some way... Always has been... The word 'Bon' comes from the French meaning 'Good'. So to 'Bontaminate' is the same thing as 'Contaminate', but in a good way... A good way... If you look up the word 'Contaminate', there are literally thousands of synonyms... All negative... But if we look up 'Bontaminate' a positive, good word, we cannot find it anywhere... So let's all continue to 'Bontaminate' our world, with 'clean' hands, washing hands after the loo, just as we always have done... Using anti bacterials is fine, as we have a pandemic... But... On our hands we will have 'good' bacteria as well as bad. The good needs the bad to strengthen on... If we antibac excessively, aren't we killing off the good guys as well? Children need to get their hands and knees grubby when developing their immune systems, while crawling about on the floor, we all did, and we are still here to tell the tale... What do you think? My Ocd is contamination based... Has been for as long as I can remember... The thing is... it is a totally negative word... Always bad... I looked in an on-line dictionary, and found at least a hundred related words... All negative... And that is without all the verbs and adjectives etc. So... We need to turn this around... Make it positive in some way, and thus make it do- able. A word that is starting to appear on-line is 'Bontamination', To 'Bontaminate', and 'Bontaminated'. The prefix 'Bon' comes from the French, meaning 'Good'. By that concept... To 'Bontaminate', is to contaminate, but in a good way... In a good way... Wow! If we assume that, at any given time, on our hands, there are good bacteria as well as bad, then when we touch something, or come into contact with some thing, we are putting good on as well as bad... If our fingertips only had bad germs/bacteria on them, then we wouldn't have healthy skin on our fingers, hands, or indeed anything... But we do have good bacteria... If we are 'excessive' in our washing, antibaccing, and bleaching absolutely everything, surely we are also killing off the good guys as well? We are, aren't we? Yes, we need to defeat Covid, so using gel when entering shops, just once, is great... But not between individual items... After all, the cashier touches everything... And always has done... So technically, all the wrappers are cross-contaminated before we even get them in the bags... But that has always been the case... If it were so bad, none of us would have made it to adulthood... But we have, haven't we? We need to 'Bontaminate' our surroundings... A positive, rather than negative move... Reasonably clean can be good enough again... Our surroundings and homes are already 'Bontaminated' in a good way. Always have been... In the H.G.Wells story, 'War of the Worlds' it is the humble bacteria, that we have always been largely immune to, that saves our world. The 'good' bacteria need the 'bad' in order to grow stronger... And that is what ultimately protects us... There is germs and bacteria in the air... Both good, and bad... Which, through our lungs, is linked directly to our bloodstream, and yet, as we grow up, from babies to adults, we actually get stronger... In every way. Biologically. So... By staying reasonably clean, we Bontaminate our world, and that is a good thing... Isn't it? I certainly hope so! I've been doing it, and so far... Actually okay! David. Link to comment
Angst Posted September 25, 2021 Share Posted September 25, 2021 Hi DD I think that your post is incontrovertible. We need to take ‘reasonable’ care. The same principle applies to our legal system: what a reasonable man or woman would do. Those of us with OCD need to compare our actions with those of people who do not have OCD. But if you look at child mortality - the death of children under five rates vary enormously from country to country. Some people do not have access to vaccines, antibiotics, good nutrition, sanitation, clean water and basic hygiene. The WHO list of things that cause child mortality. I am dubious about a golden age in the past. Just compare the U.K. child mortality rates from 1900 or 1950 to today. Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted September 25, 2021 Author Share Posted September 25, 2021 Absolutely. For a long time the legal system has forced us to use incredibly deep food hygiene regulations... To the point where I was scared of getting sued over the risk of Salmonella in eggs... In the care home where I worked, the eggs were so overcooked, as to be like rubber to eat. In the end, we just didn't serve them any more. The problem was the relatives... Just some of them... My manager had a nervous breakdown. We had to use the correct knife, and coloured chopping board... Ready to prove we had done so.. I guess they could get say, £500 for a mild tummy-ache... It was all money... On TV now, they use pieces of tree... A lot better. I had a nervous breakdown too... I watch what happens in supermarkets, and restaurants... We need to be exposed to very small amounts of dust, in order for our immune systems to strengthen on. The saying, 'What doesn't kill you, makes you stronger... comes to mind here, although it is an overused cliché. I try to keep my hands reasonably clean, but no longer use bleach on them... That used to dry out and crack the skin on my hands... Very painful. I think we have to be more open with each other in society. Not everyone wears a mask, despite Covid cases being on the rise... But then, The European cup final at Wembley was over fifty thousand people, all in close proximity to each other, no masks... In theory, it could have been a disaster... We do have better mortality rates today, and I guess a lot of that is down to things like immunisation. Fortunately pretty successful, maybe people get blasé to things when they've had the jab. The biggest advance, I guess, is the capacity to do body scanning, and X-ray pictures which are instantly available to the treatment clinician. Most dog owners clean up after their pets... Years ago it was everywhere. I put my hands in streams... But at the seaside, the water tasted of soap... In ordinary life, we really don't need to antibacterialise our hands in-between items on the shopping cart... We have a certain amount of resistance to our surroundings... Biologically, our bodies are constantly fighting off germs, especially in the air... And yet, we are okay... There is a possibility, I guess, that a lot of the asthma conditions now, are partly due to the amount of antibacterial spray that gets into the air, that we then breathe in. We can detect the smell of cigarette smell from way off, and that is someone else's exhaled air! It's best not to think too deeply about these things, and just, let go, and let it be so... I used to be interested in the super-cinema buildings... Very grand, but in those days not everyone had an indoors toilet... When I was a child, the sink was in the bathroom, but the toilet was separate. But I would try to get downstairs before the toilet stopped flushing. (They were really loud) So, by that coin, I would very rarely have washed my hands... Even before getting an ice cream from the van that came around our streets... We have to be 'reasonably clean'... We have to stay true to our natural environment... In the UK we are very lucky to have the healthcare that we do, but we also have a lot of litigation solicitors springing up... People are getting greedy... But it's not all bad is it..? As a society, we need to be far more tolerant and empathic of each other, but that's another subject! David Link to comment
Angst Posted September 26, 2021 Share Posted September 26, 2021 Were there any cases of a £500 fine? I have a different perspective on care homes to you, especially in the context of an estimated 38,000 unnecessary deaths owing to people being transferred from hospitals with COVID to care homes and the lack of adequate PPE. And having my mother and father in care homes. For the last few months I have been recovering from an illness and have visits from carers. Fortunately my carer has been double jabbed he cancelled a visit to a client couple this morning because one of them has very serious asthma. My carer had a slight cold but cancelled the visit because a cold infection for the client could prove to be fatal. The infection would not make the client stronger. We have the highest rate of infection in Europe with about 1,000 deaths a week. Compare this with say Spain which has has rules on mask wearing. Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted September 27, 2021 Author Share Posted September 27, 2021 Covid is a different kettle of fish... We do need to protect the vulnerable, and we do that with Immunisation, and taking reasonable care, being reasonably clean... We cannot be sterile, anymore than we can breathe pure oxygen. My care home experience was adults with learning disabilities... Scary, dangerous work... The clients used to eat unmentionable things... But I was still expected to be surgically clean when preparing food... On the TV we keep seeing film of large groups of people, no mask wearing, no social distancing... To be fair, that should be made illegal... Now we are bumping off absolutely (Well, 99.9%) every possible germ, What will come next, as nature balances out the natural world? We need the good guys... David Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted October 8, 2021 Author Share Posted October 8, 2021 Hi everyone... This evening, has been a weird one... I've just spotted a book on my bookshelf, called 'Overcoming Compulsive washing... By Paul R Munford. Now, I don't know if any of you have actually read it, but the lengths that the writer experiments go, would stop even me! But, the fact that the experiments are even possible, reduce my fears considerably... I won't do the tasks... But trust the writer, that the tasks are safe... Which helps to disarm a lot of my daily struggle. If they can do it, then I maybe should be able to, but choose not to... I use their evidence... And they are a professional in this field... They have credibility... Just as my CBT therapist had credibility... I could rely on their training and expertise... I've thought about trying to qualify, but I'm too old, and the appropriate training is not available within daily travelling distance... Tonight, I will sleep... I know my pillow isn't perfectly clean... But it is reasonable... As a child my pillows were positively disgusting... It must have made me stronger... We didn't have antibacterial gels and sprays back then... And washing powder had a 'blue whitener' in it to make everything look clean... I've survived... And so has all the rest of my family... At school, we were made to sit cross-legged on the floor in assembly... Who knows what got on our hands and clothing... We'd just brush it all off with our hands... And there was absolutely no way that we could all wash our hands before dinner... And what about those tiny bottles of milk with the foil tops? David Link to comment
olb Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 Hi David, can bontamination apply to mental or emotional contamination where the contaminant isn’t tangible it’s created by thoughts? Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted October 9, 2021 Author Share Posted October 9, 2021 Hi there... Maybe the principle/technique can be adapted, to apply the same sort of release from the thoughts... Such as, checking... My OCD is contamination, and checking... So that is the approach I am using... It's not a magic solution... I try to use it for tangible things, like touch... I reckon that, relationships could be an interesting ball game... What do you feel about this? I do believe it is something that can be worked with... David Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted October 13, 2021 Author Share Posted October 13, 2021 Hi there... This word is beginning to haunt me, and yet, for my own journey through Ocd, it does actually seem to help give a release from perpetual cleaning. I don't honestly know if it can be adapted perhaps for checking Ocd... To just check the door once only, knowing that I have done my public duty, to close a chiller cabinet door in a supermarket... I use the antibacterial gel in the entrance of a shop, just once only, to then know that I have done my duty, so if I touch an item on the display, it is not desperately important that I then purchase said item, to prevent anyone else getting something from me... Just using one plastic glove provided at the fuel station for the car... And that is only cos I don't want to get diesel fuel on my fingers when I'm eating chocolate... Petrol evaporates off, but Diesel... Ugh! And what about cuddly toys? I buy those sometimes for my desk... What's already on them when I get them home? I really don't know, or, to be honest, care, cos I have resistance... My grandchildren handle far worse in the course of a day at school... Okay, Let's see how this thing goes... David Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted October 18, 2021 Author Share Posted October 18, 2021 Okay... so far so good... The word is helping me too now... I sat in a Cafe this morning... Actually buttered some toast... On the way into the cafe, there was a sanitisation point. I used it just the once, then went to the toast bay. I used the tongs provided, the ones that everyone else has used, even the people who may not have sanitised their hands... But thousands of other people will be doing the same, and will have been doing so for years... It's a busy popular cafe. If anyone sued, the place would be closed down for sure. I think about this when I touch a door handle... But nor for long... As other people are saying, I work at not overthinking anything. And so far, it's working for me... I sure hope it lasts... David Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted October 18, 2021 Author Share Posted October 18, 2021 This evening, I went out for a meal... As it is approaching half term holidays, so the youngsters are manic too. We just have to be patient. I'm pretty young at heart too. To fair, after the life I have come through, I basically just don't care anymore. I've spent years being conscientious, and it really didn't make that much difference... So, why worry? I believe that I bontaminate the world, in a good way and the world bontaminates me... In a good way... And that is good enough... Good enough... I'm still special, just as you are too... I can say that, even though we've never actually met... David Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted October 19, 2021 Author Share Posted October 19, 2021 No ill-effects to report... Nothing... l just feel very tired today... I slept well... And didn't wet the bed... As a child I did... Anyone remember the 'Astrid dry bed system? It had metal foil panels between the bed sheets. A battery powered it. The slightest dribble, and bell/buzzer would sound, awakening me... I hated it... But before that, I would wet the bed every night... And go straight to school in the morning, without wishing boy did I pong! But if anyone got sick, I certainly never knew about it, and I was never absent from school for anything, except the measles... David Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted October 28, 2021 Author Share Posted October 28, 2021 Hi everyone... I'm still looking into the validity of this new word... It has had a profound effect on my life, enabling me to progress forward... I still have Ocd, it crops up everyday... I was in a church building this evening, and the gel was on display... I used it once on the way in, but after that, What if I'd touched something 'less than clean?' , I cannot rightly remember, because my brain took no mental photographs this time... But I had to push a green button on the wall in order to open the main doors for exit. Would I have left anything on the button? And in reverse, Was there anything on the button before I'd touched it? We will never know... When I was attending a mental health unit for my CBT therapy, we had to use the same type of green button door release switch... To be fair, I'd rather just touch the door handle and be done with it... Ah well, let's wait and see... I'll give it a couple of days, then report back on my other thread, as to how things go... David Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted November 11, 2021 Author Share Posted November 11, 2021 Well, nothing happened... If anyone else had gotten ill, I would never have known. So maybe the word is... 'Bontaminated', as everything is... Out of the washing machine, and into air... I'm a bontaminator... But the operative it is 'Bon', from the French for 'good' David Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted November 23, 2021 Author Share Posted November 23, 2021 Hi all, the thought came to mind today that, When we sanitise our hands when entering a shop... How long does that sanitisation last? How long does it take to work? We don't know... There are specifications available on company websites, but they vary wildly, and mainly just protect the manufacturers... Perhaps that is the reason that emergency workers also wear gloves after first washing their hands... After all, we leave fingerprints... We've never been perfectly clean, ever... When we were small, we would have crawled about on the floor... That's how we developed our immune systems... I keep coming down with a cold... I reckon that, in order to get Covid under some sort of control, we've been spraying everything, and sanitising our hands, effectively also wiping out all the ordinary germs that have before all this, protected us. So, attempting to be spotlessly clean, is pointless... If, in the street, someone alongside us is smoking, and we smell the smoke, That is second hand air... And always has been... In Cinemas in the 60's and 70's we would have smoke rising through the projector light beam... But not everyone got lung cancer... If we try on an item of clothing in a shop... We 'Bontaminate' the item, with good germs. Yes, some bad, but most good, otherwise everything we touch would be lethal. Especially door handles in supermarket toilets... Basically, everything we touch in air, is 'Bontaminated' with something, and always has been... We may not know what with, that's for scientists to argue over. Everything we touch, every breath of air, is, and always has been, Harmlessly 'Bontaminated'. If we put too much sugar in tea or coffee, it is actually 'Bontaminated' also. Some people will just drink tea and coffee, 'as it comes', it really doesn't matter all that much, a tiny spoonful is not likely to poison us. Even diabetics can tolerate a small amount, and control it with their insulin. What about eggs? Are they ever clean? I purchase them already hard boiled, and they are always moist to handle. What about the shells, the boxes/trays? Are they really ever clean? And salad mushrooms... Salad isn't, and never could be sterile... And yet it is grown in organic soil... If we get that stuff on anything in the house we are normally instructed to use bleach... But we eat the food, only rinsing it with ordinary water... School milk and containers... That is never sterile... It is harmlessly 'Bontaminated', In the course of our daily lives, we perfectly normally and safely, 'Bontaminate' things... We are all, and always have been 'Bontaminators'. And, assuming our hands are 'reasonably clean', that is fine... We have natural defences... Everyone has natural defences... Without them we would be in a germ free bubble in hospital... Those natural defences, if not stimulated, would ultimately fail, and we would need antibiotics all the time. So, let's allow floors to be 'Bontaminated', before we even touch them, and after we've touched them. Door handles must be reasonably okay, otherwise there would be no supermarket/restaurant toilets provided. The evidence speaks for itself. Let's all try and adopt this new word, and give ourselves just a little less worry. When we drink a cup of coffee in a restaurant, yes, the cup looks clean, but it is in air... As are the plates and cutlery... We are in air... Our lungs obtaining the oxygen, and taking away the Carbon dioxide that we exhale, ready for the atmosphere etc, to convert it back to oxygen. There are other things in air, but we are adapted to cope with that... And have been, all our lives... A final thought, When our children were learning to walk, we'd hold their hands to steady them... In that case, 'Bontamination' would have been going to and from our hands, harmlessly building up our natural defences. And that is vital for our very survival. Same with drinking water bottles... David Link to comment
PolarBear Posted November 23, 2021 Share Posted November 23, 2021 Do you think you focus too much on things like this? Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted November 24, 2021 Author Share Posted November 24, 2021 Only on here! I'm presenting evidence in my/Our defence... After many years of mental health difficulties, trying to work in environments where the people were really toxic, I can finally say that I'm flying free. And that makes me happy and enthusiastic. I rest my case! I will still be a member of the forums, if members still wish it, we all need positive input and support at times, proving that OCD can be managed and lived with, especially in these times of Covid. Some of us on here are living proof that there can be a way forward, and I am very grateful to be a part of that. I have been in contact with Marcus John Kim recently, and apparently there is a new book in production, that covers this very subject. It will be available through Amazon. Hopefully we won't be in lockdown this Christmas... David Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted December 6, 2021 Author Share Posted December 6, 2021 When we go into a doctors surgery or waiting room, there is usually a wall mounted gel dispenser provided for us to sanitise our hands... Imagine my surprise when, on entering a consulting room for my covid booster... Three different colours in use!!! I had to ask... It wasn't for my use, but the professionals! One Red, One Green, And One Blue!! How do they know which one to use? Well... For continual medical use, one is soap, one is sanitiser, and one is hand cream... Which one is which? I'd hate to get that lot mixed up!!! Link to comment
Angst Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 On 24/11/2021 at 12:53, Dakagraphics-David said: Only on here! I'm presenting evidence in my/Our defence... After many years of mental health difficulties, trying to work in environments where the people were really toxic, I can finally say that I'm flying free. And that makes me happy and enthusiastic. I rest my case! I will still be a member of the forums, if members still wish it, we all need positive input and support at times, proving that OCD can be managed and lived with, especially in these times of Covid. Some of us on here are living proof that there can be a way forward, and I am very grateful to be a part of that. I have been in contact with Marcus John Kim recently, and apparently there is a new book in production, that covers this very subject. It will be available through Amazon. Hopefully we won't be in lockdown this Christmas... David Marcos John Kim is the pen name of a frequent contributor on OCD Action forum called Wannabefree. Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted December 12, 2021 Author Share Posted December 12, 2021 Absolutely! And a gifted writer too on Amazon... Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted December 18, 2021 Author Share Posted December 18, 2021 Hi everyone, I'm pushing my friend Marcus to get a final book about OCD done... He has first hand experience of this demon, as indeed do I, and I'm trying to move on too. Today I went into a Cafe and relaxed, listening to the Salvation army band playing Christmas carols. Despite all the anxiety this year, it does look like Christmas will happen... Okay, that's enough about this... I'll just carry on with my own thread now... David Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted December 21, 2021 Author Share Posted December 21, 2021 Finally, my good friend Pen named 'Marcus john Kim' has put up a final OCD related book onto Amazon kindle, the print version is expected in three or four days... The title of the book is; 'In a nutshell... The concept of 'Bontamination' . It looks really good, I've actually seen the manuscript and stuff.... David Link to comment
snowbear Posted December 22, 2021 Share Posted December 22, 2021 Hmm... I have some lingering reservations about this 'Bontamination' idea. Personally I think the method requires a lot of time and energy spent trying to keep your OCD under control. It doesn't seem to get you OCD free. By that I mean your days (as you report them here) are all about how you didn't let OCD win. That's great! But what I'd really love to see is you posting about how you went off and did xyz and are so happy and busy doing your own thing that you hadn't a moment in your day to give OCD a second thought. I'd love you to report back that there is no such thing as 'Bontanination' because you've finally realised there was no 'bad' contamination in the first place. That's when your thinking will be back to normal. Currently I'm still seeing the OCD thinking process going on, viewing the world through an OCD lens even though you're not reacting with compulsions any more. That will never equate to recovery, no matter how much it improves your life. Don't get me wrong, every little improvement is of value! But it's not the same as being OCD free (recovered) and that concerns me when I see people promoting this as a method for 'recovery'. Link to comment
Angst Posted December 30, 2021 Share Posted December 30, 2021 (edited) My problem is the use of language such as ‘good germ’ which is an oxymoron as in colloquial English a germ is a pathogen. To be sure a lot of viruses and bacteria are harmless to human beings. Improving public health over the last 140 years is about identifying pathogens and developing clean water and sewage systems and vaccinations which eliminated pathogenic agents and eliminated diseases as cholera and measles in the developed world. It is these things which have made as healthier and prolonged life expectancy. A good introduction to viruses is the current series on COVID on BBC 4 The Christmas Lectures on Viruses and COVID at the Royal Institutions in front of an audience of bright kids. I learned about the biotechnology of testing. The first lecture deals with the concept of viruses and in particular how COVID infects the respiratory system. In the second lecture the idea of mathematical modelling was entertainingly explained. The third broadcast tonight is on how vaccinations work and developed. To be sure in the developed world with clean water, sewage systems, public health regulations and vaccinations the world is much safer than previous epochs. But we need to follow the advice of committed scientists. I agree with Snowbear that your progress has been outstanding but the constant monitoring means that the personal ravages of extreme OCD still haunt you. Edited December 30, 2021 by Angst Link to comment
Dakagraphics-David Posted December 31, 2021 Author Share Posted December 31, 2021 How about over thirty years of mental health experience... qualifications held in Psychology, Sociology and Human Biology... It isn't haunting me... I'm actually enjoying life now, and studying with the open university. We can refer to Isaac Newton's third law, equal and opposing forces - Immuniy. And Marcus john kim books are brilliantl! I hereby rest my case... Link to comment
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