I'm still struggling with guilt and shame

[Cora]

Yes, I'm still struggling with guilt and shame that comes from having intrusive thoughts and urges. But, I believe, these feelings, of guilt and shame, feel the most awful when I have thoughts on purpose. 

I also realised there are topics I could think about and wouldn't even flinch, but if I were to ask other people, they would feel very uncomfortable to think about them. For example, for some very odd reason, I could easily think about my parents, friends and even strangers I see on the street having sex. It bothers me a lot, especially the parents part, because thinking about this it's almost the same as thinking about a regular or mundane thing, such as the weather, what I'm going to have for dinner or what my plans for the weekend are; and I just don't think that's okay. And this adds another layer of shame and disgust. 

I also feel extremely guilty and ashamed when I get "false" feelings of attraction towards very young people. For example, today in the park, I kept staring at people that seemed of very young age and feeling like I was attracted to them. It felt incredibly real and like I was enjoying it. 

I feel like the shame and guilt from these situations (and from the actual events that happened) feel heavier that the regular ones, and I'm not really sure how to deal with them. 

[malina]

Hey Cora,

so first off, I am proud of how you posted this question, it's not a detailed confession but a description of your problem and you are asking for advice rather than just reassurance...so here goes..

It doesn't matter that you have the thoughts on purpose, something inside you is making you feel that you need to think these thoughts even though it causes you distress and shame. That drive to think things you don't really want to is an intrusion. I think a misconception about intrusive thoughts is that they are like a flash in your brain that you don't want and you don't know where they are coming from. I don't think that is true, I have never experienced it that way myself, I think they can come in many different forms.

You are having these thoughts because you think they are a big deal. After reading your post, I tried to imagine my own parents having sex and you know I could easily imagine it too. To be honest, I didn't feel that uncomfortable thinking it. Actually, I feel more uncomfortable admitting that I thought about it and that I didn't feel that weird! I think people find such thoughts uncomfortable because it's a taboo, but your parents having sex isn't a big deal, they are just people and that is how you came into this world so it's all good. Thinking about strangers having sex? Some people might find that funny rather than wrong or twisted. I think you need to relax your moral standards a little bit, having thoughts about taboo things isn't necessarily wrong. Some people have a good imagination and find it fun to think of bizzare things. The good thing is that it's all in your brain and nobody knows or cares.

My point is that if you could just stop seeing all of this as such a big drama, the thoughts wouldn't bother you and you'd easily stop thinking them.

From a CBT standpoint, I think ERP would involve actively thinking these thoughts over and over again until you habituate to them (i.e. until they no longer make you feel bad). Do exercises where you freely think about the most inappropriate things and allow the feelings of guilt and shame to come, do it over and over again until you no longer feel ashamed and you no longer care.

[Hedgehog]

Great reply from @malina in my opinion. Yep you have OCD so you are attributing meaning to thoughts and feelings that other people would not even acknowledge. I've had this kind of thing before. And yep I just checked - I can imagine my parents having sex, easy enough to imagine.

[Bismah OCD-UK Volunteer]

Hi Cora,

Totally agree with @malina . I also wanted to ask whether you’re seeing a professional? It’s important to seek help from someone who knows about OCD and uses ERP and CBT to deal with our thoughts better. Your brain will throw the most disgusting and vile thoughts/feelings/urges at you and you will feel guilty for having those. Learning to accept those thoughts without trying to rationalise or neutralise them will help to unlatch the grip OCD has on you. 

Bismah

[njb]

12 hours ago, malina said:

That drive to think things you don't really want to is an intrusion. I think a misconception about intrusive thoughts is that they are like a flash in your brain that you don't want and you don't know where they are coming from. I don't think that is true, I have never experienced it that way myself, I think they can come in many different forms.

@malina agree. Comes in many forms. Once the obsession begins and you are endlessly analysing and scrutinising and compulsively testing and ruminating it's all fuel.  Certainly don't want any of them overall. I guess it's a tough one but once you are endlessly anxious and hyper aware and questioning own sexuality and identity and hyper aware of all mental and physical sensations you are pretty much of course wired to the obsession and become a huge machine of testing - that is without having addressed compulsion and rumination etc. I guess my point is I'm even scared to agree that things could be more specific because I'm now scared I don't have ocd - quite fragile today ! But I agree. Comes from all places.

[Cora]

Thank you very much everyone! You are all very kind and understanding. 

13 hours ago, malina said:

Hey Cora,

so first off, I am proud of how you posted this question, it's not a detailed confession but a description of your problem and you are asking for advice rather than just reassurance...so here goes..

It doesn't matter that you have the thoughts on purpose, something inside you is making you feel that you need to think these thoughts even though it causes you distress and shame. That drive to think things you don't really want to is an intrusion. I think a misconception about intrusive thoughts is that they are like a flash in your brain that you don't want and you don't know where they are coming from. I don't think that is true, I have never experienced it that way myself, I think they can come in many different forms.

You are having these thoughts because you think they are a big deal. After reading your post, I tried to imagine my own parents having sex and you know I could easily imagine it too. To be honest, I didn't feel that uncomfortable thinking it. Actually, I feel more uncomfortable admitting that I thought about it and that I didn't feel that weird! I think people find such thoughts uncomfortable because it's a taboo, but your parents having sex isn't a big deal, they are just people and that is how you came into this world so it's all good. Thinking about strangers having sex? Some people might find that funny rather than wrong or twisted. I think you need to relax your moral standards a little bit, having thoughts about taboo things isn't necessarily wrong. Some people have a good imagination and find it fun to think of bizzare things. The good thing is that it's all in your brain and nobody knows or cares.

My point is that if you could just stop seeing all of this as such a big drama, the thoughts wouldn't bother you and you'd easily stop thinking them.

From a CBT standpoint, I think ERP would involve actively thinking these thoughts over and over again until you habituate to them (i.e. until they no longer make you feel bad). Do exercises where you freely think about the most inappropriate things and allow the feelings of guilt and shame to come, do it over and over again until you no longer feel ashamed and you no longer care.

Thank you very, very much for this, malina! 

12 hours ago, Bismah OCD-UK Volunteer said:

I also wanted to ask whether you’re seeing a professional?

Thank you for your reply, Bismah. Unfortunately, I stopped seeing my therapist about a month ago because treatment with her didn't seem to work (it was mainly my fault as I found it very difficult to apply the techniques which were taught in the sessions).