Feeling hopeless

[Cora]

After so many years struggling with this and after so many unsuccessful months spent in therapy, I am starting to lose hope. For the past few weeks, I’ve had thoughts that it would be a lot easier to (really) give in and accept that this is not OCD, and that, at the end of the day, I’m a pervert, creep and weirdo. I struggle daily with urges to do awful things and I think I can’t control myself anymore. I have urges to look at people and their private parts after having sexual thoughts about them and I do look at them. I have urges to click on something on social media while having thoughts that it could be something illegal and morally wrong and I do click on it. I have urges to have inappropriate fantasies and I do have them. I constantly have urges to do malicious things and to be my worst version. It’s a very frustrating thing though. I wake up in the morning and tell myself that I want to be a kind, good, non-creepy person and by the end of the day I have up to five incidents/moments that emphasise how I am the opposite of that.

I’m completely different than who I was four years ago, when all of this started. I feel a lot more rotten inside. I don’t have a good side anymore. All my thoughts, all of them, are dirty. They are about sex, harm, violence, incest and everything that is wrong with this world. Everything around me causes my body either a real arousal and an urge to masturbate or have sex or urges to abuse and murder someone in the sickest ways possible. From the moment I wake up to the moment I go to bed, my body goes from a groinal response to an urge and then back to a groinal and it’s exhausting. But it’s even more exhausting when it feels like I enjoy and want all of that and when there is no evidence for me prove otherwise. This is my life. I truly feel like I enjoy this monstrosity because those feelings (of enjoyment) are as real as the normal ones (love for my partner, anger when something’s wrong, sadness when I hear my grandmother is not well, frustration when an important thing doesn’t go as planned, as so on). I have to force myself to hate these feelings or to at least question them. Sometimes I even smile when I get these feelings and feel a sense of calm and happiness. And sometimes I even feel like I would really have to act on them and the urges they cause because that’s the only way to be fulfilled and happy. My intentions and behaviour around people is no better. I'm an unpleasant, freaky person when I'm around people. And I most definitely end up making people uncomfortable. I can feel how more and more colleagues at work dislike and even hate me, and that's for good reason. 

I can’t live like this anymore. You may think that I’m exaggerating but every day for me is hell on earth. I haven’t had a normal day in years and nothing helps anymore. When I feel like I’ve dealt with one issue, another one comes along. And when there are no present issues to worry about, the past ones, especially the dark secrets that no one knows about, come to the surface, and I’m back in the hell cycle. There is no break for me, not even when I’m asleep.

My worry is how to fix this. Do I hide from the world? Do I end my life? The first option is great but my urges are so overwhelming that I’ll probably end snapping sooner or later. I’ve thought about the second option several times and it seems like the most reasonable one. I’m not as scared of it anymore but I do feel a little sad to know that I could miss on a lot of lovely things. But, at the same time, what’s the point of having and experiencing those lovely things when I am who I am?

I’m not sure why I’m posting this. I’m not sure how anyone can help me. But I am thankful to anyone who’s read this.

[DRS1]

7 hours ago, Cora said:

For the past few weeks, I’ve had thoughts that it would be a lot easier to (really) give in and accept that this is not OCD, and that, at the end of the day, I’m a pervert, creep and weirdo. I struggle daily with urges to do awful things and I think I can’t control myself anymore.

Well that's just not the case though is it. You aren't giving up on the chance to get better. You know yourself OCD plays this kind of game. Either you are a pervert, a creep or a weirdo or maybe you have OCD and you just care more about not being things that don't match your values. It's Theory A Vs Theory B. 

 

Sit with the urges. It's a feeling, it's high anxiety induced and just stick with it and notice what happens (without doing compulsions). As for the last part, there is your problem. You are still trying to play by the rules of OCD with the very idea that you even need to control anything and when you don't and in a lot of cases you can't.

 

 

7 hours ago, Cora said:

I have urges to look at people and their private parts after having sexual thoughts about them and I do look at them. I have urges to click on something on social media while having thoughts that it could be something illegal and morally wrong and I do click on it. I have urges to have inappropriate fantasies and I do have them. I constantly have urges to do malicious things and to be my worst version. It’s a very frustrating thing though. I wake up in the morning and tell myself that I want to be a kind, good, non-creepy person and by the end of the day I have up to five incidents/moments that emphasise how I am the opposite of that.

So let's start here. Simple question for you. If someone else has OCD and has all these worries and urged, does that make them a pervert or a weirdo? Or can that only apply to just you? Have a think about that and come back with an answer as it would be interesting to see how you view things.

 

7 hours ago, Cora said:

All my thoughts, all of them, are dirty. They are about sex, harm, violence, incest and everything that is wrong with this world

This I honestly hate to see written at all. You did not choose to experience intrusive thoughts, images, feelings or sensations so how can they be something you choose to have when you say "my thoughts". Does that mean the rest of us on here are responsible for the intrusions we have too?

 

7 hours ago, Cora said:

All my thoughts, all of them, are dirty. They are about sex, harm, violence, incest and everything that is wrong with this world. Everything around me causes my body either a real arousal and an urge to masturbate or have sex or urges to abuse and murder someone in the sickest ways possible.

You cannot tell real arousal apart from groinal response. It's not possible and if you are trying then that's maybe what's keeping you stuck. Arousal is a bodily function. Doesn't have to mean it happens when you want it to, you don't even have to like it but it's a thing it does and that's as simple as it gets.

 

And then it's all just urges, urges urges. Going back to what I said before. Sit with the uncomfortable feeling of urges and just notice how it feels and don't do the compulsions and see what happens over time.

 

7 hours ago, Cora said:

I have to force myself to hate these feelings or to at least question them. Sometimes I even smile when I get these feelings and feel a sense of calm and happiness. And sometimes I even feel like I would really have to act on them and the urges they cause because that’s the only way to be fulfilled and happy. My intentions and behaviour around people is no better. I'm an unpleasant, freaky person when I'm around people. And I most definitely end up making people uncomfortable. I can feel how more and more colleagues at work dislike and even hate me, and that's for good reason. 

Ah there's the compulsion you are still doing. You don't have to fight against it by hating it or questioning it. That's how you are stuck now. Good news is that's easily fixable. Let OCD win by losing. Don't fight the thoughts, images and sensations. By fighting you are just prolonging OCD and making it worse.

 

7 hours ago, Cora said:

I can’t live like this anymore. You may think that I’m exaggerating but every day for me is hell on earth. I haven’t had a normal day in years and nothing helps anymore. When I feel like I’ve dealt with one issue, another one comes along. And when there are no present issues to worry about, the past ones, especially the dark secrets that no one knows about, come to the surface, and I’m back in the hell cycle. There is no break for me, not even when I’m asleep.

No you can live, you just need to undo the compulsions and recognise the ones you are doing. As for the exaggeration comment, you are posting on a forum where there 10s of thousands of us with OCD and you really think that we would think you are exaggerating? I think most of us on here know how bad it was for us at one point in our journeys with OCD.

 

I think the main problem here is you are still focusing on the thoughts, past events, feelings or sensations to be the thing you need to rid yourself of but they don't mean anything @Cora.

 

7 hours ago, Cora said:

My worry is how to fix this. Do I hide from the world? Do I end my life? The first option is great but my urges are so overwhelming that I’ll probably end snapping sooner or later. I’ve thought about the second option several times and it seems like the most reasonable one. I’m not as scared of it anymore but I do feel a little sad to know that I could miss on a lot of lovely things. But, at the same time, what’s the point of having and experiencing those lovely things when I am who I am?

I get that you are upset and distraught over how you are coping at the moment but if you are even remotely considering suicide, then please go to your nearest hospital or phone the Samaritans. We aren't able to handle that and really are only able to talk about OCD as we are not remotely equipped or have any training to deal with it as we aren't medical professionals (well most of us aren't).

 

How about this. How about being able to do the things you value despite having a groinal response or despite having an intrusive urge that you will look at someone's genitals? You can do that. It's possible.

 

OCD likes to make you feel like you are the special case, that others may have OCD but you... You just can't have because despite it being the exact same thing as so many other people, it's not according to OCD. Thing is, you don't have to listen to it. Every time you feel isolated you can think about just how many people in the world there are with OCD and with unoriginal it is, that there is someone else out there that has probably experienced the content you have experienced.

[Cora]

Hi @DRS1,

Thank you very much for taking the time to read and write this wonderful reply - I appreciate it very much. 

26 minutes ago, DRS1 said:

So let's start here. Simple question for you. If someone else has OCD and has all these worries and urged, does that make them a pervert or a weirdo? Or can that only apply to just you? Have a think about that and come back with an answer as it would be interesting to see how you view things.

No, I definitely don't think that if someone else has OCD and the same or similar worries is a pervert or a weirdo. I think this only applies to me because some of these urges have actually materialised. I did unfortunately look at someone's private parts, click on things while thinking I shouldn't, allow myself to make fantasies out of intrusive thoughts, and so, so, so many other things. I think this is what makes me different (and not in a good way at all) than everyone else with OCD. I end up acting on thoughts and urges, (and they are most definitely not checking compulsions) and that's not how OCD works. Sometimes I act on them because it feels like a desire but sometimes it just happens, with no explanation behind it. People always say that no matter how bad a thought or an urge is, someone who has OCD will never act on it and will be able to stop themselves even when it feels like that's impossible. And this is where my problem comes. I have acted on certain thoughts and urges, and, once again, not because they were checking compulsions which is a completely different thing, and I also struggle very much with being able to stop myself. I have not severely harmed anyone but that's not an excuse. 

48 minutes ago, DRS1 said:

Does that mean the rest of us on here are responsible for the intrusions we have too?

No, absolutely not. But I am responsible for them when my "good" side tells me to not make a fantasy out of disturbing, monstrous thought but I choose to ignore it. I have created fantasies in my head when I knew it was wrong but I did it because of the sick, weird excitement I had in my body, and all the times I did it, it was really hard to control it. It felt like I was suppressing the monster side of me. 

42 minutes ago, DRS1 said:

get that you are upset and distraught over how you are coping at the moment but if you are even remotely considering suicide, then please go to your nearest hospital or phone the Samaritans. We aren't able to handle that and really are only able to talk about OCD as we are not remotely equipped or have any training to deal with it as we aren't medical professionals (well most of us aren't).

I do understand that. I don't think I am suicidal but I do occasionally like thinking about it because it is liberating and sometimes it feels like the only option. But I will definitely contact the Samaritans or go to the nearest hospital if I ever feel like I can't cope anymore. 

I feel dirty for saying all these things. And I also feel like I don't deserve any help because for the past few days I've had memories of past events that no one knows about, not even my therapist, and I feel like if I shared those things with the world (that will never happen though because I could never put it into words - it's that disgusting ang wrong), people will simply stop talking to me and see me for what I am, a freak. 

I'm sorry, I know I'm not helping and being very difficult. But I do feel like way too much is happening inside my brain and body. 

[DRS1]

25 minutes ago, Cora said:

Hi @DRS1,

Thank you very much for taking the time to read and write this wonderful reply - I appreciate it very much. 

No, I definitely don't think that if someone else has OCD and the same or similar worries is a pervert or a weirdo. I think this only applies to me because some of these urges have actually materialised. I did unfortunately look at someone's private parts, click on things while thinking I shouldn't, allow myself to make fantasies out of intrusive thoughts, and so, so, so many other things. I think this is what makes me different (and not in a good way at all) than everyone else with OCD. I end up acting on thoughts and urges, (and they are most definitely not checking compulsions) and that's not how OCD works. Sometimes I act on them because it feels like a desire but sometimes it just happens, with no explanation behind it. People always say that no matter how bad a thought or an urge is, someone who has OCD will never act on it and will be able to stop themselves even when it feels like that's impossible. And this is where my problem comes. I have acted on certain thoughts and urges, and, once again, not because they were checking compulsions which is a completely different thing, and I also struggle very much with being able to stop myself. I have not severely harmed anyone but that's not an excuse. 

No, absolutely not. But I am responsible for them when my "good" side tells me to not make a fantasy out of disturbing, monstrous thought but I choose to ignore it. I have created fantasies in my head when I knew it was wrong but I did it because of the sick, weird excitement I had in my body, and all the times I did it, it was really hard to control it. It felt like I was suppressing the monster side of me. 

I do understand that. I don't think I am suicidal but I do occasionally like thinking about it because it is liberating and sometimes it feels like the only option. But I will definitely contact the Samaritans or go to the nearest hospital if I ever feel like I can't cope anymore. 

I feel dirty for saying all these things. And I also feel like I don't deserve any help because for the past few days I've had memories of past events that no one knows about, not even my therapist, and I feel like if I shared those things with the world (that will never happen though because I could never put it into words - it's that disgusting ang wrong), people will simply stop talking to me and see me for what I am, a freak. 

I'm sorry, I know I'm not helping and being very difficult. But I do feel like way too much is happening inside my brain and body. 

Do you see the OCD logic in your post. You don't think others should be judged in the way you are judging yourself and yet OCD is telling you maybe you did do all these things, maybe you are a bad person. We've been over a lot of this stuff on the forum before Cora.

 

Everything can be explicit in OCD. Doesn't matter if it's sexual, violence etc. OCD doesn't hold back so we shouldn't be playing by it's rules that it's dirty or wrong when that's what we are experiencing.

 

There is no good side or bad side, only you and your values. As for acting on it. The whole premise with the staring for example is an intrusive thought of "don't look at their private parts" and by trying so hard not to it becomes debilitating. Even if you see the slightest outline, then you'll feel triggered by it but the solution rather ironically is to look, acknowledge it "yep, that is there genitals or breasts, thanks brain" and treat it as nothing more than that. It really is that insignificant.

 

I say that as someone that very much struggled with that in OCD. Jonathan Grayson has done a lot of work with people who deal with that issue in particular.

 

As for not disclosing to your therapist. Your therapist needs to know everything in order to be able to help you. If they don't, then you may only get so far and perhaps is why you are finding therapy unsuccessful.

Even your distorted thinking that you have made fantasies of "intrusive thoughts", do you realise that it's OCD talk? Have a think about it.

[Cora]

Thank you, @DRS1. 

1 hour ago, DRS1 said:

As for acting on it. The whole premise with the staring for example is an intrusive thought of "don't look at their private parts" and by trying so hard not to it becomes debilitating. Even if you see the slightest outline, then you'll feel triggered by it

I have thought about this as well and have tried to use it as an explanation to make myself feel less of a weirdo. But I don't think it's as simple as that. For example, last night I was at work and walked behind my manager whose underwear could be seen (he was working stock and was in a bend over position). I went to speak to him about an issue I was having and all I could think was his underwear. I then started to feel some sort of sexual excitement and really wanted to look at his private parts. Notice how I said really wanted. That didn't feel like an OCD urge but like a desire. And the worst part is that even though I didn't look, I slightly moved my body towards his body as well lowered my vision - I don't know if it makes sense but I'm trying to say that instead of looking at his face/making eye contact, my eyes focused on his chest before I stopped so it wouldn't go to his private parts.

1 hour ago, DRS1 said:

Even your distorted thinking that you have made fantasies of "intrusive thoughts", do you realise that it's OCD talk? Have a think about it.

But I have thought about it. They do feel like fantasies because sometimes there are real feelings of enjoyment. I would talk more about this subject but I'm way too embarrassed and disgusted with myself at the moment.

I'm sorry, I feel incredibly guilty to say all of this. I'm not sure what people are thinking of me when they read this...

[malina]

@Cora don’t you dare think about giving up! I think the advice that @DRS1 has given you is really helpful. I also repeat that if you really are having thoughts of suicide that you have to reach out to someone, your therapist,GP or Samaritans, who is equipped to help you.

I just wanted to flag one thing. You say you’re different because you have acted out on your urges. Trust me when I say, that we all have, what to us seem like valid reasons, to believe that our worst fears are true. I think that you are doing harmless and trivial behaviours that relate to your fears and then label them as acting on these thoughts. I’ve done this too. I have always had these urges to self harm, I never did it but I did things like keep my hand on a sharp object for a bit too long, not move instantly when my hair was near the fire on the stove, clean my knife with a cloth so it could touch my skin. I had thoughts like “I want my hair to burn” or whatever. I, too, felt like these behaviours meant that I was acting out in the thoughts. Then I just let myself do these behaviours, without worrying about it afterwards, and they stopped happening. 
 

Looking at someone’s privates isnt acting out on your thoughts. Clicking a link you shouldn’t, isn’t acting out on your thoughts. These behaviours are safe, nobody is harmed by them and you know it, so you’re just acting out these safe scenarios because you’re obsessed with the idea of being a pervert. You act in ways that reinforce the idea of you being a pervert to harm yourself. Then you panic and believe that you are a pervert. Cora, by inappropriately looking at people or whatever, you are not hurting them, you are feeding a hungry obsession that needs more material to obsess over. That is very different from acting out on the thoughts. Do you understand what I am trying to say here?

i know you’re going to come back and give me reasons about how I’m wrong. Like it’s morally wrong to stare at someone or you did harm them by making them uncomfortable or whatever. But before you do, I urge you to try and stop making up reasons to validate this and just try to really listen for a change. 
 

also, why do you think that everybody is trying so hard to convince you that you have OCD if you don’t? Are we all Bad people who are lying to you? For what reason? Or are we all so naive that nobody can see the difference between OCD and a pervert? Even professionals can’t see it? Even those of us who are older and more experienced?

For what it’s worth, I think your a wonderful person Cora. You’re kind, you are so scared of hurting others that you’re destroying yourself. Please try to see your worth because you have so much of it. But I also believe that you have strength inside you and that you will find a way. It’s hell now and it may be for a while to come, but you’ve got it in you to survive.

I also wish I could tell you that this will all go away, but I’ve recently come to accept that, for some of us, OCD may be around for a while. I’ve been struggling and I’m going to start therapy again on Friday! I was diagnosed 15 years ago and I still struggle. Yet in these 15 years, so many wonderful things have happened too! So maybe you need to accept that life will have some pain, but that it’s just the way things to, and try to enjoy all the good that life also brings.

[Cora]

Hi @malina, 

Thank you so, so much for your helpful reply and kind words. And also thank you for sharing your experience with me. 

I'm really sorry that you're struggling as well but I hope therapy can help you get back on track. I believe in you. 

10 hours ago, malina said:

also, why do you think that everybody is trying so hard to convince you that you have OCD if you don’t? Are we all Bad people who are lying to you? For what reason? Or are we all so naive that nobody can see the difference between OCD and a pervert? Even professionals can’t see it? Even those of us who are older and more experienced?

No, of course you are not bad people or naive. I just think I never fully explain my feelings and thoughts. I feel like there is a huge difference between how all these urges, feelings and thoughts happen in my mind and body and how I describe them to people. 

10 hours ago, malina said:

Yet in these 15 years, so many wonderful things have happened too! So maybe you need to accept that life will have some pain, but that it’s just the way things to, and try to enjoy all the good that life also brings.

I have definitely been trying my best to enjoy the good things that happen in my life, but it doesn't help anymore. I'm sorry to be pessimistic but because everything, every breath, movement and interaction with other people I have is affected by my OCD (or whatever else my brain thinks it is), I have nothing left other than sadness, anger and frustration. Maybe if just one aspect of my life wasn't (this badly) impacted, things would be a lot easier to deal with. It's mostly my fault though. At the moment all I have is a very mundane life and I don't seem to care enough to add a little excitement to it. 

[malina]

6 hours ago, Cora said:

Hi @malina, 

Thank you so, so much for your helpful reply and kind words. And also thank you for sharing your experience with me. 

I'm really sorry that you're struggling as well but I hope therapy can help you get back on track. I believe in you.

Thanks, Cora. That is really kind of you to say! I think I'll be fine, this therapist helped me a lot in the past and I have faith that he can help again.

6 hours ago, Cora said:

No, of course you are not bad people or naive. I just think I never fully explain my feelings and thoughts. I feel like there is a huge difference between how all these urges, feelings and thoughts happen in my mind and body and how I describe them to people.

Ok I am really, truly sorry for what I'm about to say because it's going to sound insulting and I really don't want to insult you, it's just that I want to show you a different perspective on all this, ok? I have been speaking with you for years now and read many of your posts and your confessions. I swear, most of the stuff you have confessed to, I find really absurd and young and naive. Honestly, if it wasn't causing you so much pain, I would find it funny. Then when you go into more detail and think you have to explain how bad it is, it just makes the thing even more ridiculous. I am so so sorry, I don't want to call you absurd, what I'm trying to show you is how harmless every single thing has been. There has never been a time where I read your post and thought "this is so bad", most of the time I'm like "wow girl this is so silly, get over it". I know that to you it seems awful, because you're the one experiencing it. Trust me, even if you could fully explain everything, it would still be absurd, I have absolutely zero doubt about it.

But I understand, because I had the exact same conversation myself with my father. He was asking me why I keep talking about my fear, why I keep giving more details. I said the same as you, I just think that if everyone could just understand all of the details, they might see the situation as I do. He just told me that would never happen, because the situation is totally illogical, no amont of detail could convince someone else it was true. Same goes for you, in your mind, these little things make you feel like an awful monster, but to an outsider it's all completely absurd and really sad that you are suffering so much over such trivial things.

6 hours ago, Cora said:

It's mostly my fault though. At the moment all I have is a very mundane life and I don't seem to care enough to add a little excitement to it. 

Now this is something you have to stop. You constantly put yourself down. You have been suffering with a debilitating mental illness for years and it's somehow your fault that life isn't exciting right now?! You need to stop blaming yourself for everything! Seriously, just try to give yourself a little break from criticism, blame and anger all the time, you'll see how much easier it is to enjoy life without constantly berating yourself.

You're suffering a lot and it's okay to be negative. Sometimes it does feel like things will never get better. But I think I see some improvement in how you're handling things so I do think you have learned a lot. I think your problem is that you just persistently hold on to the idea that you've done terrible things. You won't allow yourself to take a leap of faith and treat them as OCD, that is your biggest barrier. I think this is tied in with your self esteem and how you blame yourself for everything. It's also tied to your moral rigidity, because I do think that you're the kind of person who thinks that doing something bad, like a minor bad thing, makes you a bad person...and I think you need to learn to change that and understand that minor transgressions are a normal part of life.

So come on, you can feel bad, but no giving up.

[Cora]

Hi @malina, 

Thank you so much for your wonderful reply. You are very kind. I promise I will give a proper reply a bit later. 

[Cora]

I'm currently at work and something awful happened. My colleague (who is 16) was standing on a small stool while we were talking. I really, really didn't mean to but my eyes went to his private part for a split second, and he noticed that but didn't say anything. I actually didn't mean to do that and don't know why it happened. I didn't have an urge or an impulse to look there but it happened. 

I'm really scared he is going to be affected by this, and that he'll think I'm a pervert or much, much worse. And then he'll tell people. 

This is the second incident that happens with him and I'm really anxious at the moment. I'm supposed to be working but the idea that he'll be traumatised and know me as a pervert makes it nearly impossible to focus on my job.  

I'm not sure what to do now. But I promise I didn't mean for that to happen. 

Edited January 24, 2023 by Cora

[Cora]

I'm not sure how to calm myself down because he saw me doing that. 

[DRS1]

26 minutes ago, Cora said:

I'm currently at work and something awful happened. My colleague (who is 16) was standing on a small stool while we were talking. I really, really didn't mean to but my eyes went to his private part for a split second, and he noticed that but didn't say anything. I actually didn't mean to do that and don't know why it happened. I didn't have an urge or an impulse to look there but it happened. 

I'm really scared he is going to be affected by this, and that he'll think I'm a pervert or much, much worse. And then he'll tell people. 

This is the second incident that happens with him and I'm really anxious at the moment. I'm supposed to be working but the idea that he'll be traumatised and know me as a pervert makes it nearly impossible to focus on my job.  

I'm not sure what to do now. But I promise I didn't mean for that to happen. 

Same stuff Cora. It's no different. Refer back to your previous thread.

[Cora]

Thank you for replying, @DRS1. 

I just want to say that I didn't want or plan for this to happen. I really have the urge to rectify this and apologise to him but it will make it more awkward and weird. 

I feel very stupid and angry with myself at the moment for always putting myself in this type of situations. 

I'm not sure what else to say. 

[DRS1]

33 minutes ago, Cora said:

Thank you for replying, @DRS1. 

I just want to say that I didn't want or plan for this to happen. I really have the urge to rectify this and apologise to him but it will make it more awkward and weird. 

I feel very stupid and angry with myself at the moment for always putting myself in this type of situations. 

I'm not sure what else to say. 

Stop. Cora stop. You know what you are doing is a compulsion. You know this is how OCD works. It's not the situation that's the problem here. It's how you are reacting. Intentionally bring up the image in your mind about looking and don't do anything about it. 

 

Can you not see how distorted the thinking is here? Oh no by potentially staring at the outline of someone's genitals, that will somehow have damaged them. What would a person without OCD do in that situation. OCD and intrusive thoughts are weird of course but you need to be able to see where that just doesn't make any sense. 

 

We've explained this in the previous thread. You know the problem is only how you react to it and you continue to buy into OCDs game because of the anxiety and uncertainty as well as the unfair guilt and shame that is not appropriate.

 

I don't intend to come across as mean but you have to look at the great advice that people on this forum have given you over the years and start to be able to apply it instead of just re engaging any time there is a new trigger.

 

You are merely playing by OCDs "but this time it's different" rule. You don't need to play by it's rules. Be unreasonable to OCD.

Edited January 24, 2023 by DRS1

[snowbear]

1 hour ago, Cora said:

Hi @malina, 

Thank you so much for your wonderful reply. You are very kind. I promise I will give a proper reply a bit later. 

At the same time you posted this you started a new thread about yet another incident which was just more of the same. Did you not take in anything Malina said?

I've merged the two threads so you can review it again all in the one place.

Time to recognise the pattern of thinking and behaviour, Cora. You'll never get any relief from this if you treat replies on the forum as resassurance and then ignore the advice in the same breath.

[malina]

This is one of those situations where, if I didn't know how much pain it was causing you, I would find it hilarious. I'm sorry, I know it's insensitive of me to say so, but I wanted to give you an example of what I meant before.

I don't have the same obsessions/fears around sexuality that you do. So if this kind of thing happened to me, I would probably find it really awkward and funny and I'd text my friends and tell them all about how a teenage coworker caught me looking at his privates. Then we'd all laugh about how cringe this is and I'd stop thinking about it after that. Maybe I have an immature sense of humour, but that is how I would see this situation.

Your OCD is about sexuality, so you see this as some terrible event, that caused harm to this guy and that he's now going to tell everyone about it. Same situation, but we'd interpret it very differently.

On the other hand, your fears are not about self harm like mine are. I bet you can cook and cut vegetables without even giving it a second thought. If a knife accidentally touched your skin or you pricked yourself, you probably wouldn't worry too much. I, on the other hand, would worry about how careless I was, think that I was careless on purpose, think that maybe I wanted to hurt myself after all, that I had acted out on my thoughts etc.

Do you see where I'm going with this?

Edited January 24, 2023 by malina

[Summer9173]

3 minutes ago, malina said:

I don't have the same obsessions/fears around sexuality that you do. So if this kind of thing happened to me, I would probably find it really awkward and funny and I'd text my friends and tell them all about how a teenage coworker caught me looking at his privates. Then we'd all laugh about how cringe this is and I'd stop thinking about it after that. Maybe I have an immature sense of humour, but that is how I would see this situation.

Agreed! It takes a while to get into this pattern of thinking, but talking it over with others to see the humorous side really helps. Of course, OCD isn’t humorous at all, but to not give it power laugh back at it. I love how you described it above of what you would do @malina!! 

[Cora]

@DRS1and @snowbear, I think I acted on an impulse (because I was feeling very anxious) and should have not made another post. I have calmed down since last night and I'm slowly seeing this as something insignificant. 

 

@malina, I owe you an apology. You wrote a wonderful reply and I simply ignored it, and I am very sorry for that. I also want to say that I definitely didn't ignore it because I don't care or appreciate it, that wasn't the reason for sure. 

On 24/01/2023 at 06:40, malina said:

Same goes for you, in your mind, these little things make you feel like an awful monster, but to an outsider it's all completely absurd and really sad that you are suffering so much over such trivial things.

That is so true. They do make me feel like a monster and it's a very awful feeling to have, especially when everyone around you seems normal, kind and non-evil. Whenever I share and confess things to my boyfriend he tells me how absurd they are but I jut can't see that. 

On 24/01/2023 at 06:40, malina said:

I think this is tied in with your self esteem and how you blame yourself for everything. It's also tied to your moral rigidity, because I do think that you're the kind of person who thinks that doing something bad, like a minor bad thing, makes you a bad person...and I think you need to learn to change that and understand that minor transgressions are a normal part of life.

You are absolutely right. I think I also have a problem with keeping a mental list in my head where I add all the bad things that I do and I need to learn how to erase it. 

22 hours ago, malina said:

Your OCD is about sexuality, so you see this as some terrible event, that caused harm to this guy and that he's now going to tell everyone about it. Same situation, but we'd interpret it very differently.

On the other hand, your fears are not about self harm like mine are. I bet you can cook and cut vegetables without even giving it a second thought. If a knife accidentally touched your skin or you pricked yourself, you probably wouldn't worry too much. I, on the other hand, would worry about how careless I was, think that I was careless on purpose, think that maybe I wanted to hurt myself after all, that I had acted out on my thoughts etc.

Do you see where I'm going with this?

Yes, I definitely see where you're going with it. I have to learn how to accept that these incidents don't affect and alter people's lives that much. I have to learn how to accept them if and when they happen, and just move on. It's incredibly hard to do that though. I had another thing happen today and even though I see the ridiculous side of it, my brain still screams at me that I've hurt/traumatised that person. This is an awful challenge and I really hope it'll end one day. 

 

[DRS1]

4 minutes ago, Cora said:

I had another thing happen today and even though I see the ridiculous side of it, my brain still screams at me that I've hurt/traumatised that person.

Recognising it is the most important aspect. It allows you to decide whether or not it is worth even concerning yourself with. For me, it's the "does this make any sense?", and is there urgency to fix the anxiety or uncertainty. Those are the two components. At that point, I'm not interested in how scary it feels for me, I can't rely on feelings when I'm dealing with OCD but what I can rely on is what I learned in therapy.

[malina]

1 hour ago, Cora said:

 

@malina, I owe you an apology. You wrote a wonderful reply and I simply ignored it, and I am very sorry for that. I also want to say that I definitely didn'tignore it because I don't care or appreciate it, that wasn't the reason for sure.

No worries Cora, I know it sometimes takes time to write a proper response, I didn't think any of those things.

1 hour ago, Cora said:

especially when everyone around you seems normal, kind and non-evil.

But see, this is part of the problem. People aren't really normal and kind. Maybe my view of people is too negative, I do at least agree that most people are non-evil But seriously, I remember thinking this when I was younger, everyone always seemed to have things figured out, they seemed like reasonable and good people. But the more people you get to know, the more you realise that everyone is just as lost as you. That goes for morality as well. People are nice and kind, but at the same time they can be very selfish and cruel. And you really have no clue what kinds of weird things are going on in someone else's mind. .

You seriously need to stop keeping a list of your own mistakes. People make this big thing about how we can learn from our mistakes and become better people. Sometimes, it's okay not to learn. Sometimes it's okay not to be perfect and not to try being perfect either. It's okay to just let go sometimes. Nobody can live with the kind of mental pressure that you're putting on yourself. You need to learn to let yourself make some mistakes so that you can learn to distinguish between the mistakes that are important and the ones that are not. The important ones, you have to fix and learn from. But you don't have the capacity to fix every little mistake. You've got this all confused, you think everything is important. The worst part is that while you're spending so much mental effort on these very trivial, absurd things, you are actually making very big mistakes with regards to your wellbeing and your life.

1 hour ago, Cora said:

 I have to learn how to accept that these incidents don't affect and alter people's lives that much.

No, they don't alter people's lives at all. These things you keep talking about are completely meaningless. The only life they alter is yours.

1 hour ago, Cora said:

I have to learn how to accept them if and when they happen, and just move on. It's incredibly hard to do that though. I had another thing happen today and even though I see the ridiculous side of it, my brain still screams at me that I've hurt/traumatised that person. This is an awful challenge and I really hope it'll end one day. 

 

And that is okay, your brain will keep doing this for a while. But you know that. It's good that you can recognose the ridiculousness of it, even if it still hurts and seems very real. Just keep going, keep working on it and reminding yourself of how trivial this all is.

[Caramoole]

I was watching the programme "Sort Your Life Out" with Stacey Solomen (is that her name) tonight and heard a phrase "Yes, I know that you are doing your best.....but sometimes, your best isn't good enough.  You need to do more" ......and I'm so sorry Cora but I sort of think this advice applies!

If you don't start to take on board the well researched evidence & advice ( despite the doubt you still feel) you shackle yourself to decades of having to endure this anxiety and anguish.

You are waiting to "feel sure, feel right" first, rather than using the advice to move forward, trusting in the advice, despite feeling the doubt and fear.  The way you're trying will never work......isn't working, hasn't worked, won't work!  You've had several rounds of professional therapy and haven't really gone with it.

There isn't an easy way to make this change other than making those changes.......and there is a choice there.  You can choose to make changes or you can choose to stay stuck. It's not a quick change but it's achievable.  You have to make that choice