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This is my 5th breakdown in 11 years!!! I can't keep going through this


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Hi All,

I have never posted to one of these forums but not sure what I am hoping to get out of this but I just feel that I have to send something to people who can understand / offer some advice. Or hopefully it may even help someone!

Sorry but here comes quite a long life story! I was diagnosed with OCD in 2012 when I was completely ridden with fear that something would happen to my girlfriend (now wife). It destroyed me and we ended up pulling out of buying a house at the time. I didn't know what to make of it but the feelings started to disappear and I undertook my first round of CBT (although it was months after the episode).

Then in 2015, I was completely knocked in a bad way. I was on holiday with my wife and I started thinking about going to this strip club on my stag do and how I was not proud of my behaviour that night. It caused me to have this huge confession to my wife (a symptom I now know is a big part of my OCD - the need to confess) - she was clearly upset by the whole thing but being the incredible person she is, she forgave me. The episode evolved rapidly and I have found that as soon as I confess one thing, more and more things start appearing until you stop yourself. I didn't know this at the time and it was causing me to confess absolutely everything - even if I had a thought about a particular feature of hers that I did not think looked great at that time. It really destroyed her and I was devastated that I could have done that to the person I love the most. We had a small child at the time and I couldn't even bring myself to look after him. This was the first time I went on Citalopram (20mg per day). After about 2 - 3 weeks and making sure that I got back into work, I started to feel much better and could start moving forward. Again I completed my CBT and after a while came off the Citalopram feeling much better.

Then came 2018. My anxiety had been building for some time as I became convinced that I had early on-set dementia. Another episode, I had this very vivid dream where my best friend told me that I had done wrong to this girl we knew when I was about 21 (10 years earlier). This completely set me off and I started worrying about all the things I had done wrong sexually. These are things I am not proud of at all but some people would just ignore as part of growing up. There were 3 incidents where I felt that I had been a bit of a d*ck to a girl and 1 in particular that really bothers me. When I was 21, I was in Manchester and I was taking a lot of recreational drugs. I ended up getting with this American girl we knew, and when we went back to a friend's house after the club, we went upstairs. I blocked the door with a dresser as there was no lock on the door and we started 'moving forward.' As we did, she said to me that she was not sure that we should do it and maybe we should wait until next time when we weren't so messed up. At the time, I thought this was a genuine question and just said - no, it will be fine. We carried on and were shortly interrupted by a friend. I was embarrassed so never addressed it with her. She even came to see me at university a month later but we barely spoke. About a month after that, she sent me this long message basically saying - how could you do that, I told you in several ways that I did not want to have sex, I did not want it to just be about sex as I really liked you and now I feel used and disgusting. At the time, I thought this was a massive overreaction and was very insensitive to her feelings. I replied with quite a matter of fact - stop worrying about it, it happened and it's fine. There is a reason I have gone into so much detail here. 

It was at this time, that another memory came into mind that really bothered me. I was a teenager with really low self-esteem due to my weight. Girls were never that into me and while all my friends were getting girlfriends, I was just the fat, funny, nice one. This led me to masturbate quite a lot and because I had this thought that porn was wrong, I used to masturbate over people I knew. This could range from friends to teachers, and very regrettably family members. The latter is a particularly difficult one. I came to think that the only way I could get through this was to confess to my Mum about what I had done. Luckily my wife calmed me down. Back on the citalopram and CBT. After a couple of weeks, I started to feel myself again.

Again I came off the citalopram and then Christmas 2020 hit. I started back on the citalopram again as I was having quite distressing thoughts that I might be a paedophile (I can assure you that is not the case), and then I got COVID. This hit me like a freight train. I was an absolute wreck for about 2 - 3 weeks. I couldn't do a thing and was having the same concerns as last time - in particular the masturbation. This convinced me I was going to hell and I became consumed with fear. My wife, as always, was supportive and despite having COVID - she managed everything from the kids to the house to her husband. She really is incredible.

I made the decision to stay on citalopram now as I undertook a more robust form of CBT and for longer. My thought process was if I stay on the citalopram then I won't have another setback because I really could not handle another one. 

And now to the current day! It has happened again. I can't believe it, I am so distraught. I stayed on the citalopram and it has hit me again. This has been the worst one - it has been 5 weeks of despair now. I am consumed with the same worries as before and the thought of going to hell overrides it all. I tried up CBT again but stopped it as I have had enough of that not working. This week I started BWRT (brain working recursive therapy) - there is definitely something there and after one session, I do feel different but unfortunately not cured. I will stick with it as the research is so compelling. I have been avoiding upping my dose of citalopram to 30mg per day as recommended by the doctors as I just felt that this was not the long-term solution and I wanted to beat this in other ways. But sure enough, I have now decided to up my dosage from tonight as I need this to pass. I am constantly consumed with fears of needing to confess about masturbating, turning myself into police for potential rape and worries of going to hell.

I have always tried to be a good person and treat others well but this is getting too much. I just can't keep going in these 2 to 3 year cycles of breakdowns. I need help because everything I have tried until now is just not working for me - and I just have to hope and pray that I do not go to hell one day! 

Sorry I know that was a lot but when you start you just can't stop!

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I can relate to the compulsive confessing. When I had a breakdown in 2017, which led me to being hospitalized, I was on a confessing "rampage" and also confessed my worst thoughts to my parents. I look back now and am horrified and embarrassed at the things I told them. Something one of the doctors in the hospital told me while I was there, that stuck with me was "confessing is not going to absolve you". And it's true. Whatever I did was done and whatever thoughts I was having would not magically disappear or become undone simply because I was confessing. And all confessing was doing was leading to MORE confessing. I know it's so hard, but until you resist it, it will only get worse. Another thing I was told by this same doctor in the hospital was that I was too ill for CBT at the time, so he told me to just imagine a big red stop sign anytime I had one of my thoughts. Maybe you could envision this same stop sign when you feel yourself compelled to confess something.

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Ah mate I’m rubbish at this but I genuinely could have written your post myself !! But although I can’t give you any helpful advice you  really are not alone ! It’s a ******* of an illness and hopefully one day soon they will find a cure for us ! I can tell by your post how much you struggle but stay strong 

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2 hours ago, Anthony said:

I can relate to the compulsive confessing. When I had a breakdown in 2017, which led me to being hospitalized, I was on a confessing "rampage" and also confessed my worst thoughts to my parents. I look back now and am horrified and embarrassed at the things I told them. Something one of the doctors in the hospital told me while I was there, that stuck with me was "confessing is not going to absolve you". And it's true. Whatever I did was done and whatever thoughts I was having would not magically disappear or become undone simply because I was confessing. And all confessing was doing was leading to MORE confessing. I know it's so hard, but until you resist it, it will only get worse. Another thing I was told by this same doctor in the hospital was that I was too ill for CBT at the time, so he told me to just imagine a big red stop sign anytime I had one of my thoughts. Maybe you could envision this same stop sign when you feel yourself compelled to confess something.

This is great advice Anthony! :) 

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Ah I could have written almost the same ! I can sympathize with every word you wrote. 
I don't have the same ocd theme but I’ve suffered from sensorimotor OCD since a long time.

I then have had periods every so many years of being fixed on it that last about three or four months and then somehow have subsided eventually, usually with the help of sertraline medication, although I’m not sure if I have just managed to shift my obsession onto other things.

I’ve been on and off since I was 30.  Funny thing is that it has completely gone away in the past. Sometimes for months and sometimes for years. I don’t understand why it is so easy to slip back into it again.  

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I am now 51 years old.

 This has been my third breakdown and worst yet.

 Trying to finally properly address my issues with OCD as always wanted to run away before.

 I’m scared, terrified, lonely, sad, emotional and that’s just on a good day!

 

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23 hours ago, StrugglingAgain said:

This week I started BWRT (brain working recursive therapy) - there is definitely something there and after one session, I do feel different but unfortunately not cured. I will stick with it as the research is so compelling.

 

When any new therapy is mentioned I am compelled ( :p ) to check it out.

So I googled it and went to the BRWT Worldwide official website and this is what I found...

 

Quote

In the past, the majority of professional therapists – including Terence himself – would have told you it was essential to discover the underlying causes of symptoms to get well and stay well.  But there is one thing to realise about BWRT®; it turns the whole previous model of psychology on its head!  Instead of trying to find out why a problem got started, BWRT® goes straight to how and resolves the issue ‘at source’.

 

Oh really? What stone has 'Terence' been hiding under that he wasn't aware CBT therapists have been saying the exact same thing for several decades? Calls himself an expert! You'd think he'd have kept up with well-documented developments in his own field of expertise. :dry:

Psychotherapy (looking for causes) doesn't work for OCD. We all know that. Nobody recommends psychotherapy for OCD.

So when a new therapy comes along claiming it's better than something we know doesn't work and that nobody uses, my question is why compare it to a long outdated therapy instead of comparing the 'new therapy' to something that does work and is routinely used. :confused1:  

And then to put up a website that contains zero - ZERO- information on what BWRT actually entails or how it works, just links to find a therapist... :dry:

What's he scared of? That the therapy won't stand up to scrutiny or being compared to CBT?

 

My impression is it's probably a form of CBT, but given a new acronym so the guy who is peddling it can make a name for himself and make a lot of money by selling books about a therapy that's not new at all. :dry:

Anyway, if it is a form of CBT then @StrugglingAgain  you'll be fine. :)

Just wanted to save lots of other forum users the bother and disappointment of racing off to check out some 'new' therapy.

And just so we're clear - CBT isn't about finding the causes either!

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Firstly, @carolinevtn and @JackieAM, I am so sorry to hear about your struggles. It really is so frustrating that we have to go through this. I have to keep reminding myself that it is the OCD and nothing else but sometimes you lose faith in that. Keep strong!

 

@snowbear- thank you for your reply. I completely understand where you are coming from - my issue is I have done CBT so many times before and I find myself back in this situation. BWRT is not CBT and is a very different approach to this. I am not claiming it is successful as clearly it hasn't worked for me yet (although only after one session). I just wanted to give it a go as the research that I did were really compelling. My first session was this week and it was really interesting - think of hypnosis without having to get in a hypnotic state. It 'works' on the premise that our neurones have created unhelpful links in establishing a thought with an anxiety - the therapy aims to change that pathway so that you don't even get to that point of anxiety leading to a confession. After my session, I felt exhausted but it felt positive. It will take more than one session but I am willing to give it a go. If that doesn't work then at least my increased medication will provide some relief, and I will definitely go back to CBT. 

 

Just to say I am not for one minute saying that CBT does not work nor would I ever discourage anyone from using it. Just from my experience, it has not given me the lasting effect I am needing. Nevertheless, I appreciate any reply to this post so genuinely thank you!

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Stick with it mate ! I love the support this group offers ! But cbt is out dated works for some but not for everyone ! I do agree with snow bear that there are chancers out there trying to make a quick buck but if you feel it’s helping then stick with it! Ocd is crying out for some revolutionary new treatments! I know people mean well but cbt has never or never will work for me ! Nothing wrong with trying new treatments but it’s also wise to be cautious as well! Good luck and let us know how it’s going 

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48 minutes ago, bluegas said:

Stick with it mate ! I love the support this group offers ! But cbt is out dated works for some but not for everyone ! I do agree with snow bear that there are chancers out there trying to make a quick buck but if you feel it’s helping then stick with it! Ocd is crying out for some revolutionary new treatments! I know people mean well but cbt has never or never will work for me ! Nothing wrong with trying new treatments but it’s also wise to be cautious as well! Good luck and let us know how it’s going 

I don't know that saying CBT is outdated is necessarily correct. Saying for some people it doesn't work is fair enough but to say its outdated implies that it's not fit for purpose anymore. There are new things being tried out but there's nothing conclusive yet and certainly nothing that would outright change the NICE guidelines on OCD treatment. Won't add anymore to it since I think we've all had quite a discussion on the forum before about whether CBT or ERP are effective or not.

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Thanks for that information, @StrugglingAgain

Why didn't they say as much on their website! I'm always suspicious of people hiding behind secrecy :dry: If it's that good they should be open about it.

We know hypnosis doesn't work because you aren't in a 'conscious' state of mind so aren't processing and learning. Therefore it's interesting that you say that you remain conscious as that suggests BWRT might be able to 'do what it says on the tin'.

Good CBT would include helping you learn how to break these sorts of associations, but sadly we know not everybody gets access to good CBT, which is certainly one possible reason you had limited success with it in the past.

Do keep us posted on your progress. :)

If you feel comfortable doing so, perhaps you'd like to share some more about what goes on in a BWRT session. Since the 'inventor' isn't very forthcoming unless you buy his book it might be the only way we get to hear what the therapy is like!

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1 hour ago, bluegas said:

Stick with it mate ! I love the support this group offers ! But cbt is out dated works for some but not for everyone ! I do agree with snow bear that there are chancers out there trying to make a quick buck but if you feel it’s helping then stick with it! Ocd is crying out for some revolutionary new treatments! I know people mean well but cbt has never or never will work for me ! Nothing wrong with trying new treatments but it’s also wise to be cautious as well! Good luck and let us know how it’s going 

 

25 minutes ago, DRS1 said:

I don't know that saying CBT is outdated is necessarily correct. Saying for some people it doesn't work is fair enough but to say its outdated implies that it's not fit for purpose anymore. There are new things being tried out but there's nothing conclusive yet and certainly nothing that would outright change the NICE guidelines on OCD treatment. Won't add anymore to it since I think we've all had quite a discussion on the forum before about whether CBT or ERP are effective or not.

Both these statements explore the view that there are more ways than just CBT to treat OCD.  For me 30 years ago diversion therapy was a big help for me and recently I had CBT which broadened the help I have.   Who knows what might come along?  My view is that the more tools I have in my OCD toolbox then the better my chances of more sustained recovery.  Take the best of the old, the present and the new!

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Thanks everyone - wish I had you all in my head rather than my own voice 😂

@bluegas, I completely get what you are saying about CBT. I feel the same but am so happy to know it has helped others.

@snowbear, thank you for your encouragement. The session effectively involves you thinking about what is bothering you and really getting into that feeling. The therapist will then rapidly - very rapidly - get you to freeze that image and make you think of a preferred response and a future memory. They do this over and over and it may sound strange but you can feel your brain reacting to it. It definitely reduced my anxiety on a particular thought but still too early to say after one session. They claim for OCD you need a level 2 therapist and it can take longer - some claim that one or two sessions help with simple phobias. OCD could obviously take longer. If it works, I’ll be shouting it from the rooftops.

NHS has done a study on it with really positive results. But CBT remains the recommended treatment for OCD.

I will keep everyone posted.

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31 minutes ago, StrugglingAgain said:

The session effectively involves you thinking about what is bothering you and really getting into that feeling. The therapist will then rapidly - very rapidly - get you to freeze that image and make you think of a preferred response and a future memory.

So it is a form of CBT :yes:

I think too many therapists do a very narrow-minded version of CBT which gives it a bad name and makes those who need a broader approach think 'CBT doesn't work for me' when all they needed was a different angle of approach under the huge therapy umbrella that CBT actually is.

I don't care what they call it, as long as it's following sound principles that have been tried and tested and proven to work.

Keep going! :)

 

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1 hour ago, northpaul said:

 

Both these statements explore the view that there are more ways than just CBT to treat OCD.  For me 30 years ago diversion therapy was a big help for me and recently I had CBT which broadened the help I have.   Who knows what might come along?  My view is that the more tools I have in my OCD toolbox then the better my chances of more sustained recovery.  Take the best of the old, the present and the new!

Again I’m so pleased for the people that cbt has helped just like I’m glad for the people who swear by exposure therapy! I  spent a fair bit of time working with the infamous rob bray and I spoke to people who claim even he’s helped them!  But there are some of us and if I’m honest quite a few of us who are treatment resistant to all these treatments and  we are all hoping new treatments ideas are on the horizon! I know that a few universities are doing psychedelic research for ocd ! So I for one like hearing about new treatments ideas ect !!  This damm illness has stolen years of my life !! And I’ve put my heart and soul in to every thing I’ve tried! And spent a lot of money doing it since the age of 20 I’ve seen various cbt specialists and it categorically doesn’t work for me !  Just like I know it doesn’t for everyone but dose for some !  I  just want everybody to be free of the vile disorder no matter how they achieve it

 

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1 hour ago, bluegas said:

But there are some of us and if I’m honest quite a few of us who are treatment resistant to all these treatments and  we are all hoping new treatments ideas are on the horizon!

How many times have you done CBT?

Edited by felix4
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3 hours ago, bluegas said:

Again I’m so pleased for the people that cbt has helped just like I’m glad for the people who swear by exposure therapy! I  spent a fair bit of time working with the infamous rob bray and I spoke to people who claim even he’s helped them!  But there are some of us and if I’m honest quite a few of us who are treatment resistant to all these treatments and  we are all hoping new treatments ideas are on the horizon! I know that a few universities are doing psychedelic research for ocd ! So I for one like hearing about new treatments ideas ect !!  This damm illness has stolen years of my life !! And I’ve put my heart and soul in to every thing I’ve tried! And spent a lot of money doing it since the age of 20 I’ve seen various cbt specialists and it categorically doesn’t work for me !  Just like I know it doesn’t for everyone but dose for some !  I  just want everybody to be free of the vile disorder no matter how they achieve it

 

I worked with Robert Bray too, a total scam that cost me a fortune. I tried cbt with honest therapists, I tried a lot and i’m really so tired of it. It doesn’t work with me. I really don’t know what to do now.

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6 hours ago, carolinevtn said:

I worked with Robert Bray too, a total scam that cost me a fortune. I tried cbt with honest therapists, I tried a lot and i’m really so tired of it. It doesn’t work with me. I really don’t know what to do now.

Mate sorry to hear that! try to keep going ! Yes rob bray is a horrible man ! Actually think he made me worse ! As much as I think ocd treatment is still very much in the dark ages for a lot of us I do think theses forums are great just so we know we are not alone! I just think the cbt brigade need to accept it works for some but not all and maybe realise they make us feel even worse when they say it’s the only way ! Just makes me feel even more worthless when I know how much effort and work I’ve put into it !!  But keep going you are not alone 

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Just wanted to give everyone an update as am so thankful for the engagement from you all. I have upped my medication and thankfully with little side effects so far - usually I really struggle when I go onto them at the start. I know it will take a little time to kick in properly but sometimes hard to remember that.

My days are playing out basically the same - I panic about having to turn myself in and go to jail one day and what that would do to the family. Then I get out of that and think a little about hell (although that is subsiding a bit). Then I feel extremely anxious about the thought of getting through this only to return to this again at some point. Then I get anxious about this not shifting. Then back to jail. Then I reach a point by the evening where I realise this is all the OCD and can relax and feel a bit more like myself. Sleep, repeat.

Cannot wait for this to end!

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I'm so glad I found this forum as I am new to actually dealing with OCD - I have "managed" it for years in some ways and been OK. However, I am having a right flare up and all my usual tool kit seems to have stopped working. 

I say I am glad I found this forum because I just booked in with a Clinical Psychologist, who immediately started saying they would use some CBT but focus on other things like ACT. I want to give CBT a go as I hear it is really helpful. I had a good with it about 3 years ago and it seemed to help out, especially with a lot of exercise. Therefore, I was slightly annoyed that I'm paying £95 for something I wasn't really happy to do. However, I cancelled this morning, thinking I just don't feel right about this. And after reading this forum it has really helped me to realise I have done the right thing

:)

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I identify so much with your daily experience StrugglingAgain. I foolishly listened to a new GP who encouraged me to reduce my clomipramine dosage and eventually stopped altogether a few months ago. Big mistake! Around Christmas time the obsessing started up again, moving from one theme to another over the weeks since. I started on the medication again two weeks ago which has helped reduce the anxiety a bit but am still struggling badly. 

My days seem to go much like yours. The obsession is there waiting for me in the morning, I dread waking up and when I do I feel I can't face another day of it. The thing that helps reduce the distress is when I perform some relaxation exercise which usually calms me down and most days by evening I am more relaxed and feeling that the worst might be over. However then it all begins again next morning.

Like you hell is something I fear having been raised in a biblical fundamentalist environment. I thought I had overcome that until this latest round of obsessing. 

I'm 65 now and had been taking clomipramine since I was 41, I so wish I hadn't listened to that doctor. Now I'm hoping it's not much longer until it kicks in, it seems to be taking longer than before but that might be my bad memory. As usual my latest obsession, which I won't go into, seems like the worst ever and insurmountable and my own fault. I'm just clinging to the fact that I've felt like this before and it has eventually passed. All the best StrugglingAgain, I hope you find relief soon.

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