snowbear

Hi whatever-welsh. Welcome to the forum First off... Been where you are and I can picture only too well the dificulties you're going through. Yup. I hear you. Letting an electrician/ cleaner into your flat is a 'violation' and it's every bit as traumatic mentally as a physical assault. Are you aware of the term 'mental contamination'? It's where the contamination relates to betrayal, broken trust or a violation by one or more people. I know it seems daft that we can (thankfully) clean off a degree of violation with standard cleaning products. But the powerlessness of not being allowed to refuse access fuels the strength of the contamination feelings, which is when things become 'uncleanable' no matter how much bleach or scrubbing you apply. I know that killing yourself feels like a solution, but trust me it's not. It's letting them win. If you resent being made powerless as much as I do knowing that should give you the strength to get through this by finding a real solution. One that deals with what has to be done and allows you to recover and keep going. Keep that in mind as we go forward. If suggestions get made that you can't see happening, try to stay focused on dealing with the practicalities without jumping back to thinking you'll 'have' to kill yourself . Think you can do that for us? So, what can we do to help? In a situation like this it is helpful to temporarily set aside your feelings about what's happening and think first about the practical issues that need to be faced. Can someone stop them? Well, a temporary stay of execution may be possible, but the short answer is no. The landlord is legally obliged to have the electrical tests done - he's not doing it just to be awkward. He's also within his rights to insist on the deep clean, or he could give you notice of eviction (on the grounds of antisocial behaviour/ damage to the property.) Can you make them let you move? You can request that they give you a reasonable amount of time to find somewhere else to live before they access the property, but we're talking probably 3 months maximum. The landlord isn't obliged to find you this alternative accommodation (unless your landlord is the council) -that's your job. (I'm assuming you rent privately?) If finances are too tight to move unaided, have you checked whether you're claiming all the benefits you're entitled to? Have you spoken to Citizens Advice and Social Services about getting assessed for help with housing on the grounds of your mental health needs? So, practical solution options: 1. Ask the lanlord to put the checks / deep clean on hold while you find somewhere else to move to within a reasonable time frame. 2. Agree to the clean up and checks and then negotiate directly with the cleaner and electrician that they don't touch anything inside your designated Safe space. Consider practical solutions such as covering your bed and possessions with plastic decorators sheets, or even an ordinary sheet. You might need to unplug everything and tuck the plugs and wires away under the protective cover, but at least then you only need to clean the sockets afterwards where the plugs will go and not 'everything'. 3. Speak to your GP and ask about the possibility of voluntary hospital admission to kick-start getting you out of this situation and to begin therapy and/or medication to help with how your OCD is making you feel. 4. Take the leap of faith, bite the bullet and turn this 'crisis' into an opportunity to start fighting back against your OCD. This would involve CBT therapy; - accepting that the contamination is misinterpreting a feeling - a willingness to change your thinking - readiness to accept the real world works differently to how you've been thinking it does and change your behaviour so it's more in line with reality. Note: I'm not saying your feelings aren't real. What you're feeling is very real, and very horrible. Thankfully therapy doesn't ask or expect you to change your feelings, only how you react to them. Do any of those suggestions seem (even vaguely) possible? Remember, the best way to deal with any crisis is to get practical. Break it up into what has to be done like it or not, where you have options and some control over how things are done, and then make a step by step plan to deal with the situation.

The problem with the Bontamination idea in this context is that you're assuming the problem is 'direct contamination' and the fear is only 'getting ill'. However, the problem @Blueskies is describing is called .mental contamination' (feelings of contamination without the presence of a contaminant and ttacking of the feeling from one surface to another without direct contact.) Plus the emotion Blueskies is experiencing seems to be disgust rather than fear - the fear comes from not wanting the disgusting thing to spread around her house. Suggesting that 'no harm will come from dog poo' misses the fact the dog poo represents something, it's not in itself the problem here. Have you spoken to a therapist, Blueskies, about what underpins the contamination feelings? Has anybody explained to you how the presence of a contaminant a long time ago is still lingering because you've misinterpreted a feeling rathar than because there is any actual dirt remaining?

It's not the thought that's the problem. It's your reaction to it. For each person with OCD the thing that matters to them most always lies at the heart of the problem. And they always 'justify' their OCD with an explanation that revolves around their theme. So for you... 'It's not just a thought, it matters because it's religious' or 'It's not forgivable because it's religious'. And for those with a harm theme... 'It's not an unnecessary worry, my family's safety is at stake' Or a contamination theme... 'It's not overkill, some substances really are toxic and dangerous and precautions need to be taken.' And so on. Does the person with a religious theme worry about asbestos? No more than the average 'normal' person. Because it's not what matters most to you. But when it comes to your personal theme, each and every one of us struggles to stay rational or to see it objectively. Your 'but it's religious therefore...' explanations are (although you can't see it) nothing to do with being true to your religion and everything to do with the distorted thinking and irrationality of OCD. How can I be so sure? Well, for starters that's how OCD works! No matter what the theme it's only a problem because of the reasoning you apply inside your own head. Even when other religious people have advised you that God wouldn't judge you on the basis of having a bad thought (even a blasphemous one you 'agreed with') you've been unable (or unwilling) to accept that is true. Instead you fall back on your own reasoning... 'but it's the unforgiveable sin.' Once again sticking with your current interpretation of what having the thought means rather than being open to any other interpretation or alternative way of looking at it. It's such an important point you have to get your head around that I'll say it again: This has nothing to do with religion. This is all about your OCD-biased interpretation of what it means to have a blasphemous thought. You have a thinking disorder. You're not facing a religious dilemma. Fixing your thinking won't make you any less of a good person, even in the eyes of God.

Prof Veale is definitely a true OCD psychiatrist, one of the most experienced in the UK. But I don't think he'd be willing to treat anybody via an international video call. His UK medical licesnse wouldn't permit it for starters. If you're from the UK and just living abroad at present you could ask if he'd take you on as a private patient until you return to the UK, but even then it's unlikely. You'll probably need to keep looking in whichever country you're based.

In short, you learn to say 'So what? It's in the past, let it go.' Doesn't matter if the memory is true or false. Doesn't matter if you agreed to a thought or not. Draw a line under it and let it go. This requires acceptance that you could have done something immoral or wrong in the past - very important to recognise it's not asking you to accept that you did do something wrong. Just to accept the possibility without having certainty either way. If that's a struggle because you can't accept or wouldn't be able to forgive yourself if you have done anything wrong, then you need to work on your thinking around what it means to accept and to forgive. And review how impossible and unnecessary the standards you've set for yourself are: 'Lifelong absolute perfection with never so much as one bad thought' (All or nothing/ black and white thinking distortions.)

Hi Johanna and Just so you know, you can add replies to this original thread without having to start a new topic each time. Keeps everything in the one place so it's easier for you to find replies. I have a personal assistant who helps with my shopping and taking out the rubbish. We mainly negotiated how we planned to work together over the job interview and the first meeting. She's been with me 4 and a half years now and we're still evolving and learning as we go along. I think the most important skills for any PA/ personal organiser/ care assistant to have are patience, to listen, to stay calm themselves even if their client gets upset, and a willingness to work with the individual. There's no rules or right or wrong. Your client will be your best guide.

I believe Professor David Veale was involved in the research too. He gave a talk on it at one of our OCD-UK conferences. The recording is here

Two important things you need to know about psychodelics and OCD... 1. Street drug psychodelics can cause psychosis and people with OCD are more vulnerable to developing this than people taking them who haven't got mental health issues. Not saying it happens to everybody with OCD, but why risk permanent brain 'damage' ? 2. You may have heard of psychodelics being trialed in OCD as a form of treatment. There is evidence that they work when given in clinical doses, under supervision and with CBT done by a trained therapist during the 'trip'. The idea is that the drug makes the brain more plastic for a short time, or to put that another way more open to suggestion. By guiding the person stepwise through CBT while they are under the influence the therapist aims to change unhelpful beliefs and thinking. Just taking the drug and hoping it will change your brain for the better is n't going to work.

Like you, Emma, I've had OCD my whole life. It's certainly coloured and shaped my world, and maybe my brain has - to an extent - become neurodivergently wired as a result of my OCD thinking. So to say your OCD is part of you is correct (imo.) However, it's important not to allow OCD to define you. You are a person with likes and dislikes, hobbies, passions, friends, purpose and more. The OCD is just along for the ride. Some people are so severely affected by their OCD that they begin to view OCD as part of their identity. That's not a healthy approach. So I suggest you 'own it' but don't define yourself by it. Being in that mindset is a healthy way to move forward, even if OCD is still part of your life. An 'I need help in these particular areas, but it doesn't make me a less competent person' mindset might also help you feel more confident about asking for reasonable adjustments at work. You'd ask them for wheelchair access or a sign language interpreter without worrying what they'd think, right? So go into it seeing your OCD as 'something that should be accommodated as required' rather than what defines you or your ability as an employee.

From the sound of things you may not be ready to challenge your OCD yet, but for when you are a good tip is to change the words 'had to' to 'chose to' . Challenge the belief that things are contaminated at every opportunity. Challenge the self-talk of 'I had to...' by reminding yourself that it is a choice based on what you think, not a fact based on reality. If I had a pound for every time I put my life on hold hoping things would be easier when... after... once... I'd be very, very rich indeed! I tried to outrun my OCD contamination by moving to new 'untainted' accomodation many, many times - only to get there and find that almost immediately the same sort of problems happened there too. It took me several decades to realise it wasn't down to the people I shared a house with, or the house, or that things had become contaminated there. The problem was my thinking. You take your thinking with you wherever you go. You can't outrun OCD. Sooner or later you have to stop running and face it. Instead of just thinking that once you get there it'll be 'clean and safe and I can start over'.... How about getting it into your head that once you move to this new place you'll stop running? Plan instead to challenge your thinking each time something at the new house starts to feel contaminated. Ready to try it?

What you're describing sounds like possible autism. OCD is very common in autism. Autistic minds l.ove structure and repetition and order and that's part of the neurodiversity, not a disorder. It spills ovedr into OCD when the rule-making is no longer comforting, but causes distress or anxiety. There are lots of books around on OCD and autism and how to adapt therapy if required. Have you read any?

Elias, asking this is a compulsion. You need to stop obsessing over the details of your OCD and you certainly shouldn't be focusing on the details of anybody else's OCD. Have you tried getting your mind onto other things yet? Are you spending much time practising not going into details of your OCD?

No worries there, Terry. All attendees to the webinars will be automatically off camera and muted . You can ask questions by typing in the chat box, but nobody but the presenter (Roz) and the host (Ashley) can be seen by anybody, so the rest of us don't need to worry about a bad hair day. Now that you've got a zoom account, should you ever decide to join an OCD-UK support group meeting you will need to remember to set your camera and microphone to on or off as you prefer. But no obligation either way. We have a monthly support group for the over 50s which is a small, friendly bunch of regulars (newbies welcome!) Next one is Wed 11th June at 6pm. You can register here if interested.

Remember to give yourself a few mins to log in as you now need to sign in to zoom each time you use it as well as being registered for it. (I often forget, then forget my password, and then turn up late!)

Hi @niireom and to the forums. What your GP said is shocking I get that the days of GPs being able to support or advocate for their patients with medical evidence letters has passed because of legal issues, but it sounds like he/she thinks 'everybody is a little bit OCD' which so undermines those of us who truly suffer with it. A diagnosis of OCD doesn't help as much as you might think, because despite many people being severely disabled by it for long periods of time it is a condition which can fluctuate in severity and it isn't considered permanent. How much does your OCD impact you? Will the 'reasonable adjustments' you request be significant, or do you think you could manage Uni even if they don't materialise? It's good news that the Uni has a disability support team! And even better that they are being positive about what you might need. Back in my day we just had to get on with it. I got less sleep and less partying than my friends because I needed the extra study time, but exams I just had to muddle through and hope it was enough. I think it's fabulous that they take these things into consideration now. Whatever happens, enjoy your Uni years!

Looking forward to it!

In my book, celebrity endorsement is a reason to steer as far clear as possible from whatever they're promoting. Yes, it gets used as a single dose medicine for anaesthesia. But mostly in the UK it's used by vets to anaesthetise horses...

Not true Handy. Even where people do have physical compulsions they tend to have even more mental compulsions than physical ones. Mental compulsions are, by far, the commonest form of OCD.

No, ERP can't make it worse. But if you hold onto the belief that doing ERP carries risk/danger or 'might cause irreversible damage' then you're going to seriously struggle to engage beneficially with any ERP you try to do. Challenge that belief (fear). And keep on challenging it, by ignoring any thoughts you get about making things worse/ irreversibility etc.

Yes. Totally normal for OCD.

It sounds like your therapist has slightly misunderstood how your OCD affects you. I'd say most people with OCD know they are a good person, but they are bothered by their intrusive thoughts because they fear being, or becoming, or being seen by others, as a bad person. Depends what it is about your thoughts that bothers you, but this slight shift in emphasis may help you to see that actually 'being bad' or 'doing wrong' is still at the heart of your obsessions, even though you are (happily ) totally certain of your own goodness and morality. A very important point however (which your therapist ought to know, and probably does know but just didn't word it well on this occasion) is that - the reason you have intrusive thoughts is that everybody gets them. Everybody. They are normal. People without OCD barely notice them and shrug them off with ease as meaningless random thoughts. People with OCD gets lots of intrusive thoughts that aren't related to whatever worries them, and they too barely notice these thoughts and shrug them off with ease as meaningless. But sometimes a person gets an intrusive thought and they notice it because it relates to something they value. Then they give it meaning. (I thought it therefore... OR Only a bad person thinks such thing... etc) Then they start to worry about it, obsess about it, notice those kinds of thoughts more and more often Then they start to do compulsions to try to counter or neutralise the thought, or to reassure themselves. If this obsessive thinking and compulsive behaviour is allowed to continue it becomes disabling - becomes a disorder. And that's what having OCD is. Noticing a random thought, giving meaning to it, obsessing, doing compulsive acts, and repeat... until it interferes with your life so much it has become a disorder. Therapy isn't something done to you. It's a joint effort. Teamwork. You and the therapist are equals in this team. Far from taking offence at being asked about the therapy, a good therapist will expect and welcome questions as part of the therapy process. So just ask!

Sorry, I get too used to using the terminology and sometimes forget to explain. Ruminating is the name for the 'going over it again and again' thinking we do in OCD. It's an attempt to problem solve that never gets any answers but just sends you round and round with more doubts and questions. It's a compulsion when you feel compelled to do it! Because OCD wants answers and hates uncertainty.

Hello and to the forums! An excellent goal. As NorthPaul says, you've actually nothing to forgive yourself for, but it can feel like you need forgiveness so it's an area worth working on with your therapist anyway. You say that OCD has put you on disability, so I assume you're not working at the moment. When we're in the worst grip of OCD just getting through the basics of a single day can be a big ask, but as you begin to recover another worthwhile goal is to find things to fill your day that bring purpose and meaning back to your life. This is an important part of rebuilding your self-esteem and enabling you to put the event(s) that 'ruined your life' into perspective. Don't wait until you're almost well again (or ready to go back to work) to start thinking about it. Get started on finding new purpose and meaning as soon as you can. Picture what 'being well again' looks like and work towards it, but also spend a little time picturing what 'being a bit bettter than now' looks like and make it a short-term goal to achieve that. OCD will always take over 100% of the space you give it, and will try to expand and take over more if you let it. So you have to be constantly pushing back, trying to shrink those boundaries - rather like running on a treadmill just to stay still! As part of that pushing back, actively seek out hobbies and interests to reclaim your time off OCD. Some days you'll feel too tired to take part, but other days you will surprise yourself just how much time you can get back from OCD. One day at a time, and one eye on the horizon.

You're still overthinking it. This entire quote is one long compulsive rumination. Making up your rules, and thinking about your rules, is all part of the same OCD behaviour. You've had great advice from @Roami Try putting it into practise before coming back with more 'yes but...' OCD-fuelled questions. If the sentence starts with 'But...' or 'What if...' then chances are it's your OCD doubt seeking reassurance rather than a new, as yet unanswered, question.