snowbear

What you're doing is more like condemning them as murderers, having them sentenced to life imprisonment without a trial, and then turning up at the prison every day to whip them in person. Extreme, eh? But that's what you're doing to yourself. You even need to ask?? Of course you can just let it go. Letting it go is a normal human response too. But... (Well, you come back with a 'but' every time so I thought I'd try it too ) But, even though you've had the reassurance and the explanations and the logic and the reasoning and been told over and over that you're allowed to let it go... You then have to decide that's what you're going to do. Make a stand. Draw a line under it and from that moment on refuse to return to it. We can advise and reassure until the end of time, but (there I go again ) we can't let it go for you. At some point you have to decide to do that bit for yourself. And then stick with that decision. Refuse to return to it no matter how compelling the temptation.

Well, yes. It is. And besides, at some point you have to let it go. (Or stay stuck in this OCD cycle forever.) Maybe you just need to be miserable for longer, until you feel that you've punished yourself enough. Not for a moment suggesting that's what you should do! Quite the opposite. But it's what you are doing - punishing yourself. Creating guilty feelings and returning to it again and again even though you know (at least on some level) that you can let it go.

It's interesting isn't it? How on the one hand you know absolutely and without a shadow of doubt that you would never agree to a blasphemous thought. Never. End of. Yet on the other hand you keep asking 'But what if it's true? What if I did agree?' And you're equally certain that you have to keep thinking it over until you know for certain that it's not true - the very thing you already know with absolute unshakeable certainty! So this isn't about 'needing to know'. You already know - 100% certain, you would never - in your heart or soul - never ever agree to such a thought. We can't prevent words passing through our heads. We hear the words around us, other people saying things we disagree with, all the time. We can't stop the words 'echoing' in our heads and we hear that 'echo' in the same way we hear our deliberate thoughts. When you're well you're able to recognise it for what it is - just words in your head and not reflective of you or the way you feel. So you'd shrug it off without hesitation. But a bit like something catching your eye so you stop and do a double-take, in that moment you paused and thought about the words in your head. It gave you an extra split second to analyse the 'echo' and decide that if it had been your own thought the consequences would be catastrophic. So catastrophic that you took extreme safety measures 'just in case' ... and you reacted as if it was your own thought instead of shrugging it off as an echo of something your brain had registered in passing from the outside world. So now you need to accept you misheard yourself, or got it wrong when you paused to do the double-take. However you want to put it. Instead of trying to 'work it out' so you can 'let yourself off the hook' or 'be forgiven' you need to stop again and do a third take. This time label it correctly as an 'echo' of words that could never come from your heart or soul. Because you never would. Not even in a moment of frustration. It's simply not who you are or part of your moral code. When you can see that there was never any need for that 'just in case' reaction, then you can let it go. Does labelling it an 'echo' from the outside world help? Instead of calling it 'a thought' (which keeps suggesting to you that you are responsible for it and therefore guilty.) Trust what you already knew before this started. Trust what you've always known with the deepest conviction your whole life. Don't waste any more time trying to find an OCD answer you feel you can trust. Another way to think of those words echoing is like a snippet of an irritating song that you heard on the radio and now can't get out of your head. (An earworm they call it.) Just because you keep hearing the lyrics doesn't mean you wrote them. Doesn't mean you 'agree' with the song or want to keep hearing it. With that there's no perceived consequences other than irritation, no catastrophic moral wrongdoing to humming along. So you'd shrug it off and get your mind onto other things until the annoying song snippet faded away. This is exactly the same. It keeps troubling you because you keep on humming the same tune instead of letting it go. Relabel it as an echo or an earworm. Ditch the guilt. Refocus. And get on with your life.

I know! And I so want one. I'd use it a lot!

What you describe is pretty common. People sometimes even bring up some 'catastropic' OCD worry to distract them from the minor worries of everyday life. It can be a perverse coping mechanism (an avoidance compulsion in disguise.) Then the guilt of not worrying about 'routine' risks becomes yet another stick to beat yourself with. Label both the initial worry and the 'worry-about-not-worrying' as OCD. Then disengage from any further thoughts on the matter and try to get on with your day. You've had 3 years in remission - yay! And you're coming out the other side of this episode - Yay! So don't go back to old behaviours of over-thinking it and raking up the past just for something to ruminate over. Find something productive to keep you occupied and focus on living your life in the here and now.

Yes. The annual conferences have been held online since Covid, but this year it's going back to the in person style. I believe it's going to be just 1 day (rather than the usual 2 day event) as we don't know what take-up will be like on tickets after several years 'away'. There's usually a chance to socialise after the presentations end, and of course you might find others who are going want to go out for the evening afterwards, or whatever people decide together that they want to do. I see you're a paid up OCD-UK member, so keep an eye on the Members Section (bottom part of the forums) as any updates will be posted there first.

Writing is a great idea. No need to worry about concentration or getting sentences right - just get your thoughts down on paper (or screen) What kind of writing do you like? Keeping a journal kind of thing, or creative stoty-telling, or what?

Hi, breakfree. I'm sorry to see you're struggling so much at the moment. You've had a variety of good suggestions, especially from Paul, about doing something to else to keep your mind busy - it really does help to reduce the ruminating (and the misery that being caught in that rumination cycle brings.) You mentioned self-confidence issues and social anxiety, but perhaps you could pick up the phone and chat to a family member or friend? Social contact is very important in mental wellbeing. The more you isolate yourself the more time your brain has to feed the OCD. You say you did well before with CBT, and that it was stress that caused this relapse. So have you tried any relaxation exercises, or meditation, or stress-busting measures? Sometimes the most stressful thing of all is feeling like you're not in control. So simply taking a deep breath and taking charge of small things you've been putting off can give you a boost of energy and confidence. What else do you think would help?

Just an update on this: the venue and exact date later in the year is still to be confirmed. Ashley will let us know as soon as he knows for certain.

That we can certainly give you, and with absolute confidence that it doesn't matter and religion based is no different to any other topic when its OCD. Please try to put this behind you now and let it go. Holding onto it is only hurting you and nobody - earthly or otherwise - wants that.

I'm sorry to hear you're in hospital @ocdsufferer85 I hope whatever the ailment is that you get better soon. You're stuck in this cycle of rumination because you're hoping to answer question in your mind, rather than accept it doesn't need answered. You had a thought - means nothing. You reacted in frustration - not significant. But you've convinced yourself that it has meaning and is very significant to your beliefs. It is that idea that is making you feel so bad, not what you did or what you might have agreed to in your head. How can we help you to see that this is all OCD and can be safely dismissed as nonsense? What will it take to convince you?

I'm truly glad you're finding out how much self-compassion helps @Tired20 We do indeed all need compassion, and often a virtual hug I wish you all the best with your therapy and hope that through it you reach a place of resolution, growth and inner peace as you continue your journey to recovery and through life.

The OCD-UK conference is coming up in November. I'll check the dates and venue with @Ashley and get back to you.

It often does. If you are the victim of any kind of abuse it is something you may wish to discuss with your therapist.

Nonsense. That's twisted OCD thinking. Thoughts do not have the power to do anything. You can safely shrug them off and ignore them and nothing bad will ever come of it. Typical twisted OCD thinking, convincing you to keep worrying. Let it go. True or not, real or not - a thought is just a thought. Anybody can experience a thought about anything and it means nothing. You can even deliberately think 'bad thoughts' and nothing bad will come of it. Thoughts do not have magical powers to make things happen.

Hi jpico and welcome to the forum. It's all OCD. Resist the urge to keep asking him for reassurance about it, and practice not engaging with the doubts when they arise in your mind.

*****DO NOT FLUSH BABY WIIPES DOWN THE TOILET***** There's a risk they'll block your toilet, but far, far more devastating is the harm they do to our rivers. Maybe you're not aware just how much sweage gets released into rivers untreated? As in every time it rains the UK water companies just let everything go straight into rivers or the sea with absolutely no filtering or treatment whatsoever. If anybody does resort to using baby wipes as a compulsion to avoid using toilet paper, they should be aware that it creates more problems than it solves as you'll then need to (bag and) pocket the dirty wipe. Surely that's worse than getting a drop of urine on your hands - which you then wash anyway.

Compulsions never solve OCD problems. As you've discovered the OCD justs morphs so that the compulsions you did before are no longer enough. This will keep happening, even to your rule-based structured compulsions. This attempt to set rules around your compulsion is in itself also a compulsion. Case in point. OCD always finds a way to make you think you need to do more compulsions. Trick is not to engage with these thoughts. Another compulsion. Everything you're describing is just standard OCD with standard compulsions in response. You need to learn to recognise an OCD thought and deliberately choose not to engage with it. Shrug it off as 'just a thought'. There's no need to perform any kind of compulsion or ritual to prevent bad happening. Thoughts do not have magical powers.

Nope Yup

Interesting that you heard a sarcastic tone, Garfield. What I heard was Handy being supportive and encouraging, just stating facts in his usual literal-factual way. Once again a reminder to us all that how we interpret things can be influenced by where we're at in our own heads and how we ourselves are feeling at the time. Especially so when we're maybe feeling fragile or vulnerable. And can also depend on how well we know the other person. And again, a reminder that if there's something we don't understand in a reply we can either ask for clarification (as KC rightly did) or we can let it go without worrying what that one person meant. This is fabulous, KC! I hope I don't sound condescending when I say this is the most 'adult' and mentally together I've ever heard you talk. Keep thinking and acting this wayand your life will feel much better in no time.

I know the NHS is in crisis and GP surgeries are really overworked and under-staffed, but that's no excuse. I'[m really sorry you've experienced that response from your GP. It's really hard not to just give up hope when faced with such obstacles, but please keep fighting to get what you need. Even in these dire times, the help is out there. It's just sometimes harder to access.

Flipping heck!! You're very gracious saying that it's not the GPs fault but that's pretty unforgiveable on 2 counts. However clueless the doctor is on the ins and outs of OCD they still ought to know the dose of any medication they're prescribing, and in particular the maximum dose. As for prescribing diazepam as any kind of solution when there has been a medical practitioner awareness policy in place for 30 years that benzodiazepines should only ever be prescribed as a last resort, at lowest possible dose and for a short time only - since when did 'try this first' become a 'last resort' option? !! Is there another GP in the practise you could ask for a referral from? Or how about contacting NHS Talking therapies direct? Especially as you did so well with CBT intervention before. (Well done, you ) Have you tried any anti-anxiety techniques alongside the OCD-CBT techniques? What about simple relaxation, meditation and relaxation exercises? I'm not suggestion it would be 'the' solution, but every little helps.

That's a really helpful summary, @mithrandir Thank you for sharing it. And well done for making and maintaining such good progress!

@Angst is right. It is a compulsion. Actually it's exactly like handwashing - you can't get away from having to wash your hands, but you can stop the compulsion of washing for hours. Breathing compulsions are exactly the same. You can't avoid breathing completely, but you can stop the compulsive part of it - the shallow breathing to avoid polluted air, and the choice to focus on your breathing rather than to think about something else. I'd start with trying to change your perception about the air. Change your internal dialogue where you're telling yourself the air is polluted and dangerous to something more normal eg. 'I can smell something bad, but it will dissipate soon. I'll just keep breathing normally and it'll be fine.' Then refocus onto something else so that your breathing is back on autopilot. I don't think 'breathing exercises' help. When I got compulsions around my breathing I tried doing slow breaths, shallow breaths, deep breaths, counting as I breathed... All of it just kept the cycle of feeling like I was suffocating going for longer. I'd lie on my bed for hours struggling to breathe notrmally. The only thing that worked was to switch focus away from breathing completely and think about something else. That will be much easier to do if you stop reinforcing your fear with thoughts like 'The air is polluted, it's dangerous, I need to avoid breathing it any more than I have to.' Remember that kind of self-talk is a compulsion too.