FYD

OCD is a chronic condition. Reckon religion is too. Seems I like I will be stuck with this all my life. No win situation. If I lean towards atheism the world seems like a dark place and life ultimately pointless. If I learn towards some sort of religion it aggravates my OCD no end.

Sounds like you're an atheist. Whilst both religion and OCD can seem like superstitious thinking errors there are billions of people on this planet who believe in an interventionist God. I believe the chances of God existing and taking a dim view of me being stingy and ungrateful are quite realistic.

I'm in my forties and have had OCD all my adult life. About 9 years ago I decided to fight back and although it has been tough I have made a lot of improvements, especially with the superstitious stuff like planes falling out of the sky etc if I don't do a ritual. I still have problems checking for real dangers though like is the gas off, did I lock the house, and ruminating over driving like did I overtake that cyclist safely and remembering if lights I went through were red. During this time I have looked into religion (mostly Christianity), read books and attended courses and church services. I'm not a Christian. Mostly agnostic really but with some values based on Christianity due to indoctrination from school years ago. Seems to me half of the bible is full of **** and that religion is largely man made superstition and used to control people. Just that I believe that there is probably more to existence than just this universe and that God a possibility. Also like the idea of an after life. Problem is reading and watching religious material, and recent deaths of loved ones, has all turned into scrupulosity. The reason of this post is to do with money and donations, as in if I nearly loose something important, like my wallet, I feel like to thank God for my good fortune I should donate some money. The thinking goes something like this, "Forgot to secure my wallet. I nearly lost £50." "I should donate something to charity like a fiver or something." "Fiver is nothing compared to the £50 I could have lost." "If I don't perhaps God (who probably exists, I can't take the risk of being wrong) will punish me or teach me a harsh lesson for being ungrateful." This has got steadily worse. For example a few months ago I left my zip coat pocket unzipped and temporarily put my wallet in it because my hands were full. When I remembered about my wallet 30 seconds later I'm thinking thank you God, it could have fell out. Then I think about the £150 holiday money in it. Then some arbitrary percentage comes into my head like 10% (probably some OCD derived value). Then I think "God, I really don't want to donate £15!". But if I don't, and I want to pray for help for a sick relative or pet, he will turn his back on me. One way around this is to become an atheist but I just can't do it. I must be too childish or something.

Your in my thoughts. Your almost like me but you have the bottle to do anything. "Every now and then girls seem to show interest and make some form of approach... sometimes I even (get to) speak to them (which is pretty amazing). " I don't "speak to them" if they are strangers and they certainly don't "show interest and make some form of approach". You've still got time. I'm 36. I give myself another 4 years before I go down to Ian Coley Gunsmiths and enquire about shot guns. All I can say is carry on and just play stastics. Sooner or later something will happen (in theory).

Not sure if I ever will go. Being there seems like being in a refuge camp. It would drive me demented. Still, I like these bands, Snoop Doggy Dog Plan B Gorillaz Seasick Steve Flaming Lips Pet Shop Boys Ray Davies Rodrigo Y Gabrielia Orbital and I guess a few others that never was broadcasted.

Yeah I know. I left it too late due to indecission and they sold out. I was outside the room trying to find ticket touts. :blushing:

How to Treat Depression debate This is a sort of transcript of the talk "How to Treat Depression" at the Cheltenham Science Festival which I attended. The main theme is the best ways of treatment and focuses a lot on whether antidepressent drugs are effective. I thought it was rather a really good discussion and one of my favourites. My write up can't really do justice to the discussion but I'll try anyway. In attendence Robert Winston - chair Iona Heath - GP Irving Kirsch - author of "The Emperor's New Drugs" Hamish McAllister-Williams - physcopharmacologist and consultant psychiatrist Introduction The discussion starts with introductions and an overview of what depression is and the devestating effect it has on people. Dr Iona Heath She talks about how difficult it is to define depression. Where does it start as in what point does it go from unhappiness to depression. She says that pharamacuitical companies have been widening the definition of depression. It's in their interest as they sell more drugs. She says prescribing drugs are not helpful for everybody. Medication never really solves the problem but for some people it is a life saver, particulary reduces suicides. It helps people make life better but for more poeple it does more harm than good. She is an advocate of CBT and talking therapy and improving peoples lives through social justice. Irving Kirsch Irving talks about recent studies that say antidepressent drugs don't work. 40% of studies are not published. Studies show 37% improvement with drugs and 30% just with a placebo. Irving goes on to say that the extra 7% is stastically significant but not clinically significant on all but the most severe cases. Only worth while for 10% of people over a placebo sugar pill. Irving says depression is not caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain. Various SSRI's, NDRI's, SSRE's that enhance neurotransmission result in a small improvement. Yet so do placebo's and tranquilisers which actually reduce neurotransmission. Irving ends by asking how should depression be treated. He says the effect of exercise is a bit better than placebo. Exercise doesn't have negative side effects but has lots of positive side effects including better physical health. He recommends CBT and that 10 - 20 weeks is on par with antidepressents and placebo. Dr Hamish McAllister-Williams He is a doctor who treats the small amount of cases that are severe enough to be hospitalised. He agrees that drugs on there own are not the answer but he is very for them. He shows a lot of statistical graphs that goes against Irving's findings. Some are quite convincing but are generally more harder to understand, especially when he gets to discussing antidepressents versus active placebos and meta analysis. Hamish agrees with Irving that depression is not to do with a chemical imbalance in the brain. That idea was in the 1960's and said that if any of his students said these things in their exams they would get failed. He still says the drugs work in more severe cases. Hamish goes on to the genetic side of things. People with more major stressful life events are more likely to be depressed. People with certain genes have more stressful life events. He mentions 5-HT and that it looks like certain genes causes depression and therefore shows that it is a biological problem. He says these drugs are a life saver as has stopped people commiting suicide. NHS NICE has made extensive inquires into the evidence which is why he recommends them and prescribes them, along with CBT. Hamish says drugs are useful in that some cases are so severe that CBT can't be done effectively because some people can be too depressed to communicate with the therapist properly. He goes on to comment about Irving comments about exercise. Hamish says there can be negative side effects with exercise such as joint ache, muscle strains and such. Also it is very hard to motivate somebody who is depressed to do exercise. Iona says that exercise might release dopomorphines but that depressed people find it hard because they tend to be isolated and don't have the social or relationship support. Questions The session ends by lots of good questions from the audience chaired by Robert Winston. Here is a couple of questions and comments made by members of the audience. Audience member : I do the same job as Hamish. Don't stop using the drugs (refering to Irving) and don't cause something like the MMR vaccination scandal. Audience member : Can diet improve depression? Iona says not as a faddy diet. She says that diet has not much of an effect except for increasing mood with comfort eating. She didn't say anything about weight increase could be a problem but she did mention alchol. The small short improvement in mood is not worth the negative effects of alchol. Audience member : Mentioned MRI scans which indicate the drugs are working. Audience member : She mentioned that Electro Compulsive Therapy improved her father but changed him. Hamish says it can be useful but is not really understood that much. Audience member : A health care professional corrected Irving about the waiting lists for CBT. (Irving is an American and doesn't really know about the post code lottery we have here. I remember the sharp intake of breath by the audience when he sort of implies that getting access to CBT only takes a few weeks). Iona says that CBT is done on the cheap here. Just the basic CBT done on physcology graduates. She adds that social effects are a huge problem. She only dishes out drugs if will be of benefit. It frustrates her that she prescribe drugs to someone where really the best thing for that person would be to move out of the grotty council flat she lives in. Iona believes in a progressive tax system and to flatten the tax burden, as in other countries. Iona also mentions that CBT tends to be offered more to white people where more antidepressents are given to black people. Something is not right and its sick. Also comments that there are more women diagnosed with depression but more suicides with men. Robert ends the talk in his ususual plesant manner and quips that we are being thrown out. Irving is off to his book signing and Iona and Hamish is going into the Talking Point tent by the cafe. The after debate discussion actually ends up with the speakers talking individually to groups. Well that's it from my notes and memory. Nothing was mentioned about OCD even though the same drugs are prescribed. I couldn't really think of any OCD questions to ask in relation to this debate.

Just to say hi again. I haven't posted for about 6 months (might have done one drunken post during the winter). I'm not cured by a long shot but I am going through a good spell (I think). I have been too busy to visit this forum. Visiting this forum takes a while to read things. Maybe reading this forum each day was a compulsion. Maybe skipping it is a form of avoidance. Bah! Who knows. But I have been busy studying, reading and writing up notes. This was not a compulsion, things I wanted to do for months but OCD seeped in as always. Reading is such a struggle. Took twice as long than I'd hoped. Anyway, I have not forgotten about this place, nor will I ever will. I would have posted this in the free for all or something but although have renewed my membership it don't seemed to have registered yet. Best wishes. :hug:

A day after Boxing Day I come to the conclusion that everythings happens because of Gods will. Therefore that he give me OCD and my other limitations. I called him nearly every obsenity under the sun. I feel nthat I am cut off and don't now what to do. Religion feels like a lot to OCD to me! I don't know if God is a product of my OCD imagination or is angry with me. Either way I am ****ed!

Well I feel ugly because I feel I am ugly and have felt this way seem since puberty, Mah!

Part of the probem is that you are so busy thinking of what to say is that you don't hear "free information" that can be used to open new avaenues / lines of conversation. (this is comming from someone who is **** scared of women)

Hello, I've been trying to renew my membership but it is not easy. I have tried all my usual user names / passwords to no avail but I can't find a link (or one that works anyway). One day it will be sorted. Anyway, just hope everybody is OK. I have been away for 3 months but will NEVER forget this place. I have been busy doing stuff. It is a bit confusing because the OCD stuff overlaps with stuff I want to do and it is very time confusing. Anyway this is aimed at the Centeral Perk forum if I can log in - How is every one?

Thanks for the posts. I would have replied yesterday but I was reading Richard Darwkins The God Delusion which I agree with 90%. Last night at Alpha was about healing which I was deeply sceptical about. There was talk about miracles and I'm thinking why don't they prescribe them on the NHS? Socialy it was a good evening as I had a number of converstations with different people, some I didn't expect.