Challenging people

[gingerbreadgirl]

I am training a new member of staff at the moment, and a very important part of the job is being extremely careful about tiny details. The guy is really nice and we've developed a good rapport; however one thing that really grates on me is whenever I say anything about being careful/accurate he says, 'don't worry, I'm really OCD.'

With him being new (and we need him much more than he needs us), it's really important to me that we maintain the good rapport we have. But at the same time I want to challenge him - in a way that won't seem defensive or prickly or whatever. We have been looking for someone for this job for a long and we really want to keep him!

What would you guys do? Would you challenge this sort of language?

[Jedi Master Scarface]

Well, tbh someone somewhere would find it a bit offending. I'm okay with it myself but who knows with other people. Maybe to deal with it, try being off the cuff with it. If he says it again, just casually remark that some people might find that use of the word OCD in that type of statement as a bit upsetting and just try to avoid using such language. But then go onto another subject after that. It isn't the biggest thing to change, just a minor phrase that can be encouraged to drop. No need to be harsh with dealing with it, there can be positive criticism.

[gingerbreadgirl]

Thanks Jedi Master (great username, btw ) you're right, just a casual comment rather than turning into a big thing is best. just not sure exactly how to bring it up. I know he doesn't mean anything by it - he's just using what he sees is a jokey term - part of me thinks I should just leave it, it just really grates on me every time he says it!

[Jedi Master Scarface]

Just wait for him to say it again, then be like "ok, but I must warn you, some people may be upset by your use of the word OCD like that so be mindful of how you talk to others. You can never be too careful with these types of things, you don't always know how someone will react to it". Then just go past that and move onwards, basically a nonchalant waiting game. Hopefully he learns to not do that.

[gingerbreadgirl]

good advice, thank you x

[Guest Saz]

I would just leave it, I always say it's not what you say it's how you say it. He obviously isn't meaning any harm, I'm sure he'd probably be mortified if he knew....and also what's not to say he actually doesn't have ocd and that's his way of making light of it for him

[gingerbreadgirl]

I see what you're saying - and I would never want to make him feel badly about it - but I do think this kind of language in general can be harmful to OCD sufferers and if we don't challenge it no one will.

[taurean]

I wouldn't challenge it with him under the especial circumstance right now of looking to build that professional relationship personally and with the business, as that s clearly important.

But later, if he carries on with such statements, then it might he sensible to do a bit of OCD awareness .

As you know GBG I talk to a lot of people about OCD, and always do it from the point of view of explaining how OCD works.

So if you go about it that way, he will realise himself that such remarks could be offensive, without the need to actually take him to task!

Safer and should not cause any friction or upset.

Edited June 18, 2015 by taurean

[gingerbreadgirl]

Thanks Roy, really good advice. I would never want to make him feel bad or 'tell him off' but I do think it's important to change the way people see OCD. It's important because the longer people see it as a jokey illness - even a positive affliction - the harder it will be for people to seek help.

[taurean]

I agree.

But this way he wont feel taken to task and it should turn out fine.

Edited June 18, 2015 by taurean

[gingerbreadgirl]

I agree.

But this way he wont feel taken to task and it should turn out fine.

As always you make perfect sense Roy

[Caramoole]

Does he/your other work colleagues know about your OCD?

[Enjay]

Maybe the next time he says it you could phrase your reply as something like, "Oh, have you seen someone for it? / seen your GP for it?" ( in a casual tone, not a blunt or harsh tone ). Or maybe casually ask if they want to talk about it and say that you're willing to offer support to them if they would like. Then they'd be in a position where they know that you know about and take OCD seriously and would also have to confirm if they were just joking or not and then you could go from there without having sounded confrontational.

I've had people say that kind of thing in front of me before and just thought how ironic it was that I was stood right there during what they were saying, but when it's just the odd one off I know that they're not properly talking about the actual condition, just something that reminds them a bit of it. If the same person kept saying it repeatedly though I could definitely see it getting grating because it might give others around them the impression that just being neat is genuinely what OCD is.

[Ashley]

I can't comment on your individual situation GingerBG because work can be tricky, so it needs to be your decision if you challenge and how, there are a few ways to do it I guess, but remaining smiley and friendly when you do it is the best approach as Beth talked about in the last Compulsive Reading. Most people are simply unaware that the comment is inappropriate and 99% of people will be happy to be educated on the matter and take it on board, certainly that's the charity's experience from the Nottingham project.

My next comment is more generic, based off a couple o0f other comments on the thread. but I am not wanting to pressure you GingerBG because I know it can be tricky dealing with these things at work.

However, If we are to change perceptions and misconnections I believe we must always challenge such comments (in the right way of course). I wrote the editorial for the last Compulsive Reading where I touched upon we must always speak with one voice if we are to make gains. Just because a flippant OCD comments does not bother person A does not mean it won't bother person B. So if we are to make progress in making people understand the severity of OCD we do all need to continue to challenge inappropriate use of the OCD term, even if it does not bother us right then at that time.

[Legend]

Isnt new work place rules mean that you shouldnt make comments that could cause offense to others

educate is wise , i think GB

[gingerbreadgirl]

Does he/your other work colleagues know about your OCD?

No. I have told my boss and one colleague that I have an 'anxiety disorder' but I stopped short of saying OCD, mainly, if I'm honest, because I was worried they'd think it was ridiculous... which I suppose kind of illustrates the point I'm making!

I would just like to point out I in no way would want to criticise him for what he said - it's a very common saying and I know he would never intend to offend - but as Ashley rightly says it's important to educate.

Very offensive language of all kinds used to be extremely commonplace, and a lot of that has been tackled and is now less widespread (such as racist slurs, homophobic language - lots of people use 'gay' as an insult, which is not meant homophobically but should we just let it slide?)

If we don't challenge things because they were not motivated by malice - where do we stop? Do we just let everything slide? Or do we try to educate?

It's a tricky one.

[Caramoole]

You could just say......."Oh, I'm sorry.....I didn't know you had OCD".......or "How long have you suffered from OCD?"

It would open the conversation and you could say "I have a friend with OCD".......or "I've done some voluntary work with a charity that supports people with OCD"

[Ashley]

You could just say......."Oh, I'm sorry.....I didn't know you had OCD".......or "How long have you suffered from OCD?"

Oh I like that suggestion, it immediately puts it back on the chap to have to say, I don't actually suffer.

[taurean]

For me folks this is an over-reaction.

We all want to educate people, but if this was just one off the cuff remark, then surely awareness education can wait until our two individuals have formed a closer working relationship?

Where is the fire?

I think my plan I suggested to ginger is good - and based on years of the psychology of being an agent and dealing with all kinds of persons involved in a transaction. I found it is always important to understand where another may be coming form, and seek to influence them in a way that, even if they might be wrong, their feelings would not be hurt since that could be very detrimental to the business in hand. In this case forming a good personal business relationship and encouraging him to want to work for the business seems, according to ginger, the over-riding result wanted right now..

I have found in that long, long experience that men are particularly like to get the hump in such circumstances.

E.g. I have some new spectacles. they weren't comfortable and kept slipping. I went back. A somewhat ferocious receptions made a couple of changes, told me so far as she was concerned they were right, and I felt not so. I told her that there is a rule of business - the customer is always right - and if he feels that way, the business should respect that view and explore in depth bhis issue. If he is then actually wrong, it should be explained why calmly and sympathetically.

She wasn't very sympathetic. Result - me angry and felt wrongly criticised and harangued. My position on this was NOT respected.

I went back today, she was not on duty. A charming lady immediately told me "if they don't feel right, they are not right" Hurray, that is correct!

She listened carefully, made some changes - checked the fitting several times, made a further correction on my suggestion and they seem fine. Result very happy customer - confidence in the business, which had been lost, now restored.

I rest my case. m'lord, m'lady .......

Edited June 19, 2015 by taurean

[Caramoole]

For me folks this is an over-reaction.

We all want to educate people, but if this was just one off the cuff remark, then surely awareness education can wait until our two individuals have formed a closer working relationship?

I personally agree with you...... but we aren't GB and if she feels strongly about it, I would use a bit of "innocent" reverse psychology to open a non-combative conversation

[gingerbreadgirl]

Hi all

This is a really interesting discussion and I wouldn't say I am particularly leaning either way.

Part of me feels that it is important to educate people and that this kind of language is particularly harmful when viewed at the society level rather than just the level of this individual guy. I hear this kind of thing constantly and I do believe it should be challenged, on the whole.

But another part of me is wary about damaging the working relationship we are developing and it being seen as an overreaction.

I think I will follow Roy's advice and leave it for now - but bring it up later if it continues being an issue.

Thanks all x

[Guest Saz]

I agree Roy. I think there is a difference between something being said maliciously and something being said in a harmless way. I get what the others are saying as in 'the bigger picture' and educating people but I perhaps we are more sensitive to this because that is the nature of this condition. So we could see it another way, 'I don't like what he said but it's harmless, he means no trouble and I won't let it bother me as really their is nothing to be too concerned about however if it becomes a big issue then I will speak up'

I hope that makes sense and of course this is just my opinion and it all boils down to how it makes us feel as individuals.

[Ashley]

For me folks this is an over-reaction.

We all want to educate people, but if this was just one off the cuff remark, then surely awareness education can wait until our two individuals have formed a closer working relationship?

Gingerbreadgirl needs to do what is right for her, and I will respect whatever decision she chooses to make.

However, I would challenge the debate being an over-reaction, because I believe challenging misconception is key to the work we do, and we don't have a right to challenge people like Channel 4 of getting things wrong, if we don't challenge others. Other charities have chosen to pick and choose who they discuss/challenge, and I believe we have to challenge at every opportunity if are are to force change, be that the man in the street, to the guy on Twitter last week to a work colleague.

In this case, whilst the term used was clearly not meant with any malice, I believe we still have to challenge otherwise nothing will change, the person will continue to use the term ignorant of the fact he is using it inappropriately.

For the record, the comment would not have personally bothered me either, but with my charity head on I have a belief we should initiate a conversation with such people.

[taurean]

In this case however, with a business and psychology hat on , I do not think the time to challenge is now.

It should be easy enough to return to the subject later, unless the man repeats the matter - in which case it would be right to raise the matter in a diplomatic non-aggressive , wishing to inform and educate way. That should not cause sny unintended offense.

Edited June 19, 2015 by taurean

[gingerbreadgirl]

I would just point out that he's said it repeatedly - it wasn't a one time remark.